Where did you get your info about Rondo. It is totally wrong. I follow the Celtics closely and Doc. wanted Rondo traded last year. Don't forget Doc. picked CP3 and left Rondo. That's when they almost came to blows. It gave Rondo a clear notice that Rivers prefers not to be with him. Also, Rondo is highly turnover prone. I made that point also. I am not talking about Kobe and Jackson.
I was reponding to Clutch's statement that we need PG with a low turnover rate, good defense and playmaking skills. Rondo does not have a low turnover rate, You are right that many top PG's have high turnover rates. That's because they push the envelope, and run hard, and push the team hard. They are in the thick of things trying to run the offense.
Westbrook is very high, in the top 5. Curry's is also high. D Will was the highest in 2012. Guys with the ball that make things happen and that tend to get high assists will turn the ball over as well. Steve Nash also turned the ball over but he was a magnificent PG. Lin's TOs are down from last year so there's improvement but he may play a style of basketball where he has a relatively high amount and if he takes it upon himself to play PG, because McHale isn't enforcing that, he'll get his assists as well. But it'll help if guys make open 3 pointers, that's where a lot of easy assists come from.
Clutch described Beverley when his 3 is working I'm not hung up on TOs myself and I like that Lin gets steals and sometimes big steals at big times in the game. That's like taking a TO away in a sense.
The problem on this team is we have 2 of those guys. Not 1 but 2. Two very high turnover guys. And they are basically using almost every possession.
And add Dwight who will turn it over quite a bit too when he's used in the post. However, look at Wade and LBJ's TOs. I know, different caliber of players, but they have quite a lot. http://stats.nba.com/playerGameLogs.html?PlayerID=2548&pageNo=1&rowsPerPage=25 http://stats.nba.com/playerGameLogs.html?PlayerID=2544&pageNo=2&rowsPerPage=25
my ONLY concern about rondo. He would get many open looks, knowing that most wouldn't feel comfortable with him shooting is a hard point. But he can drive, i'll take the pump fake and drive to the basket for a two, or swing the ball to a better shooter.
Yes, that is very true. Good catch by you. Our 2 primary superstars are high turnover guys and they're going to have more usage than anybody. When you throw Lin in the mix too...it's too much...too many turnovers. Now...if either Lin or Harden dialed it back, slowed down just a smidgen, and was a little less agressive, then they could get a handle on their turnovers. But Harden for sure ain't gonna dial it back. And Lin has been encouraged over the last season and a half to get more aggressive. And there you have it.
Anyone have any stats of our high TOs winning percentage? I know we had one really low TO game and abysmal offense in that game, an L. Can't remember which game it was, but we had no offense going at all.
We stress 3pt shooting from PG position right now because Harden handles the PG duties a lot. But if we do get Rondo, he would be the primary ball handler and Harden can hopefully be happy playing without the ball in his hands much. In that case, we don't need 3pt shooting from PG as much, so Rondo should do just fine.
here comes where the problem is. you dont hold the two stars accountable for their TOs, instead you sweep the problem under the rug by bench the 3rd guy, the playmaker with the same TO problem. now those 2 stars gonna keep TO the ball and you got a low TO Bev with nothing on offense. then you find out it's 4v5 on offense and they double team your star more often and they got more TOs. then you find out you need another guy to fill in the playmaking roll to create something otherwise your offense is horrible. here comes Parsons, a 6'9 guy playing PG roll, he certainly will TO a lot. now you get more TOs than before and wonder what's wrong. Exactly like the twin tower "experiment", sounds good but it's fool's gold.
how is this about the pg situation? if Harden would just try and defend the Rockets wouldve won against the Kings. when someone named McLemore and Thorton is going off on you and the dude avgs 8ppg on .37fgpct you know something is wrong defensively. open putback dunks in the middle no box outs open threes we could go on all night. just watch the tape in the first and look at Harden and youll see what i mean.
That's life. If you are different from mainstream's expectations of what a professional basketball player should look and act like, then to be included, you must be perfect in order to be considered average. Just like if you want to be part of a group of WASPs then you must be more" WASP then them in order to be considered an honorary WASP. Such is the culture here in the US. Still clogged in the 1970s. But let's get to the point. Harden is a super talented basketball player and can score at will at any given situation. But Michael Jordan and Kobe Bryant he is not. He is more in the mold of Melo. Both are very talented and can score 40+ points any nights. Both of them lacked that je ne sais quoi that can elevate their teammates to higher levels. If you look at past champions, most of the teams have someone who had Kobe/Jordan type of leadership and passion to some degree. Harden is like a high end equipment that do specific tasks at a very high level. Other equipment must be made to conform to this high end equipment will not result in a championship. Usually, equipment must conform to a specific plan or group passion in order to achieve that. That's why Harden is so valuable being the 6th man in OKC because he can come in as a specialized weapon to do what he does best. But to use him as the main player of a franchise, you are going the NYC route. Not going to happen. You think Presti was dumb enough to let go of Harden for Martin and Lamb because of salary caps? I doubt it. It was more than that. To get to the point, I think this teams need to grow for the next 2 years as a team, get a real coach, convince Harden to humble down a few notches and let the PG dictate the pace of the game. I feel Lin can do this if he is allowed to make mistakes, learn and grow. He should be quite good by next year. Or trade for an off the shelf PG that can contribute immediately at a high level.
Harden will always be a Robin type player unless he improves his defense and leadership skills. And Howard is no batman.
Pull it up and since you follow the Celtics so closely you would have heard Doc given Rondo his just due several times. I also said you don't know if this man would be a head case if he were to come here. Everybody knew that both Doc and Rondo were about to come to blows. Another thing the decided to cut ties with Rivers. They blew the thing up so that they could start the rebuilding process. I used Kobe and Jackson as another example of coaches and players not getting along. Very simple bro, you don't have to talk about them. Its called another example.
