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JVG: A Great Coach

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by DaneB, Jan 11, 2007.

  1. rockbox

    rockbox Around before clutchcity.com

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    Ditto.

    Until he brings us a championship like Rudy did, he's just another Del Harris.
     
  2. ShadyMcGrady

    ShadyMcGrady Member

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    JVG saved T-Mac, or in other words, our season.

    When T-Mac got back he was healthy but he was rusty and sucking.

    JVG allegedly told T-Mac before the Hawks game that just go out and have fun. Forget about who he used to be, what he could be, what he should be and just play ball.

    Ever since then McGrady has been ROLLING (with the exception of the Lakers game). He hasn't scored less than 30 since then and they've won every game (with the exception of the Wolves game).

    I think JVG's substitutions, or lack thereof, are pretty hard to understand sometimes but mostly he's doing the right thing. He could tell Rafer to not shoot quite as many shots, but it's all good. Rafer takes decent/good shots he just misses.

    It's kind of hard to see what kind of coach he is unless we go in the lockerroom but I don't think he's had any trouble motivating a team who's lost their MVP-candidate center. He's always saying we have what it takes to win and he's prepared and all he asks for is defensive intensity. I'm sure all he did in halftime against the Bulls is ask the team to step up the intensity and they responded and we got a huge road win.

    We're 23-13 and we've been missing Yao for a while. Not bad. It will only get better when Yao gets back.

    That said, I don't think he can be a great coach until he wins a ring. Just like great players, almost.
     
  3. SuperS32

    SuperS32 Member

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    I like to think he's changed somewhat during his time in Houston. When he first came, it was all about his system and trying to replicate that Knicks team that went to the Finals as a No. 8 seed. He even went as far as acquiring players that were on those teams like Mason and Charlie Ward, and using the same coaching staff.

    Now it seems that, although he still has a "system" that stresses team defense and still prefers veterans to developing youth, he'll play a guy like Luther Head regularly and let a guy like Rafer play through a shooting slump.

    I think it was a smart move on Les Alexander's part to wait until the end of the season to decide on an extension for Van Gundy (almost as smart as selling the Comets...almost). If this team stays relatively healthy (i.e. Yao and Tmac are both at least 90%) come playoff time and the Rockets are still going one and done in the playoffs, there needs to be a change. But I don't think that will be a problem this year, at least from what I've seen.
     
  4. TMac#1

    TMac#1 Member

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    This is a very good coaching job by JVG to have this team playing insipred, great basketball while Yao is out. Considering all of the adversity, I awould have to give Van Gundy coach of the year at this point.

    He is one of the better coaches in the league, but until he wins a title hecan't be called great. I honestly think this is the best team in the NBA and we will go deep into the playoffs and he'll get the extension.
     
  5. Old Man Rock

    Old Man Rock Contributing Member

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    Excellent post! Tmac is clearly a major blessing for him because he runs the show for him and he can put most of his emphasis on D. I would add that this Rockets team has alot more talent than people realize and JVG not only needed his type of players but he needed a high level of talent in those players to be successful. Lets not forget last year given back a star player in Yao for the playoff run with a group of mediocre players and the Rockets could not keep out of the lottery.

    But I give JVG his due in spite of the fact that I don't care much for his personna. The team is playing well now and he deserves some credit for that. I believe it was Doug Moe who said he always new he was never as great as his fans would suggest or as lousy as his critics cried out. So I think it's safe to say Jeffy isn't the messiah but he never really was Jeff Van r****d either. Or at least not in terms of coaching.
     
  6. Almu

    Almu Member

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    This is like pulling molars.
     
  7. wingz0

    wingz0 Member

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    How so?

    I think we should reserve our opinion on JVG just yet. Although I've always defended him when the haters come out, we should wait and see. A good coach wins games, a very good coach wins playoff series, a great coach wins championships. I think right now JVG is merely bordering on a very good coach. His teams are always prepared to be sure, but he still needs to show the man management and adaptability ability to be considered truly elite.

