[John McWhorter] Is it racist to expect black kids to do math for real?

Os Trigonum · Mar 2, 2021

"Is it racist to expect black kids to do math for real?"

https://johnmcwhorter.substack.com/p/is-it-racist-to-expect-black-kids?

Is it racist to expect black kids to do math for real?
Yes, serious people are arguing this. Make sure they don't infect your school district.

John McWhorter
Feb 28 83 Dismantling Racism in Mathematics Instruction, a guide put together by a group of educators. It has a black boy on the cover.

The idea is to show us how our racial reckoning of late ought change how we expose black kids to math. I suppose the counsel is also intended for kids of other types of melanin, but this is in essence a document that could be called “Math For Black Kids.”

The latest is that state-level policy makers in Oregon are especially intrigued by this document. There is all reason to suppose that its influence will spread more widely.

And this is to resisted, as this lovely pamphlet is teaching us that it is racist to expect black kids to master the precision of math. To wit – its message, penned by people who consider themselves some of the most morally advanced souls in the history of the human species, is one that Strom Thurmond would have happily taken a swig of whiskey to.

Of course the authors have it that “The framework for deconstructing racism in mathematics offers essential characteristics of antiracist math educators and critical approaches to dismantling white supremacy in math classrooms by visualizing the toxic characteristics of white supremacy culture.” But translated, this means that math as we have always known it is racism. That’s a rich claim, and if correct, it is of earth-shattering urgency. But is it correct? Let’s see how it holds up.

Now, part of “antiracist math teaching” here is to teach about black mathematicians (the authors have this as kids “reclaiming their mathematical ancestry” – the jargon is, we must admit, beautiful) or to air facts such as that the traditional Yoruba approach to numbers (and wow, numbers in Yoruba, I note as linguist me, are indeed fierce!) use base 20. No one would object to these things, nor to the idea that we “teach students of color about the career and financial opportunities in math and STEM fields.”

But 96% of people reading this kind of thing will be thinking “Yeah, but what about the math??”

And there is nothing white supremacist in that question. The substance of a serious proposal about teaching math will be, well, teaching how to do math itself, not its history and sociology.

For example, one idea in this fascicle is that black students learn how math has hurt people (i.e. black ones). But it’s no slam dunk that little kids need to be taught this. Wouldn’t this affect a child’s attitude towards mastering the skills? Or – the burden is upon the authors here to explain just why it would not. Sure, teachers imparting this lesson would show that they know racism exists; they will thus Reckon With Racism as we are told they must. But what might the impact of that lesson be on children who haven’t even reached puberty?

More to the point is that this entire document is focused on an idea that making black kids be precise is immoral.

Yes, the document pays lip service otherwise, claiming at one point to seek to “teach rich, thoughtful, complex mathematics.” And rather often, the word praxis is used. But the thrust of this pamphlet is that:

1. a focus on getting the “right” answer is “perfectionism” or “either/or thinking;”

2. the idea that teachers are teachers and students are learners is wrong;

3. to think of it as a problem that the expectations you have of students are not met is racist;

4. to teach math in a linear fashion with skills taught in sequence is racist;

5. to value “procedural fluency” – i.e. knowing how to do the fractions, long division … -- over “conceptual knowledge” is racist. That is, black kids are brilliant to know what math is trying to do, to know “what it’s all about,” rather than to actually do the math, just as many of us read about what physics or astrophysics accomplishes without ever intending to master the math that led to the conclusions;

6. to require students to “show their work” is racist;

7. requiring students to raise their hand before speaking “can reinforce paternalism and powerhoarding, in addition to breaking the process of thinking, learning, and communicating.”

You may wonder if this is a cartoon but no, this is real! This is actually what this document tells us, again and again. This, folks, is the “Critical Race Theory” that so many of us are resisting, not a simple program for “social justice.” To distrust this document is not to be against social justice, but against racism.

The objections to my take here will be predictable. There is a kind of resistance that Zora Neale Hurston noted among black people wary of white curiosity which she termed “feather-bed resistance,” where one probes to enter but “never comes out.” While Zora would have had no truck with this vision of antiracist math whatsoever, we find the kind of resistance she referred to among The Elect these days when their claims are held up to the sunlight.

So for example: I am not cherry-picking especially ripe-seeming quotes from an otherwise perfectly normal document. I am referring to its principal tenets, often restated several times within it.

Another response will be that I am exaggerating the proposal’s impact – that almost nobody is using it for real and that really it’s “just a proposal.” To which the proper response is “Thank God,” – but we also recall that the people saying this would be dancing jigs if every state in the Union adopted the whole pamphlet wholesale.

