TheFreak, you represent the UT fan (or Simms hater) who says "Simms sucks" after he completes a pass. Then after Simms completes a pass,you say "Simms got lucky, Major would have gotten more yards. Subtract the OU game, and Simms is a Heisman candidate. He's thrown 8 td passes in his last two games, despite being robbed ofa TD against CU. Major is 21-8 as a starter and he led us to ten td-less quarters two years ago. Major also went 18 of 42 against BU. He may throw a pretty ball, but he's never led us to the promiseland.
That's more of a reflection of the fans than Simms. WE've dominated at home this year. Simms has played excellent at home. 9 td's 2 ints............ Major is 21-8 as a starter with two 1st team big 12 players. If we would have lost this game to CU, the Major fans would be barking alot loudly. Instead the O controlled the ball and Simms ended up with 3 (should have been 4) td's and 0 ints. Sory Applewhite cultists....Simms ruined your fun. Hopefully, for your sake, UM can make Simms look like crap.
<B>Subtract the OU game, and Simms is a Heisman candidate. He's thrown 8 td passes in his last two games, despite being robbed ofa TD against CU. </B> Dude, say what you want about Simms vs. Applewhite, but there's no way in hell Chris Simms is a heisman candidate this year, with or without OU. For comparison, he's thrown more passes, fewer TDs, and 700 fewer yards than Rex Grossman. He's thrown the same number of yards as Ken Dorsey, in 80 more pass attempts. He's throwing for 220 yds / game -- those are simply never Heisman numbers, unless you're an Eric Crouch / Woodrow Dantzler and run for hundreds of yards as well. Some Chris Simms ratings (of the top 50 passers): Passing Attempts: 13th Passing Completions: 13th Yards / Game: 25th Completion %: 44th Yds/ Attempt: 50th TDs: 14th Rating: 46th Those aren't heisman numbers, whatever you do, especially if you take out OU and realize he hasn't faced any good teams except a Colorado team that is no longer ranked.
<B>Major is 21-8 as a starter with two 1st team big 12 players. </B> Simms is 8-3 (same ratio) with better talent at virtually every position, both offensively and defensively. <B>Sory Applewhite cultists....Simms ruined your fun. Hopefully, for your sake, UM can make Simms look like crap.</B> Why are Simms fans so threatened by people prefering another player? It amazes me how much "Simms fans" have to misrepresent and attempt to insult ("cultists?") others to make their argument.
Cat, did you post a message to CNN news on Saturday? They mentioned you had an email question. I was asleep partly, so I don't remember the question, but I I think it was like 1 am or something....anyway, I heard your name.
Shanna 8-3 record...where did this stat come from? I heard Simms had a 6-1 winning percentage when starting before the OU game..may have been a commentator mistake or I didn't hear a quailifier. Simms will be 9-3, then 10-3, then 11-3 and so on....I don't see Texas losing again with Simms at QB unless the defense gets horribly injured or Benson goes to NFL before him. Simms this year is 6-1. Applewhite has never had a record this good. I don't think its far to judge a player by stats generated when he wasn't ready. Also, I have no problem debating who is the better QB in the BBS, at a bar, at the stadium before the game. I love debating these things...especially when there is a case for the opposition. I have a problem hearing Major chants while the game hasn't been decided. 30 point lead is okay. If someone does this, I consider it to be rooting against Simms. Since Simms is on the field for UT, this would be rooting against UT. This is my view point. If Horns, with Simms at the helm, go undefeated for the rest of the season and wins the Bowl game, will you say Simms was the best man for the job this year? If Simms doesn't win out, barring freak developments (injuries,etc.), Simms will not be as good as I think he is.
