That's all fine and dandy, just so long as you understand that Cuttino is not a PG. I get tired of people (Rudy included) who think he can play that position. He cannot. He's a pure SG. That's all he is. That is where he will play. ------------------
intelligence is the key and i agree with almu he does not need to shoot that much..i have been against his stupid shots but i guess the argument is that if you dont shoot you dont make any baskets..that he is showing confidence..he definitely needs to be contained as i have seen him lose games all by himself..imagine him kobe and othella on the same team.. ------------------ they say the meek shall inherit the earth
Why would you want your shooting guard averaging 6 assists? Francis barely even does that. I did a quick run through and only found 2 shooting guards that even average 5 assists. 15 shots a game is just not that much when you look at what other top-flight shooting guards in the league put up. I haven't seen any bashing of Mobley based on fact. Tod the bod actually tried to bring up the fact that the team is almost at .500, in an amazingly tough conference, in their 2nd year of rebuilding, and say it's the fault of Mobley's one-on-one play. How funny is that?
GREAT OBSERVATION, Dakota!! It's only natural for a player to play with less enthusiasm if he doesn't feel like he's involved enough. Just look to last night's game, and note when the Rockets made their charge: when everyone, notably Dream and Steve, were involved. ------------------ Who's better: Kelvin Cato or Joe Barry Caroll? Take your time!
I agree with the majority of the posters in this thread. Cuttino throws up a too many shots per game. Really, though, there are 2 seperate problems involved. #1: Mobley shoots the ball too much. By this I don't mean to necessarily criticize Cat. His shot attempts are mostly out of design, and really who else deserves more shots? The problem with the situation is one in which the starting backcourt scores all of our points. The Rockets have become a donut team - they are the new Phoenix Suns. Without some sort of offensive presence inside, the team's gonna stagnate. Give me Reef, give me CWebb, hell give me what Hakeem gave the team last night. Just don't give me 35+ shots per game out of the back court. One-diminsional teams are doomed to fail. #2: In three years, Mobley hasn't improved. For a player blessed with so quick a first step, Mobley shoots a terrible percentage. The same percentage he's shot every season of his career. And he's a mediocre shooter from beyond the arc. The reason isn't talent, its maturity. Cat puts up too many heaves every game, often at inopportune times. His defense remains suspect. His passing could be much better: noted ballhogs like Allen Iverson, Kobe Bryant, Vince Carter, and John Starks all pile up more assists than Cuttino. He plays with fire and heart on the court, and is one of the nicest guys in the world off of it. But a team leader can't make the mistakes he makes. Not if the Rockets hope to contend. If Francis is still making the same mistakes in three years, when he's 25, then I will be equally disappointed. At a certain point, age is no longer a good excuse. ------------------ I am Jack's utter lack of surprise. www.clutchtown.com
Tunnel Vision is Key for a Shooting Guard This is the reason I have so much patience for him. In my experience, tunnel vision is required for scorers like this. They can't do it without the tunnel vision. Hakeem had tunnel vision, and never really knew where his teammates were. Rudy had to design an offense that spaced out Hakeem's teammates in predictable patterns. When you have tunnel vision on the rim like Mobley, if you can add peripheral vision to that...you are not only an all-star, you are a hall-of-famer. I'm not apologizing for this star, or his tunnel vision. I am in awe! I just think you guys are not considering that without the fockass, Mobley is just another average, apprehensive player. And come on, don't say if "such and such" player can do it, so can Mobley, unless "such and such" player can blow by anyone in the league like Mobley. More Passing By Mobley Will Increase His Scoring, Not Lessen It His first step gets them on their heels...Passing will prevent them from collapsing with help defense on drives. They will increase his scoring, not lessen it...I agree completely with TheFreak's assessment on that. From what I've seen, Mobley is hands-down the fastest improving player on the team, because of hard work and because he listens to his coaches and does what they want...eventually he will do everything they want. This could easily be a hall-of-famer in the making if he starts seeing outside the tunnel. What Compels Mobley-Bashing to be so Relentless The constant onslaught by talk radio, this bbs, the media (read Fran