I mean NYC is a better place for Upton's career as model and spinning that into other arena's rather than staying in Houston, especially if they are trying to balance family life and kids. Also, legacies regarding staying in one place are no longer important to athletes. I mean teams will always cut bait if it is in their benefit, so athletes are just doing the same thing. If anything that is kind of true in most highly skilled industries nowadays.
Verlander’s first choice was without a doubt to stay in Houston, so the career and preferences of Upton had no impact on this decision unless it was Mets vs Dodgers at the end. Ultimately his preference to stay here wasn’t large enough to overcome the divide between the Astros offer and the Mets.
Far too many folks here are far too comfortable losing the single best pitcher in baseball last year and assuming we can just plug in someone like Brown or rely on Framber or Javier to pick up that slack. Dusty said as much yesterday at the Winter Meetings - JV was an automatic 7 innings bullpen saver. Having a workhorse like him was absolutely the lynchpin of our amazing bullpen. It’s the reason we won the damn thing. Now that doesn’t mean Jim should’ve matched - that’s simply not a contract a team like the Astros make. It’s 100% a Mets move. But let’s not delude ourselves into thinking our pitching dominance is simply going to pick up right where we left off like we didn’t just lose the most dominant pitcher from the year before. We won’t.
Our pitching was likely gonna take a step back even if we brought Verlander back, most of us already accepted that. Verlander could have an amazing season and his ERA will be a full run higher. It's why Crane paid Montero and is addressing the offense to give us breathing room to work in Brown.
It probably has something to do with the fact that he was the worst pitcher on the roster during the playoffs and guys like Brown, Framber, and Javier were already having to pick up his slack. A team that wants to win the world series shouldn't pay 43 million dollars a year for a 40 year old pitcher who already has nothing left in the tank by the time the playoffs come around. It's a much better idea to spend that money on bats
Losing JV will hurt. There will be times that starters don't go 6 innings multiple times in a short span. There will be times that the bullpen gets taxed There will be times that the staff gets thin due to injuries. But all teams go through that. Right now this team has: Framber: 1st team All MLB who is a proven 200 IP workhorse. McCullers: a 29 year old former All Star who has a career 3.35 FIP and 118 ERA+ W/ 10.0 K/9 Javier: A 26 year old wonder kid who has not had any injury issues, has started 2 no hitters including 1 in the World frigging Series, and still has not peaked. Urquidy: A 28 year old dependable innings eater, ideal #4 or 5 SP with career 1.11 ERA+ and no injury red flags. Garcia: A still inconsistent but high upside 26 year old with no injury red flags and a 114 career ERA+ ( has been above average all 3 MLB seasons) Brown: A 24 year old JV clone. At 24, JV was 18-6 with a 125 ERA+ despite leading the AL in WP and HBP ( which will likely be an issue as Brown is still young and learning) PLUS A bullpen that returns every pitcher that threw a pitch in a historically good 2022 playoffs, is 5 deep in closer capable arms, and threw 35 fewer innings than any other bullpen in MLB. No doubt there will be trying times but no team is better equipped to weather the storm.
It would be HUGE if LMJ can get back to his 2021 form. If he can, I really like having Framber, Javier and LMJ at the top of our rotation (especially in the playoffs).
THIS: Seems to be a lot of MEH. Whatever thought processes here. Dude was an innings eater and a streak buster. That said. 2/86? eesh. That is not compatible with the Astros recipe for success. On the bright side. Maybe now we win game 1 of the world series finally? DOH - Yea I said it.
New York Media Love to Blame their Own Players or Wives, Girlfriend. Kate Upton wants Attention she'll get it in a Negative way if Justin Verlander Struggles.
New York Papers made Alex Rodriguez a punching bag and literally with bad titles and Screwing up their face into a rat. New York Media is disgusting, look at Kyrie Irving bring bullied.
