Speaking of confidence - if you'll notice, the two players on this team with the most confidence, Yao Ming and Luther Head, are also the two humblest players on the team. They also share another common trait -- they are basically the two hardest workers on the team. Yao is always first to practice and last to leave. Everytime I read about Luther they talk about how much time he spends in practice working on his game. Maybe our Greek superstar wannabe could take a page from those two.
I suggested sending Span to the D-League even posted a topic on it and most who responded seemed to feel that it was a stupid thought. I pretty much figured JVG was going to do this though.
hmm. i was pretty much neutral on this comment until this... a) vspan doesnt fit the system. im iffy on this point, since this team (read: jvg) has its system, and the players must fit themselves to it. somewhat of a necessity to provide structure, but i've always believed that successful coaches manage their team in a way that is geared toward each player's strength, rather than trying to fit a square peg into a round hole (ex. vspan at the 2) b) vspan doesn't comprehend how to play within this system. i think he comprehends very well how to play in this system, since let's be real here it's not a very complicated system by any means, but again its putting him at the 2 that baffles me. he knows that at the 2 he's supposed to be a spot up shooter, which he is definitely NOT, so why not put him at the 1 to create for teammates when we need a spark? doesn't have to be a ton of minutes, but his abilities as a perimeter defender at least warrant more pt than he's been afforded (strayed away from the word 'given' since everyone's been harping on the fact that 'no one is GIVEN pt in the nba'). anyway, i don't know if vspan will ever be 'lighting it up in practice nailing jumpshots' since that's not his game, nor do i think he'll be overly successful taking it to the hole 'on mutumbo' since we all know mt mutumbo owns the paint and rejects even legit superstars in the L. bottom line? we wouldnt have 1907091809841237 threads on vspan if we didn't have the worst starting pg in the nba.
yes, and he's all about trying to show flashes and give what he thinks the fans want, and sadly, it is usually more harm than good. Someone asked earlier about V-Span being on the court while Rockets give up leads? That's one of the main reasons to begin with. The Rockets were giving up big leads and Spanoulis was the PG during that time turning the ball over. Spanoulis was the backup 1 when he was getting playing time here. We had some sort of a 3-4 man guard rotation and he always spelt Rafer early. Spanoulis has not played well when he's in and for whoever said that he played well in the preseason?? He was the biggest disappointment for Clutchfans here because of his turnover prone self. To turn the ball over that many times just doesn't cut it in the NBA. If you want to win, you have to watch the showing off stuff a little more carefully. In addition, you're going to kill chemistry by putting in someone who's not doing anything constructional, especially a rookie. This guy is whining because he's the "T-Mac of Greece." He apparently felt the pressure of the Greek community looking upon him and is voicing out his displeasure. Yao started the same way, a bench player spelling Cato; that is, until he went off game after game. Yao didn't voice his displeasure. He wanted to play, believe me. What do you hear about Yao nowadays? Always the first one to practice, the first one in the weight room, the last one out, etc etc etc. Spanoulis is the big P, the big potential that needs to work out his raw game in the NBA style of play. In Greece, those highlights, have you seen his speed during those drives? Those are real-time drives and his quick first step might not be enough if he's slow to the basket. He's a creator there, and we tried to put him in that position. He was making rookie mistakes, so he's asked to develop a shot. In turns, he's now blaming the coaching staff of trying to make him into a spotup shooter? He can't play as a guard if he can't friggin shoot, and he's not doing it well. THIS IS THE NBA! Can you imagine what will happen if you're known as a bad shooter PG? People like TJ Ford, etc would do much better and did once they develop half a shot, because no defense will respect your shot unless you start making them. How can a playmaker make plays if the defenders plays back to your penetration possession after possession? As for the people saying we have enough spotup shooters with Head/Battier/Padgett/Novak, this team centers around Yao and T-Mac! You'll want whoever else that's open with the ball to be able to nail that jumper. That usually means 3 other players or they will rotate off of that player. Padgett and Novak has not exactly been money with the shot lately and they are defensive liabilities at the 4 position. Spanoulis/Rafer needs to both work on that shot, and as of now, Spanoulis doesn't seem to feel that it's necessary. All it comes down to is this. As an NBA "professional" player, you suck it up when things don't go your way. You don't whine your way into the rotation and the fans really should not condone that. Both Billy and Rafer obviously have stuff to work on, including shot selection, shooting percentage, PG skills and much more. Rafer is trying to develop that shot, although unsuccessfully lately when he shoots it off his dribble, but Spanoulis is openly critical about working on it. How can he be T-Mac if he can't pull up for a consistant jumper? How can he expect to play when he isn't sure whether he should shoot or pass or what not when he gets the ball? When the double team surrounded Yao half the time Billy was in and the ball rotated to him. He hesitated and tried to dribble and do the job himself. The NBA rotation is much faster than European play, and he's lost out there once people don't fall for his pump-fake. Why would people fall for a pump fake when they would love for you to shoot to begin with? Billy Spanoulis needs to understand that the league catches up to you in a hurry, and he will need to improve ALL THE TIME in order to stay on top of it. NOT ONCE did he put it upon himself to work harder in his complaints. I'm not even talking about playing better, but about WORKING harder. I don't know where one of you gets the idea that JVG don't hold many practices, because that is anything but true. Spanoulis needs to show something for him to be played. He needs to show a determination, and all I see is him finger pointing because he's not getting PT.