Upon which the main thing is that those who see that this document is a racist screed must resist it if it pops up in your school district. Know that it may not be instantly aired that this specific document is being pored over by the people entrusted with the education of your children. However, sniff out the basic tenets I numbered above, and then ask if this thing has been shared by the school board members.

Many will dislike the general flavor of it but, amidst so much we all have to pay attention to, may question just what we must object to specifically about Dismantling Racism in Mathematics Instruction.

There are two things. Racism and religion. Just those.

As in, first it is racism propounded as antiracism. Black kids shouldn’t expected to master the precision of math and should be celebrated for talking around it, gamely approximating its answers and saying why it can be dangerous? This is bigotry right out of Reconstruction, Tulsa, Selma, and Charlottesville.

Second, it is not science but scripture. It claims to be about teaching math while founded on shielding students from the requirement to actually do it. This is unempirical. It does so with an implication that only a moral transgressor numb to some larger point would question the contradiction. This is, as such, a religious document, telling you to accept that Jesus walked on water.

Humans may grievously sacrifice the 9-year-old, the virgin, or the widow upon the pyre in worship of a God. Too, humans may sacrifice the black kid from the work of mastering the gift of math, in favor of showing that they are enlightened enough to understand that her life may be affected by racism and that therefore she should be shielded from anything that is a genuine challenge.

This is not pedagogy; it is preaching.

And in this country, religious propositions have no place in the public square.

jiggyfly · Mar 2, 2021

Os Trigonum said: ↑

"Is it racist to expect black kids to do math for real?"

https://johnmcwhorter.substack.com/p/is-it-racist-to-expect-black-kids?

Is it racist to expect black kids to do math for real?
Yes, serious people are arguing this. Make sure they don't infect your school district.

John McWhorter
Feb 28 83 Dismantling Racism in Mathematics Instruction, a guide put together by a group of educators. It has a black boy on the cover.

The idea is to show us how our racial reckoning of late ought change how we expose black kids to math. I suppose the counsel is also intended for kids of other types of melanin, but this is in essence a document that could be called “Math For Black Kids.”

The latest is that state-level policy makers in Oregon are especially intrigued by this document. There is all reason to suppose that its influence will spread more widely.

And this is to resisted, as this lovely pamphlet is teaching us that it is racist to expect black kids to master the precision of math. To wit – its message, penned by people who consider themselves some of the most morally advanced souls in the history of the human species, is one that Strom Thurmond would have happily taken a swig of whiskey to.

Of course the authors have it that “The framework for deconstructing racism in mathematics offers essential characteristics of antiracist math educators and critical approaches to dismantling white supremacy in math classrooms by visualizing the toxic characteristics of white supremacy culture.” But translated, this means that math as we have always known it is racism. That’s a rich claim, and if correct, it is of earth-shattering urgency. But is it correct? Let’s see how it holds up.

Now, part of “antiracist math teaching” here is to teach about black mathematicians (the authors have this as kids “reclaiming their mathematical ancestry” – the jargon is, we must admit, beautiful) or to air facts such as that the traditional Yoruba approach to numbers (and wow, numbers in Yoruba, I note as linguist me, are indeed fierce!) use base 20. No one would object to these things, nor to the idea that we “teach students of color about the career and financial opportunities in math and STEM fields.”

But 96% of people reading this kind of thing will be thinking “Yeah, but what about the math??”

And there is nothing white supremacist in that question. The substance of a serious proposal about teaching math will be, well, teaching how to do math itself, not its history and sociology.

For example, one idea in this fascicle is that black students learn how math has hurt people (i.e. black ones). But it’s no slam dunk that little kids need to be taught this. Wouldn’t this affect a child’s attitude towards mastering the skills? Or – the burden is upon the authors here to explain just why it would not. Sure, teachers imparting this lesson would show that they know racism exists; they will thus Reckon With Racism as we are told they must. But what might the impact of that lesson be on children who haven’t even reached puberty?

More to the point is that this entire document is focused on an idea that making black kids be precise is immoral.

