The shrine doesn't belong to Al Sadr. No matter what they do there, no one has a right to attack the shrine. he shrine does NOT belong to Al Sadr.. The shrine is holy to Shi'ite Muslims all ovre the world - those who agree with Al Sadr's actions and those who don't.
Looks like Sadr is back to his old tricks again, take a couple days off and re-group then fight again.
You're acting like this shouldn't even a discussion. Look what they're talking about from the article linked above: A raid of the shrine is actually being discussed, so I think it's still a very pertinent question.
I agree that would be best. But according to Sane and Cohen: I'm assuming "no one" includes the Iraqi military.
Not for me. If the Iraqi military wants to take that on their heads, that is their perogative. If al-Sadr wants to continue to fight from there, we should back up the Iraqis, but this is their country, their countrymen, and should be their operation.
see, this is an opinion from the other side I agree with. I appreciate you having an opinion with sound validity which your extremist breatheren are quiet on... The Iraqi government should be spearheading this, they seem to be calling the shots, and making difficult, yet careful choices...
This war is FOR Iraqi people... What good would you be doing blowing up the shrine which is so sacred to them? Zero sense blowing up the shrine. When I say "no one" I mean NO ONE has a right to blow up the shrine, not the president of the United States, not the president of Iraq, not any religious leader, no one.
Sane, It is war, if your enemy is holed up somewhere and you know it.....you have every right to blow that building up. I do agree that it is for the Iraqis to fight, and that is what will ultimately happen when we leave. DD
first of all i thought this war was about kicking the hussein regime out of power and rebuilding iraq with a new democratic government. Obviously if you do that there will be some local insurgents that would not take that measure to kindly and would fight back( what we have going on right now basically). The rest of the country is riding out the storm and waiting for what they thought the U.S. would bring them, peace. With this in mind, WHY THE HELL WOULD YOU WANT TO BLOW UP A PLACE OF WORSHIP BECAUSE OF INSURGENTS HIDING OUT THERE? It will piss off the sect of the country that basically has nothing to do with the war itself. Use proper negotiations, capture the insurgents, leave the shrine alone. The United States has already destroyed half of the country and are in the "rebuilding phase" of their attacks, so you say its a-ok to go around and just blow up an ancient shrine that is however many years old and the iraqis be ok with it. Get with the program, that move right there will keep the armed services in Iraq for alot longer of a time period than they are already expected are to be.
Shrine standoff appears near resolution Al-Sadr loyalists move to hand control to moderate Shiite leader NAJAF, Iraq - The two-week-old uprising centered on this city's holy shrine appeared to be heading toward resolution Friday. Iraq’s highest Shiite cleric, Grand Ayatollah Ali al-Husseini al-Sistani, agreed to take control of the Iman Ali Shrine, which rebel Shiite cleric Muqtada al-Sadr’s militia turned into a stronghold and refuge during their fight with U.S. forces. One al-Sadr aide said the keys to the shrine could be handed over later Friday to religious authorities under al-Sistani, though details were still being worked out. Iraq's Interior Ministry had said Mahdi Army militia had left the shrine, but an Associated Press reporter in the compound said that wasn't the case. By nightfall, al-Sadr’s fighters remained in control of the shrine, but they were no longer bringing their weapons inside the walled compound of the holy site, the reporter said. Many armed militiamen were still circulating in the Old City district outside the shrine, but as they entered the compound they left their guns with comrades outside, then reclaimed them as they exited, the reporter said. No weapons were visible inside the shrine, the AP reporter added. It was not known whether any weapons were hidden inside, though militant leaders denied they had hidden any. Arrest claim Sporadic gunfire and occasional explosions were heard in the city Friday evening, but far less than previous nights. Earlier Friday, Iraqi Interior Ministry spokesman Sabah Kadhim said police had entered the shrine and arrested 400 armed militants without incident. But al-Sadr commander, Ahmed al-Shaibany, claimed that "the shrine is in the control of the Mahdi Army. The Mahdi Army will resist any attempt by the Iraqi police to control the shrine." Al-Shaibany added, however, that "procedures are under way to hand over control of the shrine to Ayatollah Ali al-Sistani." The moves came after a day and night of fighting in Najaf that killed 77 people and wounded 70 others, as al-Sadr militiamen mortared a police station and U.S. warplanes carried out bombing raids. Al-Sistani steps in Al-Sistani's office also said discussions were under way on the handover of control. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5685031/
