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Kinkaid Principal and Headmaster asked to resign over canceled Pep Rally

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout' started by Pimphand24, Nov 21, 2009.

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Rip Van Rocket Contributing Member

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soadrules said:

The skit was supposed to be about a 'gay' kid, and all the football players dressed up as women. Apparently, the principle thought it was offensive to women.
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Offensive to women? How about offensive to everyone.

Is this what goes on at a pep rally nowadays?

#21 Rip Van Rocket, Nov 22, 2009

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Rip Van Rocket said:

Offensive to women? How about offensive to everyone.

Is this what goes on at a pep rally nowadays?
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There has to be more to his decision to cancel it, whether I agree or not. Based on past encounters, and personal knowledge, he wouldn't have even allowed it go on in the first place if it was something as simple as this (The parents who organized this event had his approval for every part to start with).

#22 soadrules, Nov 22, 2009

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Pimphand24 Member

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Cannonball said:

Isn't that pretty much what this group is trying to do themselves?
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Yeah, sounds like something lifted off of a Tea Party pamphlet.

Let's NOT get into a Tea Party debate,
But like the Tea Parties, there are plenty of people (in this case, almost all of them) who are joining in because they have an axe to grind regarding something else more radical.
Because this ain't about no pep rally.

My favorite part:
"By standing for everything, we actually stand for nothing."
Wow... Truly inspirational.

The worst part is this:

I realized after I created this thread, that the letter which landed in my inbox was attached to an email forwarded to me from the original email writer.
The original email writer is my childhood hero! Ray Childress!!

I've avoided naming names, but Ray Childress is a public figure, and enters our lives through television, selling us various things based upon his reputation.
He did not write the letter, but he attached the letter to the email and wrote:

(Parent X) has written a wonderful and courageous letter to Kinkaid's BOD (Board of Directors) after Friday's pep rally disaster. By allowing the personal opinion of faculty members to dictate student conduct creates a disturbing precedent and, at the very least, the extent of the power should be made very clear to students and parents alike. It's a dangerous situation that needs to be addressed...and fixed. I ask each of us to echo such letter and let our view be heard in volume!

The Best!
Ray

soadrules said:

Obviously the problem is more deep-rooted as some feel the school is putting pressure on those that are not minorities, by promoting 'too much diversity' (Some even want clubs like Chinese Club, Greek Club shut down).
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That's exactly what I originally thought but didn't say because I'm slightly out of the loop.

Recently Kinkaid had a black valedictorian speak at graduation in 2008. I was very surprised but very proud that the school had come so far.
My grade, we only had 1 black person! 1 Latino. This was even late 1990's.
Having more minorities in the school was a product of a "Diversity Initiative" enacted by the school's board in 2002. It obviously has made a difference.

Now hearing that some are even advocating to shut down the Chinese/Greek clubs, it wouldn't be far-fetched to say that things like having a black valedictorian speaking at graduation and having more minorities in the school, is problematic to many families.
People don't wear white hoods these days (I guess its not fashionable anymore? ) but the school obviously has plenty of closet racists.
(Funny Part: They are threatening to send their kids to St. Johns instead. This ain't about no pep rally: the principal apologized and the wheels are still turning)

However, it is still fashionable to be homophobic and that is what's directly mentioned in the letter... but even then 4 pages out of 5 talk about a canceled pep rally!
They are too coward to say what is really going on.

I'm not saying everyone supporting the letter are racist, but its hard to discern who's who without the white hoods.
But it makes me wonder how their kids will handle college. Not everyone can go to Bob Jones University.

It's sad to see many influential/powerful leaders in Houston advocate discrimination for the sake of their children.

I'm a little scared writing against Ray Childress. I have the pimphand for defense, but Ray Childress ain't no b****.

#23 Pimphand24, Nov 22, 2009
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I immediately regret making that Tea Party comment. My point was that they are using the same language as the taxpayers who are protesting the government to whom they pay taxes to. Makes logical sense. But I didn't want to enter the actual Tea Party debate.

Here families are advocating for discrimination, saying its their right because they pay tuition.

Please don't take this to the D&D.

