Totally agree with this analysis. I think some would argue that this is prematurely anointing Bynum as something he has not yet become, but that is not true. I think Yao is certainly the better player based on his proven body of work. But the argument that the two aren't even comparable is fallacious and is usually based upon the semantic pretext that he is "the best center in the game." the loaded value of that title gives it alot more weight than its reality. he's nothing more than an all-star caliber big man - no shame in that. bynum, by value, as a 7 foot athletic big averaging 17ppg over that stretch isn't far behind that level, especially considering he can't be rendered completely useless as Yao often has been in the past.
It's called a sarcastic remark to an opinion that I wholeheartedly disagree with. You keep stating that bynum is not too far from Yao and maybe better because he is NEVER a liability. you haven't really stated any supporting evidence to your "argument" and I'm making the point that if bynum really isnt that far from yao then why don't we trade him for bynum? Phil jackson would love to have Yao on his team. ANY coach would love to have Yao on their team. how can you NOT want a 7'6 center with a passing and shooting touch, capable of hitting the 3, capable of posting up, capable of mid-range jumpers, and around 80% ft shooter? can you say the same for bynum? at this point in his career?? believe me, I hate it when Yao commits careless fouls, or dribbles off his foot, or falls down, or has the ball stripped away by a 5'7 guard.. BUT he brings so many more positive intangibles to the game that just cannot be replaced by a regular role player big man like bynum. the only big men i would replace yao with is someone like Amare, Sheed, Brand, Garnett... and...nope.. bynum does not even crack that list imo.
Yao in the triangle offense with Kobe and Pau??? are you freakin kidding me?maybe he wont get as many rebounds as Bynum but the lakers will be beating every team by 30 or more. That is Phil Jackson's wet dream. You put Bynum in Yao's position on the rockets with T-mac injured and I seriously doubt we would've started that 22 game win streak. surround him with scrubs and the result will be quite different. Yao has the ability to make others better. Bynum as of yet lacks that ability. sorry durvasa. i really wanted this argument to end.
you said yao is a LITTLE better. which logically speaking, an aging player versus a young upcoming player who is almost as good as the aging player would be a more valuable asset for now and for the future. it's called reading between the lines. you stated that yao is still better BUT..... that is not very clear. thats a dam foggy statement. more of a "maybe" rather than an "emphatic". back to school with you then.
What makes you think Yao would thrive in a triangle offense? He had as much trouble as anyone last season adopting to Adelman's offense. Reading and reacting to defenses isn't instinctive for Yao. And, I think you vastly overrate his passing and shooting ability. Kobe and Gasol don't need a player to "make them better". They need a player who'll fill in a role and finish plays. I think Yao can do very well in that capacity, but he's not going to completely revitalize the Lakers offense. In case you forgot, the Lakers were a pretty damn good offensive team last year, as is.
i hate to argue a point, without providing sufficient evidence, but i remember a few articles of Phil Jackson talking about how ideal it would be for Yao to come to LA after his contract expired. And like the previous poster said, Phil made it sound like it was a "wet dream" of his. Phil has been quotes many times saying that Bynum should emulate Yao, in both his skills on the court and his work ethic. Oh and durvasa, I definitely respect your arguments. It's just that nothing will come out of arguing about it on this board. We're all rockets fans, and you're not going to convince a whole lot of people that Bynum is at least in the same league as Yao. I mean, I can understand where you're coming from, but you're really comparing two players who have totally different responsibilities towards their team. Yao is the cornerstone of this franchise. Bynum is not. He will never be. Laker fans hoping for the next Shaq are sorely mistaken.
He hasn't averaged 17 points per game in his career yet. I think thats the problem is people are having is Bynum hasn't done all these things yet. If he does, THEN you come back with the "Bynum and Yao are close" statements. Even, if he DID average 17 a game, your PPG stat isn't everything. Would you say Chris Kaman is close to TD? Yao can still bring things to a team that Bynum probably won't be able to for a couple of years, things like: Demanding doubleteams, being the guy opposing teams gameplan around, being a go-to guy down the stretch. Thats the problem I have with the Bynum-Yao comparison. Yao has been there for 2-3 years now and Bynum hasn't even done any of that and for some reason they are both "close" to each other.
he averages 7.2 points and 5.6 rebounds and 1.4 blks he is about a 65% FT shooter http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3936/career;_ylt=A2KIPGB6EfZIYzoBVwAhPaB4 yao avgd. 18 and 8 and 2 blks his 3rd year in the nba and is always 80-85% FT. still not THAT close. on lakers boards they say yao's passing is overrated because of his assist numbers, but we all know what he is capable of doing from watching him during his first 3 seasons. he is an amazing passer. everyone was comparing him to sabonis (another excellent passer). http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/stats?playerId=1722 yao's current avg? 22 and 10.8 and 2 blks. that is way above bynums avg. 7 and 5.6 and 1.4 wait a few years after yao's numbers drop and bynum's increase. then i won't give u guys so much slack for making the comparison.
