KOC: "I've been told Morey would offer Ben Simmons plus more"

I think you can have one non-shooter. That is fine. I also think Ben is a much better passer than both Westbrook and Giannis, so that helps too.

Now, when time is low and we are exchanging half court possessions in a playoff game, for example, yeah, it would be preferable to have Simmons be a shooter. But honestly a Rockets blowup means we won't be having close playoff games for a long while, so it's not a concern of mine. Maybe in the meantime we will acquire or develop a good half court scorer that will allow Ben to play off the ball if that situation ever presented itself.

 

I agree shooting is important

but i dont think its as simple as saying x player hasnt succeeded yet , its because he cant shoot .

Simmons and Giannis are both like 25 .. serious question , what NBA player under 25 has won the championship as a lead dog in the last 20 years ?

IMO its just as much an age and experience thing . Lebron isnt a great shooter either , but hes improved over time.

Shooting is just one component of offense, and theres a whole nother side of the ball. Have the bucks really disappointed ? maybe , but their last playoff defeats have come at the hands of great teams.

 

AND......

All NBA third team
All NBA defensive first team

 

And then to pair him with Silas too

 

If you don’t think that offer is doable, which I don’t either, how do you expect to get Simmons here, because that’s the worst offer stone should listen to,IMO, and it’s the best Philly can offer.

 

What exact offer?

 

Someone make a thread about if we get Simmons, how do we build a championship team around him? I'd love to see some of the creative thoughts and we know Morey checked out the bbs, maybe Stone does too

 

I’m not a huge Simmons fan, out of the different scenarios I’ve seen. Simmons is probably the best player to build around. Brown the best overall player but I think his ceiling is lower than Simmons.

 

We don't. He plays a couple years here, is unhappy, and demands a trade. He's a Klutch client. He won't sit around for a rebuild.

 

Simmons + Embiid + 1st round picks.

 

he is the rebuild.

I think you have to take the gamble.

best case for Tilman is Simmons loves it here and Klutch starts funneling players to play here.

worst case for Tilman? He is forced to sell because Klutch demands it from Adam Silver.


Both seem like awesome options for us as fans, no?

 

what use is simmons off-ball? He can’t shoot. Teams will just ignore him around the perimeter and clog the paint...just like teams are doing with Westbrook.

I’m not saying he’s not a good player. He may even have an MVP season at some point. But he lacks the most necessary skill in the modern NBA...the skill that has eliminated the old ground and pound PF and is now working its way through centers. I am not even certain if the high flying uber-athletic PnR center is going to survive...thats how much things have changed.

 

As a side note, I think it’s hilarious that I don’t even like harden and I’m having to argue up his trade value for people who love him. Simmons + picks is NOT adequate return for James Freaking Harden.

 

Simmons, Embiid and picks? I would make that trade, just because I don’t think you’re getting anything better in return.

 

Heres the deal. You cant get adequate value for a player when he wants out. You salvage what you can.

 

I disagree here, simply because AD and Kawhi.
You can get good returns, I wouldn’t call that salvaging.

 

by the time Lebron was 25, he had attempted over 2,000 3s in the NBA.

Simmons has attempted 24. He’s hit 2.

They aren’t in the same solar system of shooting development.

 

I disagree also. You don’t let harden dictate terms here. If you can’t get a fair return, well, he’s under contract. See you in training camp. Let’s get uncomfortable.

 

When do you ever see a top 5 player with multiple years of team control get traded for equal or fair value? You don't. Because you can't replace a top 5 player in his prime in a trade unless you're getting another top 5 player in his prime. The difference between Harden and even a top 15 guy like Kyrie is massive.

You're not going to get anything close to equal value for James, especially not with three years left on his contract. And I'm all for waiting until a team offers the best possible package, but the Sixers aren't going to offer Embiid and Simmons. Because they'd be crazy, too, and no team would offer anything remotely close to that. If you can get a future All-Star like Simmons, a slew of draft picks and other young assets, that's a win. But no matter what, the Rockets are going to be getting pennies on the dollar in any trade for Harden.

 

I dont disagree. Seeing you @ training camp is the Rockets best move at the moment. But you can wait forever and not get a return like Simmons + Embid + picks. Even in a vacuum, in an ideal situation, Harden isn't worth that.

IMO i cant imagine us getting a better deal than Simmons + picks.