That's where basso is.

#24 Pimphand24, Nov 22, 2009

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Ohh man. This again. It's clearly not so much about a canceled pep rally, but the conservative school community feeling like liberals are taking over everything. It happened while I was at Kinkaid as well. I always felt bad for the teachers who are just trying to be considerate of the non-rich or non-white kids and then are berated by the larger conservative community for doing so. Acceptance of gays is easily the touchiest subject in the whole diversity controversy, so it doesn't surprise me that some parents would write up a 5 page letter on it.

Bear_Bryant said:

hey i graduated from Kinkaid....Class of 08. I really don't get what all is going on and why their making such a big deal out of a canceled pep rally.
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Me too!

#25 BabyClutch, Nov 22, 2009

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Pimphand24 said:

Recently Kinkaid had a black valedictorian speak at graduation in 2008. I was very surprised but very proud that the school had come so far.[/I]
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He wasn't valedictorian but rather our school president. But yes, the school has come very far and most of these parents aren't all too happy about it. They remember when they went to Kinkaid and the whole student body was made up of rich memorial and river oaks kids. Due to the initial wave of backlash following the first diversity initiatives, the school did a survey on diversity and the community's feeling towards it. Let's just say, the responses were frightening!

Oh and about moving to St. John's, that's really funny because St. John's is a far more liberal school with a far more liberal student body. Even still, they lost quite a few students one summer after they launched a gay-straight alliance organization. Needless to say, every time a student or a student organization brought up the idea of a possible gsa at Kinkaid, the headmaster's response was a very quick, "I don't think so."

I could go on forever about the tensions between different groups on diversity. It's a deep-rooted issue.

#26 BabyClutch, Nov 22, 2009
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ClutchCityReturns said:

Iverson.

Hey, someone was going to do it anyway.

EDIT: told you so.
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Just curious what is this a reference to?

#27 rocketsjudoka, Nov 22, 2009

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BabyClutch said:

He wasn't valedictorian but rather our school president. But yes, the school has come very far and most of these parents aren't all too happy about it. They remember when they went to Kinkaid and the whole student body was made up of rich memorial and river oaks kids. Due to the initial wave of backlash following the first diversity initiatives, the school did a survey on diversity and the community's feeling towards it. Let's just say, the responses were frightening!

Oh and about moving to St. John's, that's really funny because St. John's is a far more liberal school with a far more liberal student body. Even still, they lost quite a few students one summer after they launched a gay-straight alliance organization. Needless to say, every time a student or a student organization brought up the idea of a possible gsa at Kinkaid, the headmaster's response was a very quick, "I don't think so."

I could go on forever about the tensions between different groups on diversity. It's a deep-rooted issue.
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haha really? small world. I remember taking that survey and I remember that everyone I talked to did not take it seriously.

#28 Bear_Bryant, Nov 22, 2009
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Bear_Bryant said:

haha really? small world. I remember taking that survey and I remember that everyone I talked to did not take it seriously.
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Parents took it very seriously. Their responses were the frightening ones.

#29 BabyClutch, Nov 22, 2009
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We tried starting a gay/straight alliance club when I was a senior at Kinkaid. Saltman (the principal currently under fire) rejected it, but allowed us to start a different club with the name "Kinkaid Against Hatred and Discrimination" (KAHD). The club is still around, and I hope it is actively pushing back against the intolerant segment of Kinkaid families.

#30 LScolaDominates, Nov 22, 2009
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This whole situation is disgusting.

Gah. Humanity. What a waste.

#31 rhadamanthus, Nov 22, 2009
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This is the e-mail I received:

November 21, 2009

Dear Parents:

A number of parents responded to the November 18, 2009 letter from Staman
Ogilvie, Tom Simmons and me asking, essentially:

What is this all about, what actually happened at the pep rally, and what
are the letters the school is receiving about? Several observed that the
letter was far too general and reported that there are rumors and
speculation circulating in the broader school community to which Kinkaid
parents are not able to respond because they do not have the necessary
information. I write now to give you more information about this.

