1. Welcome! Please take a few seconds to create your free account to post threads, make some friends, remove a few ads while surfing and much more. ClutchFans has been bringing fans together to talk Houston Sports since 1996. Join us!

Kelly Dwyer: Gasol is the best player in the NBA!

Discussion in 'NBA Dish' started by t_mac1, Nov 23, 2010.

  1. Mr. Clutch

    Mr. Clutch Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2002
    Messages:
    46,550
    Likes Received:
    6,131
    Marc Gasol is as good as Pau...WOW, now I've heard it all.
     
  2. goodbug

    goodbug Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2002
    Messages:
    2,863
    Likes Received:
    32
    No, Marc is not as good as Pau. But he's cheap and Lakers could still get something back for Kwame's expiring contract. e.g. Randolph, who's traded in 2008 offseason, I don't see why Knicks wouldn't want to dump him earlier in 2008 trade deadline.

    It's hard to say if Marc+Randolph > Pau, but it's safe to say the Lakers would be in a very good position to contend for last 2 years if they end up with this pair. And it's ridiculous to say Kobe can't win in playoff without Pau.



     
  3. YaoZow

    YaoZow Member

    Joined:
    May 1, 2009
    Messages:
    735
    Likes Received:
    12
     
  4. jlwee

    jlwee Member

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2003
    Messages:
    2,877
    Likes Received:
    73
    Hey dude! Where in the hell in my statement I mentioned about Kobe? I am talking about Gasol and nothing about your lover Kobe. Can you read?
    In fact I said Gasol was one of the reasons the Lakers won and not the reason they won. So I am actually giving complementary to your boy Kobe.

    Why do you compare a young MJ and a prime Kobe? Is that fair?
     
  5. Steve_Francis_rules

    Joined:
    Dec 11, 1999
    Messages:
    8,467
    Likes Received:
    300
    I'm not understanding you now.

    You first said Boozer was traded for nothing. Now you admit that he left his team as a free agent. You ask why they wouldn't have traded him when they had the chance, but the fact is that they still didn't There was a lot of speculation that they would trade Boozer last year and they didn't.

    Then you go on to talk about the Lakers acquiring Boozer for Kwame's expiring contract, but Boozer wasn't on the trading block three years ago when Kwame was still with the Lakers.

    And if you think the Lakers would be just as good or better with that no defense playing black hole Zach Randolph rather than Pau, I don't know what to tell you.
     
  6. YaoZow

    YaoZow Member

    Joined:
    May 1, 2009
    Messages:
    735
    Likes Received:
    12
    Maybe you should learn to read? Where did I say Boozer was traded for nothing?

    Where have you been? There have been trade rumors about Boozer since 2006.

    Why are you changing what I said?

    I said Marc Gasol + Zach Randolph > Pau Gasol

    And Pau Gasol isn't any defensive stud either :grin:
     
  7. MorningZippo

    MorningZippo Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2010
    Messages:
    3,247
    Likes Received:
    2,515
     
  8. YaoZow

    YaoZow Member

    Joined:
    May 1, 2009
    Messages:
    735
    Likes Received:
    12
     
  9. OremLK

    OremLK Member

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2010
    Messages:
    16,092
    Likes Received:
    10,284
    Pau Gasol is not the best player in the NBA, but at this point in their respective careers he is probably more valuable to the Lakers than Kobe Bryant, and he's a lot better than he's typically given credit for by basketball fans and the media.
     
  10. roslolian

    roslolian Member

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2008
    Messages:
    24,433
    Likes Received:
    14,715
    Where do you get this stuff? Do you even watch Grizzly games or do you just go by hearsay. Marc Gasol is a good defensive player, but he's not Bill Russel. Is he better in D than his brother? Probably, but against other elite big men that more than offset by his lack of experience. LOL so you're saying a rookie Marc Gasol and Lamar Odom is good enough against Perkins and KG? Or a 2nd year Marc Gasol and Odom is good enough against Dwight Howard? Please :rolleyes:


    Is there any coincidence your examples all involve rookie swaps?

    And Beasley was traded because he was a pothead. And Boozer wasn't traded he signed as a FA.

    Yes there might be other good deals out there. But no other deal will fetch them a player as good as Pau Gasol. Name me one guy on the market at that time that could have handled Perkins/KG and DWight howard. Unless you can't come up with a substitute Kobe Bryant sill won't have 3 rings.
     