Quite the leap on your part. I explicitly stated that Yao was better and your argument morphs into asking me why we don't just trade Yao for Bynum....after you "read between the lines." No. There's no need to look for any hidden meaning in my premises. It's not too difficult to follow: 1) Yao is better than Bynum. 2) It's not as great a disparity as some would insist. 3) Yao is the most overrated player in the league. How that took you to a rant about the triangle offense, I have no idea.
all yall are arguing about whose better the rockets or the lakers thats gonna be taken care of when they play on the hardwood...and all of yall on pau's piece need to hop off i much rather have scola than gasol.......i'll put money that luis wins a ring before pau............and another thing comparing bynum and yao is crazy ask "HOBE" if he would trade bynum for YAO i bet he will say yeah in a heartbeat im done with this thread
Whether he is overrated or not has nothing to do with the argument. Yao is what he is. Here are the facts: Yao: Demands double teams; Bynum: Doesn't demand double teams; Yao: 2nd option on a championship caliber team; Bynum: 4th option on a championship caliber team; Yao: Been at 20-10 (or near 20-10) level for 3 years; Bynum: Just came off a season averaging 10-10, a career high Advantages Bynum has on Yao: -Age: Much younger obviously, but for the purpose of this argument this is irrelevant because we are talking about how good these players are RIGHT NOW -Athleticism: Obvious advantage, although Yao is MUCH MUCH stronger than Bynum so the two advantages pretty much cancel each other out IMO The big problem of the "Bynum is close to Yao" camp is that you seem to want to assume Bynum is going to have a breakout or close to a breakout season for the Lakers. But it hasn't happened yet. So is it fair to argue using that assumption? Its like how some Rockets fans have been calling championship and becoming aggressive towards anyone with the "until we do it, we havn't done it" attitude because well... we havn't done it yet.
I do think its fair. Again, see the topic of this thread. It's about predicting who the best team in the West will be. Making predictions on how well players play for their team is obviously a part of that. I'll be quite happy if I end up being wrong here. But right now, I expect Bynum to make considerable improvements this year and develop into something of a "dominant force", but I don't expect Yao to get any better.
But is Bynum averaging 17 a game a reasonable assumption to make? Reasonable assumptions are things like "The Rockets will make the playoffs this season" or "The Rockets will be in the hunt for the division title this year" or "We will be a top 5 defense this year". If you are going to base your entire argument on an assumption, that assumption has to have a high probability of happening. Because what you are doing is similar to if I decided to assume the Rockets would be a top 5 offensive team this season because of the addition of Artest. And therefore I would have a strong argument for us winning the title because we would be in the top 3 in defense and top 5 offense. But its a bad assumption. We could be a top 5 team (I hope we are), but considering we came off a season where we were a top 15 team offensively, its not a sure thing. Boston is probably the #1 team on most analysts ranks. Wanna know why? Because they are the champs. You could make a great argument for the Lakers or Rockets based on the assumptions they could potentially have Yao+Artest/Bynum when May comes around and those players will make a huge differents. But at the beginning of the season you give the props to the team that has done it rather than make assumptions on teams that could be better on paper. Same theory applies in this argument.
Agree with that...I mean Bynum only averaged 17 ppg and 10 rebs for a one part of the season...most people automatically assume he can be the best center in the league or top 3, even though he has yet to do it for an entire season or even beyond an entire month.
I don't think Bynum will average 17 a game. I'd be surprised if he scores more than 15 ppg, actually. What I do expect is something like 14 ppg, 10 rpg, close to 60% shooting from the field, maybe around 72% from the line, around 2 bpg and 2 apg. And I think he'll do all that in around 25-27 mpg. That, to me, is very strong statistical production from a center. If that's what he's giving them while he's on the court, the Lakers are not being thoroughly mismatched at center when they face the Rockets. Remember, the Lakers will have Bynum and Gasol for their center rotation. So over the course of a game, the Lakers will likely be getting excellent productivity out that position.
It's not unlikely for him to be 4th option, I could easily see him averaging less points than Kobe, Gasol, and even Odom. That's not a far-fetch assumption from that poster.
I know it may be likely I just don't think it will go that way. I believe he will be the 3rd option behind Kobe and Gasol.
virtually no chance of winning last year without a healthy rafer, shane, and yao? sure. but having a healthy rafer, shane, and tmac last year (minus yao) plus an added artest (which is this years team) could have beaten your choking lakers team last year. a healthy rockets team minus yao vs a lakers team without bynum (last years lakers) that played like last year? rockets all the way. but both teams with those lineups couldnt beat a healthy celtics team. therefore it's about equal.