Yes, the document pays lip service otherwise, claiming at one point to seek to “teach rich, thoughtful, complex mathematics.” And rather often, the word praxis is used. But the thrust of this pamphlet is that:

1. a focus on getting the “right” answer is “perfectionism” or “either/or thinking;”

2. the idea that teachers are teachers and students are learners is wrong;

3. to think of it as a problem that the expectations you have of students are not met is racist;

4. to teach math in a linear fashion with skills taught in sequence is racist;

5. to value “procedural fluency” – i.e. knowing how to do the fractions, long division … -- over “conceptual knowledge” is racist. That is, black kids are brilliant to know what math is trying to do, to know “what it’s all about,” rather than to actually do the math, just as many of us read about what physics or astrophysics accomplishes without ever intending to master the math that led to the conclusions;

6. to require students to “show their work” is racist;

7. requiring students to raise their hand before speaking “can reinforce paternalism and powerhoarding, in addition to breaking the process of thinking, learning, and communicating.”

You may wonder if this is a cartoon but no, this is real! This is actually what this document tells us, again and again. This, folks, is the “Critical Race Theory” that so many of us are resisting, not a simple program for “social justice.” To distrust this document is not to be against social justice, but against racism.

The objections to my take here will be predictable. There is a kind of resistance that Zora Neale Hurston noted among black people wary of white curiosity which she termed “feather-bed resistance,” where one probes to enter but “never comes out.” While Zora would have had no truck with this vision of antiracist math whatsoever, we find the kind of resistance she referred to among The Elect these days when their claims are held up to the sunlight.

So for example: I am not cherry-picking especially ripe-seeming quotes from an otherwise perfectly normal document. I am referring to its principal tenets, often restated several times within it.

Another response will be that I am exaggerating the proposal’s impact – that almost nobody is using it for real and that really it’s “just a proposal.” To which the proper response is “Thank God,” – but we also recall that the people saying this would be dancing jigs if every state in the Union adopted the whole pamphlet wholesale.

Upon which the main thing is that those who see that this document is a racist screed must resist it if it pops up in your school district. Know that it may not be instantly aired that this specific document is being pored over by the people entrusted with the education of your children. However, sniff out the basic tenets I numbered above, and then ask if this thing has been shared by the school board members.

Many will dislike the general flavor of it but, amidst so much we all have to pay attention to, may question just what we must object to specifically about Dismantling Racism in Mathematics Instruction.

There are two things. Racism and religion. Just those.

As in, first it is racism propounded as antiracism. Black kids shouldn’t expected to master the precision of math and should be celebrated for talking around it, gamely approximating its answers and saying why it can be dangerous? This is bigotry right out of Reconstruction, Tulsa, Selma, and Charlottesville.

Second, it is not science but scripture. It claims to be about teaching math while founded on shielding students from the requirement to actually do it. This is unempirical. It does so with an implication that only a moral transgressor numb to some larger point would question the contradiction. This is, as such, a religious document, telling you to accept that Jesus walked on water.

Humans may grievously sacrifice the 9-year-old, the virgin, or the widow upon the pyre in worship of a God. Too, humans may sacrifice the black kid from the work of mastering the gift of math, in favor of showing that they are enlightened enough to understand that her life may be affected by racism and that therefore she should be shielded from anything that is a genuine challenge.

This is not pedagogy; it is preaching.

And in this country, religious propositions have no place in the public square.

Click to expand...

Why are you so obsessed with racism?

Can you tell us who these state level policy makers that are "intrigued" by this pamphlet and why its influence can spread widely?

Remember when the 1742 project was gonna be the death nell of history education.

Invisible Fan · Mar 2, 2021

I saw Michael burry go bananas in his tweets over this and I’m still interested what the deeper story here is. Like who wrote this and are there actual data that different instructions give higher scores and retention.

Libs like extracting high fallutin “solutions” without actually going through the rigors of seeing if the idea actually works, something like a 15 min wage comes to mind despite its mixed success in Seattle.

I was raised differently and I’m interested if there are true gains to force teachers and black children to think differently, if that’s what the document is aiming for.

I didn’t goto Dulles High, only Dulles Middle. As a skinny Chinese kid, i didn’t have the greatest impression of black or Hispanic kids in general. Doesn’t mean my experience was highly racialized but there were worst examples I’d hear from other people that makes me not to want future kids to relive.

I’m not sure how this document would change things. On the surface this seems highly regressive to black people as it literally reduces expectations for them. I’m not even sure if any school would change things as top down solutions are generally ham listed.

Bottoms up

jiggyfly · Mar 2, 2021

Invisible Fan said: ↑

I saw Michael burry go bananas in his tweets over this and I’m still interested what the deeper story here is. Like who wrote this and are there actual data that different instructions give higher scores and retention.

Libs like extracting high fallutin “solutions” without actually going through the rigors of seeing if the idea actually works, something like a 15 min wage comes to mind despite its mixed success in Seattle.