Well it doesn't appear that the shrine crisis is over. Sadly with the hundreds or thousands of Shiites trying to act as human shields confronting the US tanks, it sort of looks like Tiannemen Square, the Soviet tanks crushing resistance in Hungary in 1956 or Prague in 1968. This time it is us. Sad day for the Spirit of 76. Good article that addresses among other points the perennial "Arabs/ Muslims hate us anyway" of Hayes and others. ******* ....Some of my readers have suggested to me that it doesn't matter what Americans do, since Muslims hate them anyway. This statement is silly. Most Muslims never hated the United States per se. In 2000, 75 percent of Indonesians rated the US highly favorably. The U.S. was not as popular in the Arab world, because of its backing for Israel against the Palestinians, but it still often had decent favorability ratings in polls. But all those poll numbers for the US are down dramatically since the invasion of Iraq and the mishandling of its administration afterwards. Only 2 percent of Egyptians now has a favorable view of the United States. It doesn't have to be this way. The US is behaving in profoundly offensive ways in Najaf. U.S. military leaders appear to have no idea what Najaf represents. I saw one retired general on CNN saying that they used to have to be careful of Buddhist temples in Vietnam, too. I almost wept. Islam is not like Buddhism. It is a far tighter civilization. And the shrine of Ali is not like some Buddhist temple in Vietnam that even most Buddhists have never heard of.... Juancole.com ******** Senior Muslim figures back Iraqi insurgents Ninety-three prominent Muslim figures opposed to US troops in Iraq have called on Muslims around the world to support resistance to US forces and to the Iraqi government installed in June link Iraqi national guard members reluctant to fight Mahdi Army ....Back at the station, at least, Majeed was among comrades who share his desire to serve Iraq and his shame of being labeled a U.S. collaborator. All the guardsmen arrive for work in civilian clothes to conceal their jobs from their neighbors. After receiving threats, many take elaborate steps to convince the Mahdi Army they've quit. When the latest al-Sadr uprising broke out in early August, their fears escalated. They were ordered to retake control of police stations seized by the militia. Soon after, Majeed said, some of his most seasoned guardsmen stopped showing up for work. Though troops at the station don't expect to be deployed to Najaf, they must still fight the Mahdi Army in Sadr City, where insurgents have lined the streets with hidden bombs and daily gun battles fill the local hospital with the wounded. At the station last week, several recruits stood outside Majeed's office, debating their predicament. Some said they don't consider al-Sadr's militiamen true Shiites and have no problem facing them. Most, however, said they would turn in their guns rather than fire at familiar faces. "The Mahdi Army is, after all, Iraqi," said Sgt. 1st Class Emad Ali, 26, who comes from Sadr City. "These are my cousins, my uncles, my brothers. This is not an enemy. This is family." link Ever notice how out Iraqis that we get to fight for us don't have too heavy of weaponry? I think we are afraid they will turn it on us or give it to their relatives to use against us. I read another article wherein a US military commander estimated it will take 10 years to put the insurgency down. Sorry can't find it now. Still time for some of you guys to volunteer. If it lasts half that long you can avoid volunteering and just be drafted.
Tear gas people.. tear gas. Or hey, knock 'em out with the ol' sleeping gas. Then send in the guys with the zip-tie handcuffs.
Well the happy Iraqi scenario that some of you bought into hasn't panned out. Most Iraqis just want us to leave immediately. How many can we kill in the name of democracy? Or is the drill to now claim that Sadr's men holed up in the shrine pose an imminent threat to the United States?
