According to that pure definition, I am ok with the term invasion, as long as US invaded Japan and Germany in 1944, and UdSSR invaded Germany in 1945. But you don't call that invasion. I guess you will admit according to your definition. Normally, you call it WWII, or Americans stopped Nazi Germany, or Allies totally defeated Nazi Germany and Japan. When you are attacked, you defend yourself and fight back and win, with NO intention and actual result to take others' land, it's normally NOT called invasion in history book, although it might qualify as "invasion" in pure English, when some of the battles were fought in other's territory. Am I right? But when you referred to what happened in 1962, all you say is China invaded India without any context. Are you insinuating anything? You tell me. After all, English is just my third language. What other posters did here was to give some content and history background to what actually happened in 1962. Of course, it doesn't matter to some what really happened. According to the pure English meaning of "invasion", China invaded India, therefore it's an aggressive nation, comparing to "most peaceful" Japan. Beautiful spin. No lies, just half truth and selective memory.
Look the whole point I'm trying to make on this thread is that China is the last 50 years has a track record of aggression against it's own people (Tienenman square, prisoner torture, lack of due process, violations against women [forced abortions] and female babies, Falun Gong, Uighar community) and sending it's armies into foreign lands (India, Vietnam, etc) as well as threatning Taiwan, and unilaterially claiming territory without discussion (Spratley's). What's the point of that? First, juxtaposition it with Japan's 50+ years of peace. And when you see that, and you see Chinese complaining about a Japanese PM visiting a Japanese Shrine with 2.5 million Japanese soldiers buried there...and China complaining about Japanese aggression....I'm like - wait a second...who's been the aggressor the last 50 years???? It's China, not Japan! The Japanese should be complaining the other way! So I just say to all of the passionate Chinese Nationalistics here....why on earth can you not admit to your country's own aggression?
where? what location? do you not get tired of your incessant rhetorics, unable to offer any supporting details, such as the exact location where the fighting borke out
I would definitely call it an invasion. The US invaded Japan (at least parts of it like Iwo Jima and Okinawa) and Germany in WWII; it was not unprovoked, but an invasion is an invasion is an invasion.
But many Chinese tolerate or downplay their own atrocities. So it makes their non-toleration of any downplaying of Japanese war crimes look hypocritical. And the maybe? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tiananmen_Square_protests_of_1989 The number of dead and wounded remains a state secret. An unnamed Chinese Red Cross official at the time reported that 2,600 people were killed, and 30,000 injured. Two days later, Yuan Mu, the speaker of the State Council, estimated that 300 soldiers and citizens died, as well as 5,000 soldiers and 2,000 citizens injured, 400 soldiers lost contact. Many of the soldiers were burned alive by the protesters. Central Committee of the Communist Party of China and State Council later co-claimed that tens of PLA soldiers died and more injured. The Preparatory Committee of Autonomous Associations of Tsinghua University claimed that 4,000 died and 30,000 injured. Chen Xitong, Beijing mayor, reported at 26 days after the event that 36 students, tens of soldiers died amounting to a total of 200 dead, 3,000 civilians and 6,000 soldiers injured.[6] Foreign reporters that witnessed the incident have claimed that at least 3,000 people had died. Some lists of the casualties were created from underground sources with numbers as high as 5,000.[7] In contrast, however, before the government in Beijing had completely re-established control over the news media in China, a monitored English language broadcast from Beijing stated that at least 3,000 students died in the massacre. At the same time, the Chinese Red Cross reported that they had counted 2,600 people dead - and they still were counting. As both sources, the radio broadcast and the Red Cross report, are impossible to verify given that access to objective information was impossible under martial law, the discrepancy between the lower and higher number of individuals killed still needs to be resolved.
Israel or Germany was the more aggressive country in the past 50 years? Go ahead to tell Jewish people to stop talking about Holocaust. Go ahead to hang Hitler's photo in your office, and start the petition to clear his name. Go ahead to rally Germans to complain about Jewish people instead.
Hey, why all the selective reply? Like you all can't face up to the truth or something? Bark, woof. LMAO again.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McMahon_Line you are such a pain - are you happy now?????? Hey, "teach India a lesson" - that sure sounds peaceful to me!
You confuse the government with Chinese people. You think people who post here were soldiers marching on Tiananmen Square? What atrocities have Chinese people commited? Are Americans hypocrits criticizing Sadam on WMD? Regan and Rumsfield gave WMD to Sadam in the 80's. Are Americans hypocrits talking about democracy in Iran? U.S. overthrew the first democratically elected Iranian government decades ago.
I absolutely agree with you, and appreciate your consistency. Just a friendly reminder, next time when you refer to WWII, probably you could start with US invasion in Japan and Germany, as you always call the war between India and China in 1962, as Chinese invasion, instead of an Indian invasion (which was true according to your English 101). May I suggest the following new definition to be more accurate: WWII - Germany and Japan invasion, followed by US and UdSSR invasion China-India war - India invasion followed by Chinese invasion Korean War - North Korea invasion followed by US invasion followed by Chinese invasion Curret Iraq war - US invasion and occupation.
Does it annoy you when a right-wing Israeli support advocates israel invading Lebannon and the "accidental" killing of civilians or if the IDF uses Palestinians as shields....but then cries about the Holocaust? Doesn't that hyprocrisy make your skin roil? Well, your hyprocrisy about crying about a war shrine and then denying all the atrocities and aggression China commits also makes my skin roil. If you didn't have the hypocrisy, I wouldn't be posting - get it?
I think what he's saying is that you can criticize Japanese atrocities of 60 years ago, but you are unwilling to criticize Chinese atrocities - even against it's own people - of today.
Again, it is efforts of demonizing not only chinese governement, but chinese people as a whole. NewYork, shame on you.
I reply to this again, simply to get a public sense if this is within the posting etiquette here in DnD... for future references. Maybe it needs its own thread? - I'd rather not. Btw, Is that guy in the picture suppose to be Hu JIngtao? It barely register in my mind he is now the leader in China. What's his main policy, doctrine? Can someone in the know informs me?
what gives you that impression. Start your own thread on those issues and people will chip in. But this thread is about Japanese war shrine. Again, can one break into your home and rape your doughter and say you had a fight with your brother so go sort that out first? Besides, what Japanese did was 1000 times worse than those things you want to criticize Chinese government.
NewYorker, you got it wrong. It will NOT annoy me, if German Kanzler paid an official visit to a Hitler memorial, and Jewish people protest the action and talk about Holocaust. It will NOT annoy me, if Germany honor Goering like convicted A-class with other German soliders in a memorial, where it teaches German people that ethnic cleansing of Jews was a lie, and Jewish people protest such action and talk about Holocaust. Not only will I not be annoyed by such Holocaust mentioning, but also i do resonate with Jewish people. However, it seems you are very much annoyed I wonder why. If you still can't get the fact straight, I really don't know what to say any more. Let's just stop here. I am already exhausted.
You're rationalizing in a very poor way. The Chinese gov't ordered the killing of it's own students. It murders people or imprisones them for their political beliefs. It forces abortions on women. It murders female babies. It has commited atrocities....but that's ok in your book, because Japan was worse????? What?