Dude, say what you want about Simms vs. Applewhite, but there's no way in hell Chris Simms is a heisman candidate this year, with or without OU. The media does determine the winner, right? I know this isn't a perfect example, but did you watch Sportscenter the other night when they were doing their teaser before the commercial break about the Heisman moving from the Downtown Athletic Club? The lead in went like this: "Chris Simms may win the Heisman (photo of Simms throwing), but he won't be at the Downtown Athletic Club." Perhaps some people in the media realize that numbers aren't everything. Should Simms have been named starter this season? No. He has not done anything to deserve the starting job on the field. Well, he did come in during the last two games of the season last year, and looked better than any quarterback I'd seen all season, including Josh Heupel and Chris Weinke. Doing that against very good teams and dominating during spring practice should give him the heads up, imho. By the way, on Major, what exactly has he done to earn the job on the field? Don't tell me about his freshman year, or his sophomore year. He's had two surgeries since then, and to me wasn't the same player last year. What big games last year did Major win that earned him this kind of loyalty? OU? Wait... that was the game he started and we trailed 28-0 bfore he left. CU? Maybe... but we won by a much larger margin this year with Simms, and there's no question that this year's CU team is miles ahead of last year. A&M? That's Simms. Oregon? That's Simms too. (Simms and Texas did plenty to win the game, can't fault him for Roy and BJ dropping those passes) Cat, did you post a message to CNN news on Saturday? They mentioned you had an email question. I was asleep partly, so I don't remember the question, but I I think it was like 1 am or something....anyway, I heard your name. No, I didn't submit anything...
Simms didn't do anything Major could not do. Why not let Major have a chance to compete for the starting job? If he does bad (lack of mobility, arm strength) then put in Simms.
Sorry, I was traveling and just checked back in after the original post. It is interesting to see how this has played out. I think the thread comes down to a few basic points of contention. 1. "Major is the greatest QB in UT history." Uh....is that a big deal? My understanding is that Texas football history is one of the run aka the Tyler Rose. Refresh my memory if UT is actually QB U. 2. "Major has better stats." Major has had games where he looked lost and Texas lost because he didn't play well (assuming that you can hold the QB responsible as the pro-Major contingent does with Simms). And games where he had poor stats. Without being ON the coaching staff we can't really know WHY they are seemingly more conservative with Simms, but there is little doubt that the game plan IS more conservative. In addition, comparing stats can be REALLY misleading. Major played well with Ricky AND Ike - yes. But the order is important. Ricky first which means a lot Major's stats were against D's designed to stop Ricky, not Major. And Ricky allowed Major to get a good years experience under his belt with a pro style offense. Give Simms the same chance now that he has (seemingly) an emerging back (Benson). 3. "Major has won big games, Simms has not." Major didn't give UT a chance to win "it all." Solid regular season wins (although I think most will recognize Nebraska had a down year in one of those wins). I don't see what argument you can make for Major on this one. He had his shot as an 'non prototypical I'm-A-Winner" QB from the old school (or whatever it is that attracts you Underdog sympathizers out there). UT wasn't ranked where YOU...MR. UT FAN wanted. Period. Simms played well enough to win against Oregon last year and is getting better. The pro-Major contingent have not advanced ANY reasons for the games Major has lost. In fact, they've generally acted as if he hadn't ever lost. Why hasn't Texas gone undefeated with Major? No 'excuses' please. 4. "Major would have beaten Oklahoma." I WOULD like to see who thought the offensive line did a decent job in this game. I'm fairly confident that Major da Gimp would have taken a beating in that game. Has Major faced a defense of this caliber and won? Not sure about that one. Look what this D did to Chris Weinke, who is now throwing TDs in the NFL (and someone you might find descriptively comparable to Major - at least as some of you describe him - smart, winner, etc.). 5. Other considerations. Not much talk about this stuff. Simms gets UT in the media, print, TV, etc. Major did not. Simms puts a spotlight on the UT program. Not because he sucks but because he was the top QB coming out of high school, because he Dad is Phil Simms, and because he has all the tools to be a superstar QB in college AND the NFL. He was still in the Heisman running until the Oklahoma game even though his stats were mediocre. When Joe Badass RB is looking at schools to come to (hello Cedric Benson) the national exposure factor is huge. Simms = better recruits. It also means higher rankings/respect that they might not otherwise get. For years Texas fans have languished through blowouts (the bad kind) and big upsets (the good kind like Nebraska), but with Simms things are changing. Texas is in the news every week, they are in the preseason Top 5 (as high as 1), they are playing big games with real expectations that they can win it all. Isn' that nice UT fans? Did you like it better the other way? Do you remember a lot of national championship talk with Major? Simms gives UT the chance to take it to the next level.