I was raised differently and I’m interested if there are true gains to force teachers and black children to think differently, if that’s what the document is aiming for.

I didn’t goto Dulles High, only Dulles Middle. As a skinny Chinese kid, i didn’t have the greatest impression of black or Hispanic kids in general. Doesn’t mean my experience was highly racialized but there were worst examples I’d hear from other people that makes me not to want future kids to relive.

I’m not sure how this document would change things. On the surface this seems highly regressive to black people as it literally reduces expectations for them. I’m not even sure if any school would change things as top down solutions are generally ham listed.

Bottoms up
Click to expand...

Is anybody actually taking this pamphlet serious?

I think we need to find that out 1st before the freak out.

Why did you not have the greatest impression of that demographic?

Were you influenced by your environment?

jiggyfly · Mar 2, 2021

These are the authors and contributors it seems like its about the same as a graduate thesis.

Sonia Michelle Cintron Math Content Specialist UnboundEd
Dani Wadlington Director of Mathematics Education Quetzal Education Consulting
Andre ChenFeng Ph.D. Student Education at Claremont Graduate University

FEEDBACK ADVISORS
Kyndall Brown Executive Director California Mathematics Project
Denise Green Educational Administrator, Mathematics Monterey County Office of Education
Manuel Buenrostro Policy Associate Californians Together
Ana Benderas Director of Humanities Education Quetzal Education Consulting

jiggyfly · Mar 2, 2021

It seems that the right wing press is all over this but this what is actually going on.

https://katu.com/news/local/debate-emerges-over-racism-and-white-supremacy-in-math-instruction

"The Oregon Department of Education (ODE) recently sent a newsletter to math educators in the state. The newsletter contained information about a virtual micro-course in math equity instruction that teachers could sign up for. It was titled "Pathway to Math Equity Micro Course 2.0: Valuing and elevating student discourse in the math classroom." The course was provided by A Pathway to Equitable Math Instruction, an entity focused on dismantling racism in mathematics instruction."

Once again manufactured outrage.

The course and pamphlets does sound like a bunch of woke crap but I don't see the harm and none of it is going into the curriculum.

Os Trigonum · Mar 2, 2021

jiggyfly said: ↑

It seems that the right wing press
Click to expand...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_McWhorter

Invisible Fan · Mar 2, 2021

jiggyfly said: ↑

Is anybody actually taking this pamphlet serious?

I think we need to find that out 1st before the freak out.

Why did you not have the greatest impression of that demographic?

Were you influenced by your environment?
Click to expand...

The article said Oregon state members are looking into it, which is why it's a topic.

Shoot, it's been 30 years, so it's all melted into an impression... Thinking back my bus route went through the poorest parts of the neighborhoods and that was probably the craziest part for me to witness daily, probably a fight every few weeks. I do remember hearing stories about people getting bullied or having their things stolen outright. I don't remember any terribly shitty memories (repressed?) except maybe the racist things kids do to each other that you hope is what gave you a tougher skin. I mostly took honors classes so only interacted with black people in those honors classes.

I guess the influence was to stay away and avoid until things later changed in college.

I grew up liking black culture, thinking it was cool, and wanting to be around that. I'm sure I'd be resentful if I was picked on, but that's public schools for you. They pretty much let you figure **** out for yourself, despite the handcuffs or directives people above place upon teachers.

B-Bob · Mar 2, 2021

Os Trigonum said: ↑

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_McWhorter
Click to expand...

Yeah, but left wing linguists are notably right wing when it comes to math.

jiggyfly · Mar 2, 2021

Os Trigonum said: ↑

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_McWhorter
Click to expand...

I did not say he was right wing.

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/oregon-math-course-racism-white-supremacy-teachers

https://nypost.com/2021/02/12/addin...er-program-to-subtract-racism-in-mathematics/

https://www.foxnews.com/us/oregon-education-math-white-supremacy

I do wonder why he felt the need to weigh in on this?

jiggyfly · Mar 2, 2021

Invisible Fan said: ↑

The article said Oregon state members are looking into it, which is why it's a topic.

Shoot, it's been 30 years, so it's all melted into an impression... Thinking back my bus route went through the poorest parts of the neighborhoods and that was probably the craziest part for me to witness daily, probably a fight every few weeks. I do remember hearing stories about people getting bullied or having their things stolen outright. I don't remember any terribly shitty memories (repressed?) except maybe the racist things kids do to each other that you hope is what gave you a tougher skin. I mostly took honors classes so only interacted with black people in those honors classes.