At the beginning of the week before the SPC Championship football game
between Kinkaid and Episcopal several Kinkaid mothers asked Upper School
Principal Mickey Saltman if the school could hold a pep rally to generate
spirit for this game. Recognizing the lateness of the request, the mothers
offered to take responsibility for organizing the pep rally. Mr. Saltman
agreed, and he subsequently approved plans for two skits to be held at the
pep rally, one of which involved Kinkaid football players dressing up as EHS
cheerleaders.

Shortly before the pep rally on Friday several members of the faculty and
one student asked if they could speak with Mr. Saltman. They presented
their opinion that a skit in which boys dressed up as and acted like
cheerleaders was demeaning to women. At the end of the conversation and
after some deliberation Mr. Saltman decided that he agreed. Since he did
agree, he believed that the right choice was to cancel the skit. He left
messages on the cell phones of the mothers who had planned the pep rally
informing them of his decision, and since he needed to remain in the Upper
School to operate the special bell schedule for that day, he asked one of
the teachers and the student to deliver the message to the boys, who were
getting dressed backstage in the Brown Auditorium, and they did deliver the
message. The timing of the decision, especially given the amount of work
that parents had devoted to prepare costumes, led to confusion and anger
among the boys and the parents helping them get dressed.

In the anger and confusion the boys thought the decision was based on the
fact that they were imitating EHS cheerleaders; they did not understand that
Mr. Saltman's judgment was based on the belief that the skit was demeaning
to women. A little later in the pep rally the boys came on stage to
participate in the cheering; they had taken off the cheerleader outfits but
some still had their wigs on. Mr. Saltman, who was standing in the Brown
Auditorium, saw them come on stage and felt that they were trying to
challenge his authority with respect to his decision to cancel the skit, and
he cancelled the pep rally.

This led to even greater anger and confusion, especially among parents and
other family members attending, who wished only to send the team and the
cheerleaders into the game the next night with the fullest support of the
Kinkaid community.

Mr. Saltman made several mistakes in judgment in this matter-canceling the
skit at the last minute, sending a faculty member and a student to deliver
the message to the students involved in the skit, and interpreting the boys'
appearance on stage as a challenge to his authority. To his credit he
recognizes and accepts full responsibility for those mistakes, and he has
apologized to students in class meetings, to the full Upper School student
body again on Friday, and to several parents face to face.

A number of parents judged the decisions to cancel the skit and then later
the pep rally to be arbitrary and deeply disrespectful both to the players
and to the parents, and the decisions touched chords of other times or other
matters in which they believed that Kinkaid had acted in ways that were
arbitrary and not in the best interests of students or school families.
Over the next several days a dozen or parents and one current student wrote
letters to the school or to the Board of Trustees expressing these
complaints, many with great passion. At least one of the letters received
widespread electronic circulation, and that circulation generated additional
response from other parents and some alumni.

Both the criticisms and the passion of the letters caught the school by
surprise. The criticisms had not emerged in the vehicles the school has set
up for communication from parents, such as the principals' parent advisory
committees, the annual grade-level surveys, or responses to the monthly
letters I write.

But the criticisms are genuine and deeply felt, and they deserve full
attention.

As Mr. Ogilvie, Mr. Simmons, and I mentioned in our November 18 letter, the
criticisms seem to collect around three general points.

First is the feeling that the school has formulated a collection of views,
an agenda if you will-social, political, economic-that it considers
"correct" and that it is promoting this agenda without regard to the views
of students or parents. Some students report feeling that at times they
feel that their voices have been silenced.

Some of this seems to parents to be related to the second point, which is
that in its work to implement goals articulated in the Board of Trustees
Diversity Statement the school has gone too fast or too far.

Some Upper School students report feeling that they hear about diversity too
frequently, and they feel that the school is trying to "drive diversity down
our throats." Some students believe that the school's approach has had the
opposite effect intended.

Instead of building a sense of inclusivity and community, it has actually
led to a feeling of some divisiveness among students. A number of parents
have expressed the feeling that in some areas the school has overstepped its
bounds.

A third point is the feeling that the school has implemented the Policy on
Religious Expression too narrowly and in so doing has communicated disregard
for the religious beliefs of some students and families.

