What are y'all taking about? Jordan's been doing good this season. 15 ppg, 46% FG, 4 rpg, 3 apg, 1.5 spg. All in only 27 minutes per game. Yeah, he's really doing horrible. Those are sixth man of the year numbers.
Drexlerfan- Look, MJ is the best player of all time in everyone's opinion besides yours. I went to the game last night to see MJ and I was disapointed. Do you want me to explain how and why he is the best or isnt it understood? What did you expect from watching the game last night.
Heh, you could also bring up the other guy that's usually brought up in "better than Jordan" discussions: Oscar "I averaged a triple double" Robertson". Personally, I'd take Wilt as the best player ever, but I admit that I'm biased in favor of centers
How do you define a player as the best? The best stats? no thats not quite good enough because stats can be misleading... how about the most dominating player compared to his peers in the leauge at the time. Well while Jordan Certinatly has been dominating... Wilt was much more dominating... Nothing compares to the 100 point game... Jordan never got a 100 point game... Wilt did... he was completly unstopable.... The problem is they are not apart of the same generaion. if only they could have played against each other... oh well... but thats my two cents
Its mixing dominance and winning. Wilt only had 2 championships, but was the most dominant player ever. Jordan had 6 straight championships, and was the second most dominant player ever. This is just a guess, but if he never left for the minor leagues, he would have had 8 straight championships. It's still not a discussion in my mind. The saddest part about his 50.4 year is, his team didn't even win the championship!
since basketball is a team game, it is probably better to discuss which is the best team than who is the best player. Sometimes, the best player makes his teammates better, other times, it is the other way around. Why not just all agree both jordan and chamberlain are great, and people enjoy watching them very much. I know I do, I haven't watch much of chamberlain games, but I certainly enjoy jordan game ever since he came back. And I got to watch the wizards a lot, because I am near the DC area. It is not easy to once be at the best team and the best player, and now have to be in a mediocre team and be a mediocre player. I think it is just not fair to compare people playing at different time period. it is like comparing a contemparory physicist to issac newton, probably most modern day physicists know everything newton ever known, but can we say they are all smarter than newton? newton was the one who had bring something new to the table. it is how he changes the ways people see nature that makes him a great scientist.
Here are Jordan's game-by-game numbers for the season. http://www.nba.com/playerfile/michael_jordan/game_by_game_stats.html While he's nowhere near the player he once was, just about any NBA team would love to have these stats coming off the bench. I know the Rockets would. His game isn't declining anywhere near where Hakeem's was at the end of his career. I'm moving this because the thread appears to be a "who's the best ever/Michael Jordan thread" instead of anything really Rockets-related.
Of course, I wanted the Rockets to win, but it was probably the last chance any of us will get to see the best player ever, and i was disapointed with his performance Also, why the hell did they move this thread?
Well, a discussion on the best team ever might not last very long. It's kinda tough to argue against the 60s Celtics, especially considering how watered down the league is now. (And if you don't believe the league is watered down, read Sam Smith's article which suggests contraction of the league: http://espn.go.com/nba/columns/smith_sam/1460677.html) Three posts about how Jordan is the greatest, and not one fact yet. Seriously man, I was just saying it can be argued. I think Wilt is the best ever. As Andy Sheets pointed out, I could also ague that Oscar was the best ever. Wanna go best player on the best team? Bill Russel. You seem to be saying that it is wrong to think that anyone but Jordan is the best ever. Think about that. Do you seriously believe that? It's indisputable? If you do I may as well just stop thinking for myself and blindly follow the opinions of the masses, right?
Don't mean to cut in here, but I don't consider Jordan the best player ever either...He is among the best players ever, he is the most ref-protected and hyped player ever...but not the best. And I know many knowledgeable basketball fans who concur.... Anyways, carry on....
Hehe. Kind of off topic, but Jordon Jockers have a pathetic mentality: Last night, Clutch(the mascot) was walking around on stilts, waving a flag that had a drawing of an old man with a cane and "#23" drawn on it. A Jordon Jocker, obvioulsy allready distressed over his hero's mediocre outing, gets up and pushes Clutch down from behind. Talk about a jocker. He resorts to violence when MJ is mocked. I thought it was fake until an usher escorted him out and saw how pissed the jocker was. Of course, it could have been over blowing fifty bucks for that Kwame Brown jersey he was wearing...
Does anybody have any confirmation on whether that was fake or not? I thought it was fake too, but wasn't sure. Clutch does a great job continuing the act like his legs are broken, but who knows??? Btw, put me on Wilt's side on the debate. I firmly believe in the good big man over good small man theory, and Wilt was dominant beyond belief.
Ah, yet another greatest ever debate. What we have here is a difference of opinions, not of fact- because greatness is not a fixed term that can easily be ascertained by a necessary criteria, because there's no such necessary criteria! A factoid is a type of first order knowledge: which may be immediately apprehended through perception, knowledge that is nearly incontrovertible and indisputable, and a bedrock of scientific hypothesis. However, an opinion is rather a second order knowledge, the sort that is an inference of what is immediate, and this act of inferring is very dependent upon certain factors the individual already holds- such as feelings, dispositions, presuppositions, psychological characteristics, range of experience, etc. Because the criteria that defines greatness is nearly always dependent upon the beholder's beliefs, it is an aesthetic term. When two people of different opinions on which player is the greatest try to persuade one another their view is correct, they have to step beyond their perspective (aesthetic sentiments) and try to draw on statements of authorities (i.e. NBA players, coaches, scouts, etc) facts (statistics) and personal experience (watching them play). This is a tricky endeavor because it is up to the individual to adopt a certain criteria on what makes a player great. This is usually what boils down these sort of debates. Since "greatness" is a subjective term entirely contingent upon the person's presuppositions, it is never a scientific enterprise. No matter how many people agree on a subjective term, it is easily disputed and debated. This is why there is no science of ethics, no science of art, because the rigid framework of the sciences is alien and foreign to the subjectivity of the human emotions. If you're asking me, i'm going with Wilt Chamberlain over Michael Jordan. Drexlerfan22 will explain why, and he has a history of doing an excellent job. ~Radical subjectivity~
And you are speaking on behalf of everybody else on the BBS? In the World? You better not be, because I certainly don't think he is the best ever. He is definately one of the greats, that I can agree with and I think nearly everyone in the world can agree with. But to say everybody but Drexler22 thinks that Jordan is the BOAT is very arrogant and presumptuous (sp?) on your part.
People say Jordan is the best because they saw him play growing up, and they like to believe they were there to see the greatest player ever play. Meanwhile, people who grew up watching othehr players like to believe they saw the best player ever while they were growing up. Meanwhile, I vote for Magic.
Best player or not, he was still considered the top athlete of the 20th century by espn's sport century. And this of all athletes so that says something in itself, and I just don't feel it's right to compare people from the past to people of the present. They got us here which we should be thankful for but they just simply are not even on the same level as the players of today.
The espn sports century list means nothing. It's 100% hype. Notice Jordan was also rated as the top rated college b-ball player ever? Any reasonable person can tell you that's just not true. In 1950, a poll for the greatest athletes of the last 50 years was taken, and Jim Thorpe was #1. In 1999, Thorpe was voted behind Babe Ruth (Thorpe #6, Babe #2). The experts that saw both play clearly stated Thorpe was the better athlete. Why did it change? HYPE. All hype.