I really don't know why people are saying he was put in at the 2. Only when Rafer subs back in the game was he put in the 2. Lately, he's playing garbage minutes, so Lucas is in the game as well and he was handling the ball more because he's not as TO prone in the past. When you're playing garbage minutes, you will put 5 players that u wouldn't mind getting injured as much as others. In this case, it's usually Lucas, Spanoulis, Padgett, Novak, Hayes (mostly because there isn't much of another choice) They're young (cept padgett) and could have a chance to prove something. When Spanoulis was in that brief stint in the rotation, he came in handling the ball and guarding opposing PGs. We were all praising him for the job he was doing defensively at times laterally. He had a chance ANd he will get another chance. Once he gets that other chance, he better show some major improvement by WORKING HARD off the court. It should bother anyone and everyone that he's pointing a finger at everyone but himself. If he is at least semi-patient and work on his OBVIOUS faults, his next chance will come sooner than later and he will stay in the rotation. Yao did the same thing. Heck, Mickey Mantle was sent to the minors after his first stint. In bball terms, people like Ben Wallace played his way out of the rotation once in Orlando, and the entire Rockets 94 championship team's starting 5 sans Olajuwon was pretty much a nobody at one time too.
what are you talking about? what assumptions did i make? i never said vpsan was the savior. i never assumed that vspan would play better if given the minutes. i clearly said that until vspan actually plays, we are all guessing. i also think i said pretty plainly that if vspan ever gets 1 game with rafer's minutes and flops, then that is enough evidence to make me stop whining. me saying there is no reliable evidence to judge vspan on is not an assumption, its a fact. even if you disagree about the validity of that fact, its still not an assumption, it just becomes an opinion. the only assumption i made was that having more minutes would be a better way to gauge vspan. me saying that feigen's article was poorly written has nothing to do with my opinion being different. i agree that vspan should shut up and play better, but its impossible to play better when you're not playing at all. i said feigen's article was poorly written because he couldn't do the simple task of getting facts straight and presenting examples to backup his assertions. reread what i wrote; i dont recall making any assumptions about anything. unless your definition of assumption is 'supporting an opinion with an analysis of the facts.'
Go to popcornmachine.net. Find the Rockets gameswhere V-Span played, and look at the gameflows. There's your proof.
You don't have to play in the NBA to have cred! I said meaningful organized sports at all levels. Those of us who did play understand VSpan's frustrations. How many of us were riding the pines when we were playing even though we worked our behinds off? I was extremely lucky, I've had wonderful coaches so it didn't happen to me, but it happened to many of the players that I knew. The posters who are not down with Span for voicing his opinion seemed to think he has a bad attitude and full of himself. I don't see that at all, may be Vspan has not grasped the subtlety of the language, may be he can choose his words differently. For the last time and I think almost eveyone agrees with me on this: no one is saying start Vspan, even though Reefer is bringing tears to my eyes every time he teardrops the ball, we're just saying give VSpan the minutes at his natural position to see if he can help us and relief Reefer. If that doesn't work out than we all know that Vspan did get his FAIR chance!
Again with this system crap. Yeah, JVG system works when Yao/T-Mac are out on the floor. It works really well b/c there are players that require double teams and who can create. If anyone on this board honestly thinks his "SYSTEM" works when those players are out or on the bench then they are absolute morons. I've stated over and over again that we don't need shooters when Mac is on the bench. We need a slasher/creator and Rafer/JLIII has shown that they cannot create for their teammates. I don't mind Rafer starting, just not playing 30MPG, it's counterproductive! No one here is arguing that V-Span is a freaking superstar or should be starting. The argument is that he should be played at his true position and allowed to penetrate/create for his teammates when the offense becomes rather boring/stagnant with Mac on the bench. Yeah, he needs to check his ego and work to improve, but I highly doubt playing him 10-15 minutes a game is going to lose us games. Of course we have a winning record with Yao out but that's b/c we still have a superstar on the roster, ailing or not. Our record has more to do with T-Mac than it does Van Gundy. His 30pt streak blew out NJ/ATL/UT and he won games for us against MEM/SEA/CHI/SAC with his scoring and DEN/LAL with his passing. Houston could have easily been 7-0 in JAN heading into the Dallas game, but also could have been 2-6 going into the Dallas game if you include the Memphis GM they only won by 2pts. All of the games in JAN leading up to Dallas excluding UTAH/LAL were close games that came down to the 4th quarter. We lose those games and I guarantee people would be knocking down JVG door. Is V-Span really a step down from JLIII? Are our rotation players that bad that we give up double digit leads when Mac/Yao are not in the game? We all praise how much better the supporting cast is, so something's gotta give here. Either they're severly overmatched when Mac/Yao are out or the coach isn't doing his job to the best of his ability. That means he isn't altering his schemes when he has different personnel out there, and he isn't reigning in his shoot first PG. Where's the problem?
maybe i'm missing something but umm... since when has John Lucas III been a 13 year veteran? He's been playing in the NBA since he was 9?
your fact is based on the second sentence which is also an opinion it's ok to have your opinions. someone can disagree with you.