Blinebury today) and fans at the game within earshot must take their toll on a young man like this. Chill out on him! Let him grow! Follow Rudy's lead on this kid. Why do you guys feel compelled to give him a verbal lashing? If it is for your situational venting, that's fine. Mobley needs thicker skin to not let that bother him. But do any of you want him to listen to your complaints to teach him a lesson? Francis has a lot to learn as well So you say Francis has learned his lesson faster...uh, first off... Francis has different lessons to learn. He needs to learn to run a fastbreak and pnr like a real point guard. He has a lot to learn, as well. Mobley's Superior PNR to Francis's Proves he's improving just fine I honestly believe Mobley doesn't fully believe in himself after being passed up in the draft. That's just my opinion, and I don't really know why I think that. I think Rudy has been instrumental in bringing the confidence out of Mobley. If that is true, I can completely understand why Rudy is bringing his game along step-by-step. The guy is the best one-on-one player on the team. Now he is also the best pick-n-rolling guard on the team. 24 High is better when Mobley runs it vs Francis. Who else sees that? Don't demand too much, too soon. Rudy doesn't! [This message has been edited by heypartner (edited February 06, 2001).]
You know this is the reason why I stopped posting here on a regular basis. I make a point that "Jack" is a ball hog. And while some of the people here have tried to convince me otherwise, you get a bunch of morons (like HeyPartner and Pole) who choose to personally attack Almu and myself. HeyPartner writes: "Too bad you didn't see it. Too bad you aren't seeing the growth. But at least you have an excuse, being in NY getting no sleep with baby. Now tod-the-bod, what is your excuse?" Well, first of all, I did watch the game last night on the MSG network. I also see most of the games, since I have DirectTV. So I don't know what the hell you are talking about. Moreover, I don't think that I said anywhere in my first post that Mobely had a bad game last night. I thought that Mobely played well LAST NIGHT. But that doesn't change the fact that he is a ball hog with poor decision-making ability. Last night he made the shots, other nights he misses the shot. He is kind of like John Starks in that way. What gets me more upset is the later post by Pole: "Of course Tod doesn't like Mobely --- that's because Rudy does. But I'm guessing there must be a reason Rudy is coaching an NBA team and Tod is farting around on his keyboard like the rest of us." The idea that is forwarded a lot of people on this board is that if you are not a coach, you don't have the right to criticize the team, an individual player, or the coach. Well that's just a lot of bull. You are right in that nothing I say is going to change the way the team is managed. But any honest person who watches the Rockets (including my wife who doesn't even like baskeball) will recognize that this team doesn't pass the ball. You don't have to be a coach to recognize the Rockets' weaknesses. Mobely is a better player now than when he was a rookie. On the other hand, the older he gets, the less likely that he will be able to change his bad habits. Mobely is a good player to have coming off the bench to provide a spark -- "instant offense." But I would really prefer that he doesn't start. And I definitely don't want him to have to take the big shot at the end of the game.
(Just idle ramblings, please forgive me) I know it takes time, and like everyone else I'm willing to remain patient, but it's kind of maddening to see this team on offense. About a month or so, it seemed that they were starting to come around to the semi-motion, high-post offense that Rudy and Co. seem to want to implement. But lately they have regressed back to the 1-on-1 ball utilized last year, which has been very disappointing. My main gripe at this point is that Cat dominates the ball too much. But then again, as you repeatedly pointed out HeyP, Steve runs THE WORST pick-and-roll I've ever seen. He has no sense of when to drop it off to the picker, or how to create a seam/angle for the picker to "roll" to. So you really can't run a two man game with him at this point. Mo ABSOLUTELY needs more touches in the block. PERIOD! He has a beautiful jump hook coming to the middle, and as Calvin and Bill pointed out, if he can make that a key portion of his game, it would be a great compliment to his face-up game and driving ability. But it is amazing that, 6 years removed from dump-it-to-Dream-kick-it-out-to-the-shooters basketball, an offense created partly out of a lack of creators and drivers, we're arguing about the Rockets' creating too much. ------------------ Who's better: Kelvin Cato or Joe Barry Caroll? Take your time!
