This is the basic premise of the argument: Players are more physical (and allowed to be so) in the 90's, therefore better defense was played in the 90's. This argument makes an unproven assumption, that the more physical you are, the better defense you can play. That assumption simply does not hold water. Two of the best defensive teams in the West, the Spurs and the Warriors are not known to be physical. They are good because they have good defensive system and smart players who buy into the system. Shane Battier was widely known to be a great defensive player, but he was never a physical player. Playing physical and playing smart defense are not synonymous. I'd take a smart defender over a dumb and "tough" guy any day. Today's defenses are much more sophisticated and diverse because: 1. no illegal defense 2. better scouting tools 3. more advanced tactical knowledge Sure hand check would have given the defense an edge. But it is far from offsetting all the other advantages of today's defenses.
Increased perimeter offense has attracted plenty new fans The entire reasoning behind the elimination of handchecking was to increased offense, namely perimeter.
What is hand checking going to do to slow down today's perimeter superstars especially Curry? He has a vast array a moves to get his shot off and has counter moves to almost all his go to moves. The only ones going to be slowed down against hand checking would be point guards like Beverley.
aaahhhh just two years ago . . . . LeBron was the new Goat and would never be eclipsed Time for a new Goat Who will be the Goat in 2018? Rocket River
Need to get rid of some of the rules that hamper the defense like bull**** touch fouls and weak ass flopping fouls Rocket River
"Illegal defense" doesn't mean much when players are within arm's-length* of their opponent 95% of the time. Advantages/disadvantages offset each other within Eras. For instance, offenses share that advantage to help attack defenses. A current player time-traveling back to the 90's wouldn't have a tool advantage.... but neither would his opponent. Ditto last response Exactly There is no "all". He'd still be good, just not as good. Curry's lack of strength/size would get him knocked off-balance more with handchecking. I think he'd still be the GOAT shooter.
I mean, there's always been room for two transcendent talents in the same era. There was Bill Russell and Wilt Chamberlain, Oscar Robertson and Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, Magic and Bird, Jordan and Olajuwon (though Jordan did pretty well eclipse the Dream), Shaq and Duncan (and Kobe, I guess, for those who think he was transcendent). The fact that James has gotten possible-GOAT praise and Curry is getting some now is neither historically unique or disqualifying to either player.
They may call more fouls... But they undeniably call less touch fouls and allow more contact on the perimeter. I expect to again see another playoffs where if teams are allowed more contact/physicality on the perimeter with some of the finesse teams... There will be an effect on offensive effeciency/pace/scoring. Not sure why everybody just dismisses the ticky-tack foul-calls as unimportant. The NBA's insistence that the refs clean up the physical stuff has led to a noticeable effect in how perimeter defense is played, across the board, compared to years past. Nobody is harkening for a return to those days... When the physicality eclipsed offensive skill.... But there is increasing respect for players of that era who were able to still put up big numbers (and let's not just presume that all those points scored were off isolation plays... And that Princeton/triangle offenses were in their infancy).
NBA Coaches have stated the way they teach and play defense is light years different than it was in the early 90's - why are we supposed to believe you instead of Dwayne Casey, Masai Ujiri, Kelvin Sampson, George Karl and all the other coaches/GM's on record about how they play dramatically different systems now?
It's not about believing me. Anyone with 2 eyes (who recalls what NBA arm's-length was) knows current defenders are within the same distance as the 90's Era nearly all the time.
Well, there's really no evidence that the physicality made it harder (as I said, when the NBA changed the rules to cut out that physicality, the very same players saw no improvement in their numbers) and I don't really see an "increasing respect"...most people seemed to be criticizing these players who are saying "Curry would never have made it/been much worse in our era" as bitter and wrongheaded. Players like Robertson and Jordan and all deserve credit for the great things that they accomplished. They don't deserve more/increasing respect for an era artifact that doesn't appear to have mattered much, especially when there were other offsense-favorable rules that no longer exist.
Evolution has nothing to do with it. But: - Nutrition - Training regimens - Drugs To hammer this one dow: Why would Basketball be the only sport in which the athletes aren't faster, have more stamina, are stronger (per kg). It would be bizarre for that to be true. I deeple resent strawman. Point out where I said Jordan would be a bust. Oh right... I didn't. But what did I say? AHA! I said that the 1990 Jordan (magically transported through time)would have as much adjustment problems as Curry would have if he made the opposite trip. Nonsense, it's exactly the same as the people here are saying about Curry. It's perfectly okay to clainm the biggest star of this era can't handle the old system, but it's silly to claim Jordan would have to adjust to the current system? Bizarre antics Nick. I bolded your statement. You are claiming Basketball is the only sport where athletes haven't improved? Definitely? I bet you a crate full of HGH, Epo and Aicar that you are wrong :grin:
LMAO There's plenty evidence that eliminating handchecking made it easier to score. Perimeter players' IMMEDIATE PPG increase and efficiency jump between to name a couple.
Regardless of defense or not, the NBA really needs to change its stance on ticky tak calls. Tech for talking trash? Tech for bumping into another player?
Your stats dissect '04 vs '05..... handchecking was eliminated in 2000. There was one (1) perimeter player Top 4 ppg in '99.... 3 in '00. 1999 - 10 post players in the top 20 ppg vs 10 perimeter 2000 - 12 perimeter vs 8 post players The players with the largest point increases were all perimeter except Shaq. The league leaders 3PT% increased ~.15% '99 to '00.
There have been continuing rule changes about handchecking. 2005 was when the practice was completely ended along with various other forms of "bodying up" on the perimeter.
You should compare all years in which there was a change. 2000 was the biggest difference among all "tweeks".... and perimeter players soared.
