To me, life in prison without possibility of parole would be worse than the death penalty. Assuming guilt of course. And the whole "How can you be a Christian and support the Death Penalty?" is a bad argument. God is a pretty vengeful God.
You mean like anti-death penalty protestors? If it were up to me, I would let the victim’s families decide the murderer’s fate on a case-by-case basis. If the family doesn’t believe in the DP, life without parole. If the family does believe in the DP, cook ‘em. Whatever gives the family closure. Not revenge….CLOSURE. Big difference.
but you are assuming that the key gets unlocked. Your first contention was that "its about a flawed system that has killed and will kill more innocent people". Now i see your point about activily killing but life in prison is essentially taking someone's life away. Innocent people have had their life taken away from them by spending life in prison. Here's a better question: if the system wasnt flawed, if the standards were so high that one was certainly guilty of a hideous crime...would you still be against it?
Agreed Donny. For what it's worth, I completely believe the state should have the power to inflict the ultimate punishment on the worst offenders of our society. My problem with the death penalty isn't a theoretical one, it's a practical one. The state has proven itself incapable of "getting it right" 100% of the time when it comes to crimes, be it through misreading evidence, incompetence, or willful malice.
I'm having a hard time understanding how some people equate life in prison to giving the prisoners "a second chance" ?
To me, getting my ass killed without the possibility of resurrection would be worse than life in prison without parole. Assuming innocence of course. From what I've read of the Bible, supporting the DP is about as unchristian a thing as you can possibly do. Even with the Old testament, PMSing God accounted for.
Read my post in Sam's thread. I can't say I morally oppose the state executing people (assuming guilt, 100% certainty, etc), but would *I* ever want to execute someone who committed a violent crime against me or someone I know? No.
I understand how emotions can bring people to do/feel/think such a way if they were the victim or a loved one was a victim of a heinous crime. But if killing another person brings you closure, then that is pretty messed up. You would think that given time to think and reflect, that people would realize that killing another person does not bring them any closer to comfort or getting back what they once lost.
I understand your points about the death penalty and I cannot come to a concrete conclusion really, so I won't dispute it further because I think there are good points on both sides of the case. But I think your argument is a flawed argument and I will explain why. Firstly, I think it is a mistake to try to fling people's religion on them as their basis for morality. I do not believe that morality and religion are one and the same. Morality is a code to live by and religion is a fanciful explanation for where morality comes from. Besides, you can use the Bible to pretty much justify anything. If you berate people for using the Bible to condemn things like homosexuality you are descrediting that person's viewpoint on the interpretation of the Bible. If you do that, you cannot try and say in another argument that same Bible that you believe personally to be a flawed as a source of morality is the end-all code when it comes to believing if the death penalty is right or wrong. You are basically using the Bible as a credible source in one account and in another case, its a magic book that idiots try to take as absolute truth. You simply cannot have it both ways.
I honestly could give less of a s*** what the bible says and I don't want it guiding anything to do with the criminal code of my state. I'm just proving a point to people who do exactly what you say, cherry pickers...
Hit it right on the head. My aunt was stabbed to death 5 years ago, just an incredibly incredibly violent, heinous murder. I supported capital punishment until that happened. Killing the man who took away my aunt's life away would never give me comfort. Especially when I reflected on my aunt's life and how she loved and cared for the lowest of the low. That's just my opinion and my experience. Maybe some people could get closure by watching someone being snuffed out. I can't wrap my mind around it. Also, researching the DP and seeing stories about innocent people slipping through the cracks made me solidify my opinion.
"The Death Penalty is against Christianity" is a bad argument, that is all I'm trying to say. Your other points are very valid, but you can construct better syllogisms to defend them logically than trying to use somebody's religion against them when you personally don't believe in it.
Agree to disagree, if I believed in the flying spaghetti monster's great big book of morals i'd expect someone to use that against me when debating morality. Although I prefer to stick to the realm of the concrete, it is fun to dabble in the shades of gray from time to time.
I am in favor the death penalty, but I would hope to increase the % of certainty. Got to have consequences, and make examples, IMO. DD
It doesn't really matter if you agree or not. The argument is logically unsound and therefore useless. Premise 1: The (Religious Text) is God's absolute truth in (Insert Religion) and is infallible. Premise 2: The (Religious Text) says the Death Penalty is wrong. Premise 3: (Religion) has to obey what God says in the (Religious Text) Conclusion: Because The (Religious Text) is God's absolute truth, and (Religion) must obey God's commandments in the (Religious Text), and because the (Religion) says The Death Penalty is wrong... The Death Penalty cannot be supported by (Religion) I think most of us can agree that Premise 1 is false, and Premise 2 could probably be "proven" true or false by any number of scriptures/entries/passages in the (Religious Text), thus making it false as well. And if any premise is false, the argument is a ****ty one. You can't argue with logic, sir.
I'm really sorry to hear about your aunt. I know you're a conscientious and thoughtful person, but I'm not sure I understand your logic. First, your aunt's killer didn't commit capital murder. It was murder, and the penalty was 5 years up to life in prison. But let's talk about a capital murderer, one who's killed before and kills again, or kills multiple people at the same time, or kills a baby? What about a serial killer like Dahmer or Ted Bundy? What about those victims' families who feel differently than you? Who have lost a loved one and do feel pain that the murderer lives while their loved ones do not? Who would feel comfort? Do you allow for the feelings of others who would feel different than you?
I'm assuming your aunt died in a crime of passion? Had it been some random stranger that did it senselessly, I think it would have polarized you in exactly the opposite direction. I think in this day and age DNA evidence should be required. But I'm fine with a death penalty.
Moe, you're preaching the choir dude. What you're not accounting for is that Premise 1 *is* true to a person of that belief. So maybe, just maybe, that person should give things a little more thought on that subject.