  11. roslolian

    roslolian Member

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2008
    Messages:
    24,433
    Likes Received:
    14,715
    They wouldn't have traded Boozer because the Lakers have no asset to trade for him. Again you're talking out of your ass and don't consider the timing of the events:

    Year of the Pau Gasol trade-Boozer still under contract for 3 years-Bynum got injured (can't be traded)-Marc Gasol still out of the NBA-Kwame Brown's contract will expire

    You only had 1 year timetable before Kwame Brown contract. Bynum was injured and couldn't be traded. Marc Gasol was still out of the NBA and no one had any idea he would be this good. No Pau No Rings for Kobe.
     
  12. roslolian

    roslolian Member

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2008
    Messages:
    24,433
    Likes Received:
    14,715
    Zack Randolph in NY wasn't putting up 20-10. He was taking 3 pointers with Isiah Thomas watching him make a fool of himself. Unless the Lakers had some kind of future vision that allowed them to know that Randolph would clean up his act after he got traded, why would they trade for him?

    And I've repeated for the Nth time, Marc Gasol was just a rookie when the Lakers won their first ring. He was just a sophomore when they won their 2nd. You are out of your freaking mind if you think Marc Gasol as a rookie or a 2nd year would be able to handle the NBA's elite big men.

    There's a massive difference between the two brothers, just look at Memphis during Gasol's time, with only role players like Battier on board they were a playoff team, even if they got swept everytime. With Marc Gasol the grizzlies are still a lottery team, and they have Rudy Gay, OJ Mayo and Randolph already on the team.
     
  13. melo061

    melo061 Member

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2006
    Messages:
    125
    Likes Received:
    0
    Why is Bryant being punished for playing with dominant Bigs/HOF? How many championships did Magic win without HOF's? Larry Bird? How many championships did they win without super talented roster? How many Championships did MJ win without pippen?

    Basketball is a team game. Teams win championships, but individuals can guide them to victory. Prior to Gasol coming to LA, Kobe an NBA legend. He won 3 championships as a second option, although in the last 2 runs, Kobe was putting up franchise numbers. He was doing things on the court post shaq and pre-gasol that only Wilt Chamberlain did.

    Kobe prior to Gasol

    3 NBA championships
    5 time ALL NBA first team
    2 time ALL NBA 2nd team
    5 time all NBA defensive team
    2 time All NBA 2nd defensive team
    2 scoring championships

    If Kobe didn't team up Gasol, his all nba first team appearances would be the same but his individual stats would be much better. He wouldn't be considered a top 10 of all time, but somewhere between top 10 and top 15.

    Now imagine if Gasol didn't team up with Kobe and remained a grizz. Gasol was considered a soft bigman that couldn't play win. He was a top 15 player in league, but in all times stake, meant nothing at all. His career would be defined by losing. Now check out how his fortunes changed playing with Kobe. He wont from being considered a soft big man who couldn't win a playoff game to being considered the best big man in the NBA and a borderline HOF.

    All of this indisputable. I've even omitted by own feelings that even if the Laker management didn't pull of a gasol trade, they would have still found a way to get Kobe championship team.

    It is Gasol who benefited much more from playing with Kobe than Gasol. Kobe was already an NBA legend before the spanish dude came about.

    That alone should silence those who are now pimping Gasol (when in reality they don't give a **** about him) in order to critique Kobe and not give him a credit.

    My take? Gasol is the best big man in the NBA, and i consider the Kobe/Gasol situation to the Shaq/Kobe scenario in 01 and 02. Kobe is clearly the best player on the team, but Gasol is also a fantastic player, and when required, can take the slack off Kobe's back. Both guys are top 10 players in the league (Gasol has upped his game playing with the lakers).
     
  14. YaoZow

    YaoZow Member

    Joined:
    May 1, 2009
    Messages:
    735
    Likes Received:
    12
    Marc Gasol is much better than Pau defensively. Who are these other elite Centers that punk Marc Gasol?

    Name them and I'll go look it up for you to dispel this myth.

    Rookie Marc Gasol + Kwame trade + Lamar Odom is definitely good enough.

    Please yourself. Howard has not dominated Marc Gasol.

    Don't make stuff up. :rolleyes:


    When did I say Boozer was traded? Please learn to read.

    It's right in front of your face.... Marc Gasol. None of those guys have beasted Marc Gasol any more than they have beaten Pau Gasol

    And they already had Marc Gasol and Kwame Brown's trade still.