Oh please stop the YAO/V-Span comparisions. Yao showed much more promise his rookie year than V-Span ever will. We were in rebuilding mode so it was only right to play your #1 pick as much as you can. Also, Cato was the only C in front on Yao, so it's not like he had to leap frog over 3 other Centers to get the starting spot. Rudy T didn't even start Yao right away, he didn't get his chance until Cato was out of the lineup. V-Span was a 2nd round pick, why should we stop everything just to give him some playing time. We are title contenders and have done fairly well with Yao out the lineup. V-Span will never be on the level that Yao Ming is now, so we shouldn't treat V-Span like he's a rookie with amazing potential like Yao.
Closed Mouth doesn't get Fed what should one do if hard work is not rewarded? Continue to work harder? IN HIS MIND VSpan maybe thinking that nothing he does will be rewarded if that is the cast. . it is easy to fall into the Why try more anyway mindset I would hope he doesn't but it happens. Rocket rIver
So you seem to think we're title contenders with Reefer running the point and no one is backing him up?
Why did the author tell so many lies and make up stuff to "help" Vspan? Maybe JVG was doing the same thing to vSpan? Career advie to Mr. Feigen: Don't lie, don't lie on stats, don't write down your lies, don't publish your lies.
no you are right, noone is arguing he is going to be a superstar, but in vg's mind, it isn't more about playing him out of position but taking the ball out of his hands so he doesn't turn it over. there was an article in the chron a couple of days ago that interviewed vg and the one thing he absolutely hates is TO's, no reference at all to vspan, just his philsophy. I think it is borderline OCD with tO's that VG has, To's will certainly happen to any player. vg is TO shy from cat and franchise days, that he is all the way on the other side of the spectrum. so rafer isn't a TO machine, and i think that is where VG's heart lies. you can put up bricks so on and so forth, but the number one thing you cannot do is turn the ball over. priority #1 for him is no TO's. anyone have a link to this? it shed some light into his mindset. 10 -15 minuets of JLIII, in some people's mind at least lost the game in phoenix. were you one of those? people's praise on this board about the rotation really doesn't mean much except talk. everyone is excited at the beginning of the year about the team and the potential. halfway into the season, reality starts to hit. the rox aren't severely overmatched, they are just overmatched when it comes to suns, mavs and maybe spurs. ne ways, yao is a nice man, and vspan does know how to pass the ball in a good spot, and he is creative. the preseason did show us a glimpse, however, fortunately or unfortunately, vg isn't into highlights, but smart bball.
durvasa, there is no question that the stats are against vspan. he's horrible; the shooting, the assist/to ratio, the fouls. my only problem with judging him on those stats is that they came sporadically, with him out of position, in meaningless minutes. give him some games with serious minutes, when tmac is on the bench, handling the ball instead of getting it on the wing as a bailout option, and then judge him. and judge him not just on his personal stats, but on how the team performs while he's there. i guess the +/- has become the gold standard for that, but i'll trust my eyes and what i see happening on the court over a statistical calculation. if he does get meaningful minutes and he does not help this team, then there is nothing to complain about. he has not had meaningful minutes, and he has not had an opportunity to hurt or help this team. if him playing really hurts the team, then there is no question that he should be on the bench. i dont care about his personal development. i just feel that what he has and is capable of doing already, not in the future, not with time, but right now, can help this team. if i hadnt seen spanoulis break down the defense and get to the rim at will earlier in the season, i wouldn't be so passionate about the possibility that he can help this team right now. but i did see it, i think we all did. and now we are looking at a team with a glaring need for a playmaker outside of tmac. if it turns out that vspan is not that playmaker, then vspan is not the solution. but we have not seen enough of him to know one way or the other.
http://www.82games.com/0607/06HOU4A.HTM http://www.82games.com/0607/06HOU2A.HTM check out the assists/bad pass ratio and net points. http://www.82games.com/0607/0607HOU.HTM Roland rating and on-off stats. Granted Vspan hasn't played much, but I think there's a reason why we're not playing him more.
please. if you dont think that this team - when healthy - can play with ANY team in the league, whether it be one game or a seven game series.... i have a hard time believing you've been paying much attention.