I’ll need to hear some sort of report that he’s back throwing his fastball with regularity at 95+ to have some optimism as far as LMJ goes. It’s far more likely that the flexor injury that was able to avoid surgery has changed his pitching approach for good. Sinker/slider/changeup to righties… curveball exclusively to lefties. The occasional 4 seam fastball to keep it in their minds, but no longer a primary pitch by any means. The Astros can easily weather the loss of JV if one of the either happens: Garcia takes a Framber 2020-like leap in improvement (could definitely happen), or Brown has a 2001 Oswalt-like rookie season (not as dominant, but somebody who definitely doesn’t look like a rookie). Will be important to ensure Javier can stay fresh enough throughout a long season… and pray that Framber doesn’t have any random comebackers that hit him in the hand/leg.
His fastball didn't drop off much last season (less than 1MPH from 20/21), and that was after an extended layoff. He had already ceased to be a primary fastball pitcher in 21 and he had a great season. You didn't like it when people said too much about Verlander's bad playoff outings, but it seems you, and other people, are doing the same thing to LMJ. In the 8 regular season starts, and the first playoff start against Seattle, he was sensational. Still striking people out, same BA against and a low exit velocity. I'm sure he'll miss time like he always does, by need or design, but aside from those 2 bad games there's no real reason to think he will be bad in the 130 or so innings he does provide.
If you looks at his breakdown, he’s a different pitcher post injury… and admitted as much prior to the LCS (especially to LHB). And I was noticing this long before the playoffs even started. Maybe with more of an off-season and further healing of the ligament we see some more consistency in command/pitch choices, but I do expect him to do what it takes to avoid further injury (even if his approach is altered). The fastball you’re citing is actually the sinker… and its usage rate did decline this year. He’s not a bad pitcher by any means, but I wouldn’t necessarily count on him to be the guy the Astros expected when they signed him for 5/75. Odds are he’s going to have to continue to adjust things depending on his performance level (or re-invent further, as some pitchers have been forced to do). As the Astros are ever quiet about injuries, I don’t think the full extent of how bad his injury was in the playoffs last year was truly revealed till he finally started talking about it. I’m also not as low on him as Keith Law is (possible fifth starter-ish at best).
This right here. By a few metrics last years was the best or 2nd best seasons of Verlanders' career. It would be hard to replicate no matter what.
Altuve didn't take a discount to stay with the Astros. He cashed in on an MVP year when he wasn't a free agent. You could easily make the case in reverse - Crane has lots of money. Why not pay fair market value to the guy who turned his franchise around and helped him win multiple WS? You could definitively say the Astros had their best years while he was here. Why is it always players that are expected to take discounts for billionaire owners? Astros made the best decision for themselves. Verlander made the best decision for himself. There are no bad guys here. Same as the Correa situation.
Look I never said there was a bad guy here. Let me just say I appreciate everything JV did. I have nothing against the guy. Like I said it's his right to get the most money he can. In his interviews after the World Series Games he said he was in a different place in his life. This team meant so much to him. Dusty staying longer with him so he could finally get that elusive World Series Win. He was more of a teammate with this squad. All I meant was why leave the perfect situation for more money. Again it's his right to do so. Going for the 300 wins. You just won 18 games and with Abreu signing a good chance to win that much again. I mean and a great chance to add another ring to your legacy. At the end of the day maybe I'm just a disappointed fan that hoped he would come back.
Players don’t tend to see these things in the moment. Let’s say the Astros final offer was 2 years 70 million. That’s 16 million short of the Mets at a minimum. That kind of money almost never gets turned down.
On Ben Verlanders podcast, him saying Justin told him how much he’s watched the Mets from afar and their commitment to winning and something he wanted to be apart of, blah blah blah - yeah it’s called 86.6 million dollars
JV was irreplaceable, even with JV. We had to upgrade elsewhere just to stay even. That's Abreu at 1B. Montero was maintaining the bull pen and maintenance isn't cheap. But to improve we need more at another position and our choices are C, CF and DH. But even these aren't helped too much with an average player.