By the way, what was that about Simms not being near good enough to contend for the Heisman? According to national voters (not Longhorn fans), Simms is one of the top 10 players in the country, and is a favorite for the Walter Camp Player of the Year Award. http://www.mackbrown-texasfootball.com/pages/releases/005/102401_01.html NEW HAVEN, Conn. -- Ten players were tabbed as favorites for the prestigious Walter Camp Football Foundation Player of the Year award and University of Texas junior QB Chris Simms (Franklin Lakes, N.J./Ramapo HS) is one of them, the foundation announced on Wednesday. Simms, who has thrown for 1,551 yards and 14 TDs (No.. 7 on UT's single-season chart) and run for four scores for the 6-1 and No. 7-ranked Longhorns this season, joins a list of favorites that includes eight quarterbacks and two running backs. "We're really excited that Chris was chosen as one of the top 10 players in the country," Texas head coach Mack Brown said. "I really think it is indicative of the progress he has made since he stepped in for the Kansas game a year ago. Hopefully, this will help him have the confidence to continue to play at the level he has all season." The award, which has been bestowed upon the nation's top player since 1967, is the fourth-oldest individual college football award in the country. The recipient is strongly viewed in the college football world as the favorite to capture the Heisman Trophy, which is awarded in December. Texas running back Ricky Williams claimed the 1998 WCFF Player of the Year en route to winning the Heisman Trophy. "I'm really excited to be considered one of the candidates for the Walter Camp Player of the Year award," Simms said. "It's one of the most prestigious honors that a player can be considered for and is a testament to how well our offense has performed this season. When you look at the list of players and the offensive teams that are up for this year's award, it is extremely flattering that we are listed to be among them." Walter Camp Football Foundation President Bernard Pellegrino stated that the Foundation annually honors the name of Walter Camp by selecting the premier player in college football along with selecting the nation's most time-honored All-America team dating back to 1889. Walter Camp, recognized as "The Father of American Football," introduced many innovations that brought about the evolution of the American style of football. In addition to Simms, the list leading candidates for the 2001 Walter Camp Player of the Year award includes quarterbacks Ken Dorsey of Miami (Fla.), Eric Crouch of Nebraska, Joey Harrington of Oregon, Rex Grossman of Florida, David Carr of Fresno State, Woody Dantzler of Clemson and Eli Manning of Mississippi. Northwestern senior Damien Anderson, a 2000 Walter Camp All-America selection, and UCLA standout DeShaun Foster are the running backs. Throughout the college football season, the Walter Camp Football Foundation will be conducting a fan opinion poll on their Web site at www.waltercamp.org. Also, the Walter Camp Player of the Year trophy will be part of an 11-game college football tour conducted by ESPN The Magazine. The Walter Camp Player of the Year trophy will be presented live during an ESPN college football broadcast at the end of the regular season. The Walter Camp Player of the Year award recipient and members of the 2001 Walter Camp All-America team will be honored at the organization's national awards banquet on Feb. 9, 2001, at the Yale University Commons in New Haven.
<B>By the way, what was that about Simms not being near good enough to contend for the Heisman? According to national voters (not Longhorn fans), Simms is one of the top 10 players in the country, and is a favorite for the Walter Camp Player of the Year Award. </B> Since when do awards matter? I would think winning the Big12 Player of the Year is a bit better that being a top 10 finalist for the Walter Camp. By the way, did you consider Hodges Mitchell a Doak Walker contender in his junior year? He also was picked as a "top 10 finalist" for that award... I didn't consider him a contender, and I don't consider Simms a contender. I will be shocked if Simms finishes in the top 5 of the voting. <B>Major has had games where he looked lost and Texas lost because he didn't play well (assuming that you can hold the QB responsible as the pro-Major contingent does with Simms). </B> The QB is only responsible for what he can do. If the offense scored 40 points and the team loses, that's not his fault. If he passes for 300 yards and no turnovers, but the team loses, that's not really his fault either (unless he makes dumb decisions in the process). Simms and Applewhite are similar in that respect -- neither can overcome a bad defense, and both can blow out teams. The only place there would be any difference in results would be close games. <B>The pro-Major contingent have not advanced ANY reasons for the games Major has lost. </B> Every game we lost with Major as the starting QB, we established little/no running game. KState 98 (his first start), TTech 98 (we actually still scored 40+ pts), NCS 99, KState 99, Neb 99, Ark 99, Stan 00, Okla 00. Not one of them did we establish any running game. If Simms is not responsible for Okla 2001 because there was no running game, then Major wouldn't be responsible for any of his losses either. The reason you don't hear Major fans constantly arguing that point is that Major fans aren't the ones making excuses for every loss. We simply see a better QB and think he should start. Comparing this team to previous teams is silly when the talent levels are substantially different. <B>Has Major faced a defense of this caliber and won? </B> (referring to OU) Yes -- Nebraska 98 (admittedly weaker than expected), Nebraska 99 (we handed them their only loss of the season -- most people thought they were better than VTech and should have faced FSU in the Fiesta Bowl). Has Simms won against a defense of this caliber? BTW, no one has said Major would have beaten Oklahoma. Some people think his decision making would have given us a better chance. <B>Not much talk about this stuff. Simms gets UT in the media, print, TV, etc. Major did not. </B> Seriously? We were a top 5 team last year, too. Major was mentioned as a preseason Heisman candidate last year. The national media believed Major to be the better player. <B>Simms = better recruits. </B> So Simms is responsible for our good recruiting? Interesting theory, given that our #1 recruiting class all signed before Simms was here. I'd give the coaching staff a tad bit more of the credit. <B>For years Texas fans have languished through blowouts (the bad kind) and big upsets (the good kind like Nebraska), but with Simms things are changing. </B> No, with TALENT ACROSS THE BOARD things are changing. How does Simms get credit for the best defense we've had in a decade? How does Simms get credit for the best special teams units we've had in years and years? The reason we are winning now is that our recruiting is paying off. The reason we are winning now is that we have more talent than any another in the nation. Most Major fans believe that unless Simms is BETTER than Major, Major should be starting because of the intangibles -- his experience and leadership, having been in and won big games, etc. As of yet, the best I've seen any Simms fans argue is that Simms is as good as Major (an argument that can be made). Unfortunately, that's not going to change anyone's minds.
I know Simms had a big influence on the big 3 committing to UT. I think he hosted all of them. I'm not saying his level of play influenced them, but he's a big name guy who dropped everything to play catch with these guys. I think he was the host to all 3 of them. Marquis Johnson (from Illinois) apparently had good things to say about Simms as well.
BTW, Simms does get alot of press. As poor or mediocre as his season has been (some have alluded to, I think he's played well), he's still a finalist for the Walter Camp award. DD Lewis is a Butkus finalist also. Damion Anderson, RB, Northwestern DeShaun Foster, RB, UCLA Joey Harrington, QB, Oregon Ken Dorsey, QB, Miami Rex Grossman, QB, Florida Eric Crouch, QB, Nebraska Eli Manning, QB, Miss. David Carr, QB, FSU Woody Dantzler, QB, Clemson Chris Simms, QB, Texas
My bitterness has subsided. I don't agree with Simms starting (how he got the starting job - damn politics) however its the coaching staff's decision. After listening to Longhorn Sportsline last night and reading Simms' chat transcript today, I'll only take shots at Mack Brown coaching inability. Who cares who plays QB as long as we win? That is what counts...right? **** Mizzou!!!
chris is the better player at this stage of their careers, im sorry i like major a lot and remember the shocker in lincoln, but every yr with him at the helm it was 8-4, 9-5 kinda season, good but thats unacceptable at UT, ill agree not all of it was his fault but why dont you let the numbers of simms speak for themselves, he did outstanding last yr when major went down. While i agree this situation shouldve been handled differently, if youre really going to sit here and rip chris simms based on his play this yr, id like to know what games youve been watching, because sans OU he has been nothing short of flawless in his first full opportunity as a starter. Trust me, last yr in that crazy rotation system he always had to look over his shoulder, thus it seems rational that he would press a bit and make mistakes. Im very pleased with simms development this yr and next yr granted we have a rough schedule i feel confident he can lead this team to the promise land Overall, i just get so sick of hearing major fans b****ing about a play which simms had no control, if you dont know they both are LONGHORNS, now i understand it comes out of the quest of the championship, but one should support both not ridicule them. Simms has had 1 yr as a starter, give him time before you decide major is still better, I think we all will end up happy. By the way, bensons the real deal and i thought i saw a blake from houston question in the chat-curious if it was you rocketman95.