I guess the influence was to stay away and avoid until things later changed in college.

I grew up liking black culture, thinking it was cool, and wanting to be around that. I'm sure I'd be resentful if I was picked on, but that's public schools for you. They pretty much let you figure **** out for yourself, despite the handcuffs or directives people above place upon teachers.
Click to expand...

They just offered it as a micro course they are not looking at implementing it.

Don't know the author but it seems he was overinflating things.

That makes sense was not trying to call you out just wanted to see if you left home with pre concieved notions, anybody would be scared seeing that stuff.

Os Trigonum · Mar 27, 2021

this is kind of fun. even allowing for the near-certain likelihood that this is cherry-picking excerpts of the conversation and taking snippets of the conversation completely out of context . . . what remains is utterly fascinating. enjoy.

Nook · Mar 27, 2021

Are we going to teach how every demographic has been screwed over and make it a major point of education? Will we give specific examples of how girls and women have been and are oppressed by boys and men and they live in a high oppressive patriarchy? Can this be worked into math class and science class?

Maybe we can also make sure that class warfare is incorporated during recess as well. We don’t want Asian Americans or Irish and Jewish Americans left out either.

An acknowledgment of history and continued inequities is a necessity but this in some cases is getting to a point of radical educators just causing future separation between Americans.

Not every person is a terrible person that wants to oppress others. There is a way to educate people in school of the history and struggles ongoing different groups face and to be understanding and proactive to stop them... and not be divisive.

Dairy Ashford · Mar 27, 2021

Are any syllabi, textbooks or assignments actually changing here? This is some teaching guide that maybe gives an instructor some bullet points to mine for during performance reviews, or helps justify some teacher's conference with travel, lodging or catered lunches. Show me some actual quizzes with whatever terrifying diversity ideas you're concerned with, then I'll come close to believing that people OP give a rat's **** about people who look like me converting degrees to radians or doing polynomial long division.

rocketsjudoka · Mar 28, 2021

Dairy Ashford said: ↑

Are any syllabi, textbooks or assignments actually changing here? This is some teaching guide that maybe gives an instructor some bullet points to mine for during performance reviews, or helps justify some teacher's conference with travel, lodging or catered lunches. Show me some actual quizzes with whatever terrifying diversity ideas you're concerned with, then I'll come close to believing that people OP give a rat's **** about people who look like me converting degrees to radians or doing polynomial long division.
Click to expand...

Yes this doesn't seem to be something widely used, if at all.

Also nothing I've seen so far is saying that black kids shouldn't be doing math.

durvasa · Mar 28, 2021

So this booklet is suggesting that linear thinking and precision are racist?

This seems related to that other thread about the school board teacher who went after Asians for their “white supremacist thinking”.

durvasa · Mar 28, 2021

1. a focus on getting the “right” answer is “perfectionism” or “either/or thinking;”

2. the idea that teachers are teachers and students are learners is wrong;

3. to think of it as a problem that the expectations you have of students are not met is racist;

4. to teach math in a linear fashion with skills taught in sequence is racist;

5. to value “procedural fluency” – i.e. knowing how to do the fractions, long division … -- over “conceptual knowledge” is racist. That is, black kids are brilliant to know what math is trying to do, to know “what it’s all about,” rather than to actually do the math, just as many of us read about what physics or astrophysics accomplishes without ever intending to master the math that led to the conclusions;

6. to require students to “show their work” is racist;

7. requiring students to raise their hand before speaking “can reinforce paternalism and powerhoarding, in addition to breaking the process of thinking, learning, and communicating.”

I guess these are seen as “racist” because it forces students to value respect for authority, conformity, and obedience to rules. But maybe that’s just what effective education requires — teaching kids to subordinate themselves to learn something they are currently ignorant of.

rocketsjudoka · Mar 28, 2021

durvasa said: ↑

So this booklet is suggesting that linear thinking and precision are racist?

This seems related to that other thread about the school board teacher who went after Asians for their “white supremacist thinking”.
Click to expand...

I agree. The SF school board member is likely going to lose her job with good reason but not really seeing her representing a big movement in education. Both her and this booklet seem more like outliers.

Os Trigonum · Mar 29, 2021

next up: sheet music

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...considers-scrapping-sheet-music-colonial.html

durvasa · Mar 29, 2021

Os Trigonum said: ↑

next up: sheet music

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...considers-scrapping-sheet-music-colonial.html
Click to expand...

Related:

As someone who really likes German classical music, I found the video pretty interesting.

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