Kelly Iko: The Rockets are not interested in breaking up their core for Giannis Antetokounmpo

Sure, but it's still fun to see the people have this kinda belief in our guys. No different then the couple people who still thought/think jalen can be kobe/mj. I just root for them all to be correct so we can win 10 rings

 

So, you are into fiction?

 

I guess? Obviously i don't agree with it and i think it's silly, i'm not just bothered by it

 

The discussion is about who is better currently. Guys progress at different rates. Jokic made a huge jump, not likely that Sengun or anyone else will make the same massive improvement. It simply doesn't happen that often.

 

Funny to me. That's the exact archetype I associate with Amen Thompson. It's early... very early in the process... but I really believe that if Amen were groomed into, and capable of excelling at, the PG position, he could be exactly that player. His size and skill set, particularly at the PG position, could be other worldly. Tari, as we are already witnessing, is a great compliment to that. He's an elite defender, competent shooter, and elite energy guy that would easily fill the Draymond role on the court. They just need reliable shooters at the 2 guard (starting and back up) and an Embiid-lite center (draft) to compliment Sengun at 4 to complete the future starting squad. That's a championship recipe if young, cheap guys (Cam???) can adequately fill out spots 6-9 on the bench.

Green is the bait to achieve most of that goal. Who needs an athletic, bucket-gifted, volume shooting Jamal Crawford type guard? We don't need the scorer. We need the efficient sniper(s). Surely someone needs him.

 

Are PER, BPM, EPM, LEBRON, VORP all team stats?

 

It's ok if you don't like facts.

You discount team stats when they don't support your narrative, but you quote them to support your statement that Sabonis is better.

You discount age when it comes to the Sabonis comparison, but you do cite age to say Wemby has higher potential.

If I have a pro Sengun bias, you have an anti-Sengun bias.

That's fine if you don't like the young player on our team who has shown the most.

I'll give you one thing: For me, the biggest reason that makes it unlikely that Sengun will ever be as good as Jokic is shooting. Jokic currently leads the NBA in 3-point percentage (crazy!) and was an excellent free throw shooter even early in his career. Alpi just doesn't seem to be able to significantly improve in these two areas, and that's only on him. To me, that's the strongest indicator that he can't reach Jokic's level.

That said, his advanced stats already place him in top 10-15 range of all NBA players, even now. He has made a massive jump defensively this season. His offense has taken a step back. When he puts it all together, he can have top 5 impact.

 

Looks like this goes back a while. Doubling down now.

There are also posts in which he claims Jalen is a very good defender.

 

There is also the thing that the Joker archetype is not as dominant as Shaq, Duncan or Hakeem were.

He was more in the realm of a Dirk that he could compete for a couple championships by himself.

However I want to see Jokic against the Celtics so bad.

 

Mostly this: DFGA and DFG%
Alperen: 7.6 DFGA at 54.4%
Sabonis: 6.5 DFGA at 67.0%

Deflections
Alperen: 6th best C in the NBA
Sabonis: 25th best C in the NBA

PER36
Alperen: 1.3 SPG/1.4 BPG
Sabonis: 0.6 SPG/0.5 BPG

Alperen's stats in Sacramento would be absurd. I can't imagine how many assists he would average with shooters and a thousand D-HOs a game.

What's Sacramento's record this year?

 

I mean, if just over a year ago, you said Green and Smith can be elite, but Sengun can't, and now you insist Sengun isn't a star, then...fine, I guess. Everyone can have their opinions.

What I see is that Sengun has improved on something every year. There is a positive trajectory, still. I don't see the same trajectory with the two guys @aelliott proclaimed can be "elite" (while Sengun apparently cannot, only "very good").

When he made that statement, all the advanced stats alteady had Sengun way above both Jalen and Jabari, it's not like that statement was made when they were just drafted.

This year, Sengun has improved on defense, rebounding, blocks, bringing down fouls and turnovers. He has had trouble finishing this season so far, I hope that improves again.

 

Like Dillon Brooks said, Alpi brings it every game. You can count on him. He has been by far our most consistent player since last season. The droughts and big swings come not because we don't have a "star" (however arbitrarily you wish to define that) but because our guards and Jabari sometimes make their shots, more often they don't.

Look at that last game against Portland. Sengun had 15 potential assists. Jalen and Fred went 1-15 from three. Udoka even pointed it out in the postgame press conference.

The two guys we haven't been able to "count on game in and game out" are the two guys you said can be "elite" - Jalen and Jabari.

You then go on to analyze that we have droughts because Sengun supposedly isn't a star.

That's some severe cognitive dissonance there.

 

This is correct. What led you to believe, then, after having watched Jalen and Jabari for a while, that they "can be elite"?

This is what they have done, respectively, since you made that statement.

 

How is 20/10/5 with a steal and a block per game at age 22 not a "star"?

And why would one assume that someone who has improved every year so far in his career will not improve even further from there, but someone who has been stagnant or regressed every year "can be elite"?

Disappointing stuff from someone I consider one of the best posters here.

 

Sacramento is proper-f*cked they have the hardest remaining schedule. I knew the California teams would not bother us this season. Clippers and Kings down. Lakers will deflate soon. Warriors we will have to scalp them ourselves. Would be great to see them in the playoffs and end that dynasty once and for all.

I honestly don’t think Udoka can do what Mike Brown can do. Udoka’s offense is exactly like Brown’s offense before he went and studied under Kerr. Predictable and producing the worst “good” shots in the league.

He’s about as creative as JVG, Bickerstaff, Rivers. Mike Brown and Thibs seem to have grown up from this mindset. The defense-only guys are trying to cover up their weakness by demanding playoff intensity defense and rebounding for 82 games. Yeah no **** it’s good to tell your players to grab the excessive misses you generated lol. That’s why their players “unluckily” get injured and have tired legs very often missing shots they would normally make.

They are never happy with the effort and defense and it’s a distraction. This problem is easy to solve with a great lead assistant but that would require them to admit mistakes and trust someone. It’s absurd that people are in denial that a lead assistant can improve the offense without hurting the defense much.

Fox/Sabonis is a great way to play Sengun/Green while generating open looks for others. Would work with Sengun/Amen and Amen/Green too. Both those kings guys were not great shooters when the offense started. Around them you just need 3&D guys which we have plenty of (Tari, FVV, Brooks, Bari) - that’s the only mistake Sacramento made, surrounding them with poor defenders was a terrible idea that will eventually sink the ship.

 

Wait, who are you saying is one of the best posters here?

 

It’s not just shooting. If you look at something like touch around the rim and in the floater range, jokic isn’t just elite, he’s the best in history. If you look at his vision and intelligence, he’s not just elite, he’s in that top top all time group with magic and 2-3 others. If jokic was only great at those things, he would be a top 5 player and all that but not the indisputable best player in the league.

 

@aelliott

 

lolol

 

I'm not following the discussion too much. I think VORP and BPM are out of date as all in one stats. I just want to say that PER was created nearly 30 years ago. PER has big issues with defense relative to modern all in one stats. Anyone with an open mind about statistical arguments will not take an argument with PER seriously.