    Marc Gasol + Kwame Brown Trade + Bynum + Odom would have smashed any front line you can name.
     
  15. clippy

    clippy Member

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2002
    Messages:
    4,869
    Likes Received:
    124
    He's not. Most people get that basketball is a team game. Most of the negative press for Gasol comes from insecure Kobe fans who are extremely worried about Kobe's place in history (since so much of his legacy is as the second-fiddle). The rest of us understand that Gasol is a great player and a huge reason the Lakers keep contending.
     
  16. roslolian

    roslolian Member

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2008
    Messages:
    24,433
    Likes Received:
    14,715
    What myth needs dispelling? Memphis has a collective record of 6 of 9. What more proof do you need? :rolleyes: Marc Gasol is not elite yet, how else do you explain the fact that his team is in the lottery?

    You're the one who's making stuff up. The year the Magic reached the finals happened to be Gasol's rookie year.

    Their first game, DH had 14 pts, 22 rebs to MG's 10 and 5.
    http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/200810310MEM.html

    Their 2nd game, DH had 14 pts, 13 rebs to MG's 10 and 8.
    http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/200904080ORL.html

    Get real, nobody in their right mind can say Marc Gasol is good enough to go head-to-head against the league's leading rebounding and shot blocker in his rookie year. Only KOF like you can keep coming with the same twisted logic again and again.

    You do realize that in the Kwame Brown trade they had to give up Marc Gasol in the deal? Yet somehow the Lakers are only going to trade Kwame Brown by himself and still get an allstar who can pair up with Marc Gasol, Bynum and Odom.

    LOL I don't know any team who would have been willing to part with an elite big man just for Kwame Brown and nothing else, however what I do know is:

    1. Memphis got laughed at by the entire league after the trade for being so stupid, everyone agreed it was a rip off.

    2. Suns had to give up 2 picks just to get out of Kurt Thomas' expiring contract, a vastly superior player to Kwame Brown but who also roughly making the same amount fo money.

    3. Rockets had to pay Memphis just for them to take Francis' expiring contract out of our hands.

    4. NY had to give up Jordan Hill, a swap and a pick just to get rid of Jared Jeffries' contract which would expire the year after the trade.

    So basically teams had to pay give up assets just to get rid of their unwanted players, even if that players were expiring. Yet somehow the Lakers are magically going to land an elite big man just because they want have Kwame freakin' Brown as an expiring. Get real.
     
  17. melo061

    melo061 Member

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2006
    Messages:
    125
    Likes Received:
    0
    So much of his legacy? Sorry but i'll have to disagree with you there. Kobe post Shaq has won 2 championships, 2 finals mvp, 5 all nba teams, 5 all nba first defensive teams, 2 allstar mvp's, and an average of around 30-5-5.

    Kobe as the 2nd fiddle

    2 all nba first teams
    3 all nba defensive team
    3 championships
    1 allstar mvp

    I'm sorry, but Kobe's producitivity post Shaq alone is better than most players resume.


    Kobe has proven he can put up franchise numbers and win as both a 1st and 2nd option. I think that enhances his status as a player.
     
  18. goodbug

    goodbug Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2002
    Messages:
    2,863
    Likes Received:
    32
    Grizzles were on track to back to back 20 wins season with Gasol when they traded them. Bulls didn't want to part away their youngs because they didn't value Gasol very high.

    Laugh stock for what? It wasn't like they're a worse team without him.

     
  19. Steve_Francis_rules

    Joined:
    Dec 11, 1999
    Messages:
    8,467
    Likes Received:
    300

    Maybe next time you decide to be a douche, you should at least make sure you're not flat out wrong.

    You say there have been plenty of stupid trades and then go on listing them. At the end of that list you have "Carlos Boozer for free." That means you think (or at least you are writing) that Carlos Boozer was traded for free (or "nothing").
     
  20. plutoblue11

    plutoblue11 Member

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2006
    Messages:
    10,526
    Likes Received:
    1,009
    Wow, Dwyer what a great choice for MVP?
     

Share This Page

  • About ClutchFans

    Since 1996, ClutchFans has been loud and proud covering the Houston Rockets, helping set an industry standard for team fan sites. The forums have been a home for Houston sports fans as well as basketball fanatics around the globe.

  • Support ClutchFans!

    If you find that ClutchFans is a valuable resource for you, please consider becoming a Supporting Member. Supporting Members can upload photos and attachments directly to their posts, customize their user title and more. Gold Supporters see zero ads!


    Upgrade Now