    Right now, he's doing a good job of both of that imo, what with adjusting the offense on the fly without Yao, and motivating Tmac. Though the former might just be a case of a motivated Tmac creating offense like in the Orlando days.
     
  8. heypartner

    heypartner Member

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    What I love is all the players clearly love him as a coach and are competing for him. What he is doing with Alston during the horrid streak of shooting is another example of how he'll stick behind his players to get them to stick behind him. Whether I agree with benching Alston or not, that's beside my point...the point is, it just doesn't pay as much to bash a player when their down vs stand by them...just like what Rudy would do.

    Just read this series of quotes

    Rudy and JVG are different in the media and different on the court, but they both are straight up guys with their players and they stand by them, because they both know that works better than blaming the players and pulliing them like DaDakota.
     
  9. DonkeyMagic

    DonkeyMagic Member
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    Until he brings us a championship like Rudy did, he's just another Del Harris.


    i think thats a bit excessive.

    i also think people tend to overrate rudyT. i dont think its irrational to say that jvg is a better coach than rudy. I know thats heresy, but it also a reasonable statement.
     
  10. JeopardE

    JeopardE Member

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    Well, you'd say Rudy won two championships. But then you look at the fact that JVG came in to clean up Rudy's mess, and did with Steve Francis what Rudy couldn't (restore some order to the team and get to the playoffs). It's all subjective and I think people get too caught up in cliche'd opinions of what "defines" a great coach and what not. I think, for example, that Jerry Sloan is one of this league's greatest coaches, and if not for Jordan he ought to have a ring by now (hatred for the Jazz aside). OTOH, Pat Riley's Heat are a complete mess right now and apparently he never had a good handle on things before he took his "voluntary leave". But he won the championship last year. So is he a great coach or not? Avery Johnson inherited an extremely talented and deep Mavericks squad and rode them to great success early in his career. Yet he hasn't quite achieved what JVG has done (take an 8th seeded, clear underdog Knicks team to the conference finals). It's all subjective, and that argument could go on all day.

    I think coaches have to be evaluated season by season, or at most, based on their recent track record, and then their performance measured in relative terms to their contemporaries. Jeff Van Gundy has done a tremendous job this year, and so the kudos he's getting are well deserved in that regard.
     
  11. rockbox

    rockbox Around before clutchcity.com

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    Why is it excessive. Del Harris got a team that wasn't even .500 to the finals and beat the Lakers to do it. They also won 2 games against the celtics with Bird, Mchale and Parish.

    Del Harris also got to finals as an assistant just like Van Gundy. They have had comparable careers.

    How is Van Gundy a better coach than Rudy T. Because he won two more game than Rudy did the previous year with the same cast plus a more mature Yao. Remember, we had a pretty good record that year until Rudy got cancer. Did Van Gundy win a gold medal. Did Van Gundy win two championships? Did Van Gundy win games without TMac and Yao like Rudy did with the Lakers with no Shaq and Kobe out with a bum ankle? Did Van Gundy win a bronze at the World Championship with college and minor league players.

    I think you underestimate Rudy.
     
  12. DonkeyMagic

    DonkeyMagic Member
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    Well, you'd say Rudy won two championships. But then you look at the fact that JVG came in to clean up Rudy's mess, and did with Steve Francis what Rudy couldn't

    now i agree. I think people tend to only remember the 2 championships, but they forget what a horrible mess he put the rockets in later down the road. i.e. bad contracts, bad draft picks/decisions, etc

    people love to mention the championships, and they were great, but was it really rudy's great coaching that won those games? i dont think so.

    im not bashing rudy, but lets not put him on too high of a pedestal.
     