I bash you Tod, because you bash the coach, and show no Xs and Os! Where are they, man? Tell me one play in the Triangle. Tell me the difference between Flex and Motion. Which one is the Utah offense, and which one is the Laker offense. Tell me why Sloan is regarded as a great X and O man, and he only runs one play. Why? Describe our 24 High play. Tell me why Francis goes baseline on it. Tell me what is wrong with our fastbreak. Tell me what our great alley-oop play is to Francis. Tell me why Riley patterened this Knicks just like Rudy Ball. Why? If you can't deliver any answers here, you can't bash Rudy without me bashing you. You can't deliver the Xs and Os, nor can you handle bashing. No wonder you stopped posting.
You could try being a little less condescending in your posts, 'Partner. Tod is just as entitled to his opinion as you are to yours, despite all the useless basketball knowledge floating around in that brain of yours. And I don't think bashing of long-time posters, just because they have an opinion (well-supported or no) is a good idea. To quote the immortal Rodney King, can't we all just get along? ------------------ I am Jack's utter lack of surprise. www.clutchtown.com
Wow, is this a great thread or what. Just ease off on the personal aspersions, fellas. You know who you are. You're making great points -- don't obscure them with gratuitous ad hominem attacks.
The problem is not Mobley taking too many shots. It's the kind of shots he's taking. When he iso's, and is then double-teamed, I think the intended play is to pass the ball to the open guy. Or, if you think you can split the double team, do it and draw the foul. Mobley, if he has gone into his "I must shoot the ball" mode, often dribbles and dribbles and dribbles (without moving) and then jacks up a wild shot that hits nothing. The problem with Mobley is that he has incredible talent but doesn't use use his head all the time. Will he learn? Possibly. But he hasn't yet, and that's why people are complaining. People point out his shooting percentage, scoring numbers, etc, etc -- but that's all irrelevent. Take out the bad shots, and his shooting percentage is that much higher and he's that much more dangerous as a weapon. All some of us ask is that those stupid shots be changed to passes. Is that really that much to ask for? It's not like he even has to learn instinctually -- he stands there for 10 seconds before shooting those shots. During that time, at least once, he could think "I am double-teamed. That means that someone is wide-open. Maybe I should look away from the basket and consider passsing now." ------------------ Is it any coincidence that the Cato is the only Rocket with a temperature scale named after him? I didnt think so!!!!
Personally I see the kind of game Mobes had in San Antonio and see what he is progressing twords. IMO that was his best game as a pro. He was patient, used good judgement nice passes and scored a lot. I thought the game against the Knicks showed a lot of the same things except when the refs started getting him for charging (what three straight trips down the court?) he got frustrated and lost his head. I think as he grows and matures he will be fine. ------------------
Will, alright, it's not my thread, I should back off. I started it; I should apologize. Almu, nothing was directed personally to you. Tod the Bod, I'm just trolling for personalities... Sam, ahhh man, I think it's getting a wee bit unfair for people to assume I think my opinion is better, anymore than anyone does. Let me repeat what I said to crash last night: That is what I think about NBA coaches. Bashing a player is a matter of opinion. We can pretty much see everything they are doing. Not so with coaches. We are in the dark on a lot of issues, much like foreign policy. We don't have their Intelligence regarding what their team is capable of doing. Notice in all my backlash bashing I stick to what we've seen and heard Rudy do. I never suggest new Xs and Os or new player rotations. I realize I'm not capable of suggesting anything to Rudy and his coaching staff, any more than I can suggest to Clinton what to do with Saddam Hussien other than to ad more hominem. Many people opine on foreign policy and player management policy...I can't do that anymore. But I sure love bashing the bashers, until they show some personality like what Cato13 and Give Your Head a Shake gave me, or some bball knowledge beyond my years for which I ALWAYS pine. [This message has been edited by heypartner (edited February 06, 2001).]