Over the past two weeks I have had many conversations with parents, alumni,
and faculty. I have heard from those who agree with the criticisms and with
those who disagree as well.

Yesterday morning I spent an hour with the full Upper School student body
and faculty to give them an accounting of the facts as well as the
criticisms that have been raised, and to give them an opportunity to ask
questions. I told them that I had begun to understand what the problems
being described were and that now I need to understand what, specifically,
has led to the problems, and I invited students to a "talk back" session
after school on Friday. 80 or more students attended the session, and
though not all students stayed the whole time, the session lasted an hour
and 45-min.

While some of the school's work in implementing Diversity goals has been
productive, it is clear that some has been misguided, especially with
respect to the Diversity Policy and the Policy on Religious Expression. So
much of education involves striking the right balance between competing and
equally valuable needs, and in these matters we need to reset the balance.
The work of the task force will enable us to do that.

In our letter last week we mentioned that there would be some action steps
taken in the immediate future. One involves reuniting the group of seventh
grade girls who meet once weekly for Bible study with their Upper School
leaders, another involves offering an Upper School classroom as a "home" for
the Upper School Bible study group, and the third is to grant the request of
the Upper School Diversity Coordinator to be released from her
responsibilities as Upper School Diversity Coordinator.

In closing I ask for two things. The first is trust that Kinkaid is serious
about fully understanding the issues parents and students have brought to
the school's attention, and taking the necessary steps to reset the balance
I mentioned above.

The second is patience. There has been considerable emotion around these
issues, and while we are working through the process with the task force, we
need to remember that our students are watching carefully and are sensitive
to our own level of concern.

Thank you very much.

Sincerely,

Don North
Headmaster
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#32 OrangeRowdy95, Nov 22, 2009
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Kinkaid Class of 2004 here.

Let me just say the "skit" in question is a yearly tradition where the football players dress up in cheerleading uniforms.

Saltman (the principle) OK's the skit like he does every year. Some people complain more than usual for some reason, so he cancels it. Not the pep rally, just the skit.

So the pep rally goes on and all of a sudden here come the players in drag. Saltman then proceeds to go ballistic in front of the entire student body.

So some of the football players' parents (on the board of trustees) are now calling for his head for loosing his cool.

#33 AkeemTheDreem86, Nov 22, 2009

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Makes me think of Revenge of the Nerds

#34 Tenchi, Nov 22, 2009
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That skit should have been canceled for being lame.

#35 Oski2005, Nov 22, 2009
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AkeemTheDreem86 said:

Kinkaid Class of 2004 here.

Let me just say the "skit" in question is a yearly tradition where the football players dress up in cheerleading uniforms.
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A yearly tradition? Not once did I see that skit when I was in high school.

#36 BabyClutch, Nov 22, 2009
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BabyClutch said:

A yearly tradition? Not once did I see that skit when I was in high school.
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I remember seeing the skit and thought it was dumb. A lot of the things during Pep Rallies were really dumb. As someone said earlier, Saltman should have canceled the skit for being lame. I heard the Pep Rally was to be 10 minutes long, and that played into the decision to cancel the skits as well.

#37 OrangeRowdy95, Nov 22, 2009
AkeemTheDreem86 Member

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BabyClutch said:

A yearly tradition? Not once did I see that skit when I was in high school.
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You're 08? I can't speak for you, but I remember every year going out to the bleachers for pep rallies and certain football players would dress up like girls.

Don North said:

In our letter last week we mentioned that there would be some action steps
taken in the immediate future. One involves reuniting the group of seventh
grade girls who meet once weekly for Bible study with their Upper School
leaders, another involves offering an Upper School classroom as a "home" for
the Upper School Bible study group, and the third is to grant the request of
the Upper School Diversity Coordinator to be released from her
responsibilities as Upper School Diversity Coordinator.
Click to expand...

Way to go Don, this outta fix everything.

#38 AkeemTheDreem86, Nov 22, 2009

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This makes me glad I went to HSPVA.

#39 Batman Jones, Nov 22, 2009
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#40 Mr. Brightside, Nov 22, 2009

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