  13. rockbox

    rockbox Around before clutchcity.com

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    I am not saying Gundy isn't a good coach. I just think you forgot how good we had it what Rudy accomplished. Rudy only had 2 losing seasons ever and both were riddled with injuries. The first was Chucky and Dream went out, the second was when Francis had his migraines.
     
  14. BlakeB

    BlakeB Member

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    I'd say JVG is a borderline great coach, and I will call him one when he wins a title. He has done great as the Rockets coach building a team from the ruin that Rudy had brought (nothing against Rudy, he was a great coach but he did get us in a bind later on), and he has done great coaching the team this season. We have done great as a team, and in Yao's absence have actually managed to improve as a team and go 7-2.

    I agree with the notion that the Rockets have grown and become better working as a team since Yao's been out and have since really started to click. I also agree that once Yao gets back things are just going to get even better. I'm really excited about our season and just nearly 3 weeks ago things looked grim with Yao going out.
     
  15. DonkeyMagic

    DonkeyMagic Member
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    I just think you forgot how good we had it what Rudy accomplished. Rudy only had 2 losing seasons ever and both were riddled with injuries.

    fair enough. but the rockets were still playoff-less for a long time. sure, they hovered around .500 for a few years but thats harldy impressive. Although maybe im being a little harsh b/c of the flat out dumb moves made in the early 00's.
     
  16. DonkeyMagic

    DonkeyMagic Member
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    true. just for giggles, go back and look at that team. Ouch. The rockets were talent depleted...and they are still recovering to this day.
     
  17. Old Man Rock

    Old Man Rock Contributing Member

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    Hey Blind Donkey wakeup and smell your jack-ass. It is true the Rockets originally were player depleted. What did you expect after winning 2 championships and then losing Drexler Barkley and Hakeem for practically nothing. But by the time Van Gundy took over Rudy had amassed Yao Francis and Mobley. ANd Francis and Mobley = Tmac. That is not a depleted team. After 3 years they were still recovering from Van Gundy's idiotic player decisions. He rebuilt this team twice and had nothing more to show for the team than Yao and Tmac. No other coach in his time span has made as many personnel changes and what was left was a lottery team. I might add CD and Morey did a pretty good job in one season after finally taking it out of Van Blunder's hands. Say what you will about Van Genius the coach he has proven to be Van r****d the GM when it has come to personnel decisions.
     
  18. Outlier

    Outlier Member

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    Your hatred for JVG is amusing... it's really made you stupid and tough. So tough that you have to call other people names because they don't agree. Because they don't agree with your blind hate. Blind hate that spawns from your stupidity. It's a cycle, really.
     
  19. Hiroshikun

    Hiroshikun Member

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    Bad contracts are all Rudy faults, and in the case JVG its all GM faults. That is blatant double standard if you ask me. Yes, I do think Rudy is more active the most in terms recruiting is concerned, I cannot believe JVG doesn't put input himself when personnel decision making process.

    Having said that, I am happily surprised by the record JVG has been able to put up since Yao went down. Even a big detractor like myself is absolutely dumbfounded as to how we find ourselves winning 8 of last 9 games. You don't have 9 teams playing bad balls, and win them. Maybe one, but its when 9 teams play bad, then there got to be something there. You got to give credit to JVG, for keeping things close, and putting the team in a situation where we can win games. Our defense has been solid all along, and at times, downright stifling. And Battier acquisition has been huge. His help defense and positioning has been top drawer - JVG fingerprint written all over if you ask me.

    I have to admit, JVG has probably left his biggest detractors gaping their mouths open. He brought in right personnel during the off-season, and harnessed them into a cohesive unit. That is solid coaching IMO, given the adversities, and infusion of new talents he had to deal with.

    But ultimately coaches will judged by their success in the playoffs. The jury is still out there, but JVG makes a good case for the coach of year IMO.
     
  20. Darrinlane

    Darrinlane Member

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    OMR...did JVG eat your kids or something? Why all the hate? If we lose it's his fault. If we win....It's despite him because of all our great talent.
     

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