Well, I think that the flex and motion refers to your right hand and the jar of vaseline that you have sitting by your bedside. You bore me.
...speaking of personal attacks and whiny b****es... ------------------ stop posting my damn signature
Tod...OUCH! HeyP, its all good. I love the Rockets. I love Francis but I want Mobley to be more complimentary and not JACK up ever shot. Its those times when I want to trade his ass to the Clippers for their 3rd round pick! And to Will, the only reason this thread rocks is because we now have Clutch, Tod the Bod, Almu,and now YOU! CC98? Hell, its CC 97! Was there a CC97? Anyway, Mobley needs to think before he shoots. ------------------ Nadie En La Vida Es Eterno
OK now the thread has gotten entertaining. I'm headed out of town for a few days, so I won't get to participate in the mudslinging. You boys play nice while I'm gone! If we lose these next 2 games, I'll start a Tankfest 2001 thread when I get back. (If not, it's all copacetic) ------------------ I am Jack's utter lack of surprise. www.clutchtown.com
hope this doesn't put you to sleep tod. Shanna, trust me that I would make that same bash on Cuttino if I saw it. For the life of me, I just can't picture any game where Mobley stood there in ISO with a double team on him. He doesn't take on double team nearly as much as Francis. Francis will do it every game. I can visually remember Francis doing it in many games. I don't mean to dismiss your opinion. I know it can look like he attacks doubles because he gets double so often in the ISO. So, let's break it down for a second. The defense cannot halfway double him, right? Or it is Illegal. They must come over and get in his face. There are two ways I've seen them do this: 1) trap him as he brings it up court, 2) they bring the defender 2 players away over to guard him. This is usually the PF position. #1 generally means the ISO never fully set, so let's not talk about that. That is a problem with the half-court trap which requires his teammates to come help. #2 is the majority of the time he gets doubled. The reason they double from that spot two players away is cause we have shooters at the top of the key and the far corner who they'd rather not leave. Also, by not leaving the Top of Key player, they can guard the swing pass. Mobley is instructed not to pass until the double fully arrives, and almost always our unguarded PF dives into the defensive soft-spot on the Mobley-side lower block. Last year, I saw Mobley pass to KT diving into the low block quite a few times. I rarely see that this year. I think that is a combination of bad-timing with the PF sometimes, but more often the traps of the ISO are simply way more aggressive this year. I also think Rudy stresses the swing pass to force the defense to move and recover on our PF. This defensive action can open several seams. While sometimes last year Mobley passed quickly into the low block, he has always been instructed not to start a *swing* pass until the double FULLY arrives. Consider that the doubles are much more aggressive this year, and that the swing pass recipient has a defender. I can understand why Mobley has to back up his dribble to get the swing pass off. That can look like he is taking on the double, but imo he is doing what is instructed of him...plain and simple. I wish he'd try the quick snap pass to the diving PF more like last year...ugh. But, give him another look with objective eyes. Tell me when you actually see him take on a double team and shoot or drive. And then look at how many times Francis takes on the double team by trying to get around them on the baseline or by doing that strange show-his-back move that gets him nowhere. If Mobley drives or shoots around, through or over a double, note the time and drop me an email, because I want to look at it. And look out for a picker coming over for Mobley. No one I know counts those picker situations as taking on double teams. No one counts the help defense in the lane as a double, either. Certainly not a double in the quote above. Did this come out sincere? Cato13, what do you think about this bball talk. Jump in anytime. What do you see on the Francis ISO vs the Mobley ISO?
