So, are you saying you have to consciously choose not to have sex with men because you have those urges... If so, you MIGHT be a homosexual. In the closet.
Yonkers, whether you realize it or not, you're acting as a surrogate to the OddsOns in this thread by extending their naturalist critique of homosexuality. You can't be a moving target and cry "straw man" every time you shift positions. And I only said homosexuality is natural because others said it was unnatural, and therefore bad. Who cares if bestiality is also natural? How does that have anything to do with the topic of this thread? This is why I keep saying that you're shifting the burden of proof. Nobody is saying that merely being natural is justification for homosexuality.
Woe be it for someone to actually ask a question that doesn't support you. Too complicated for someone (who actually agrees with you) to actually debate the other side? Thanks for making it sound like I'm some unwitting pawn of OddsOns chess game. And how have I been a moving target? I've been asking the same question with no answers. It has to do with this thread because the initial 'shot' was to say that homosexuality was an illness/choice and not an acceptable choice at that. And the defense was that it was not an illness and that it is naturally occurring and choice does not come into play. My very basic question was whether or not bestiality is considered acceptable? And if not, why not? But people are indeed say that. They're saying that it is natural, that people have no choice, and because people have no choice then we need to treat them with the kindness and respect they deserve.
No, they're saying that people have no choice, and because they have no choice the argument "it's a choice so it's unacceptable" is wrong. See the difference? By the way, I'll answer your question about bestiality. Is it wrong? I can't think of a reason why it would be (although I haven't thought much about it). Notice that bestiality is not two consenting individuals (nor is necromancy). So for people who consider those to be wrong but not homosexuality there is on obvious possible reason why. But unless I'm misinterpreting I guess the point you're thinking of would be better served by an answer from someone who actually thinks those things are wrong. If you are just playing devil's advocate, then I think it's great that you're looking for weaknesses in your own belief. I'm not sure this is one, though.
Yonkers, there's a gigantic difference between pedophilia and homosexuality... the difference is consent. The same could be said of your bestiality argument. I don't really care if people want to have sex with animals, but the animals can't consent so it makes sense to outlaw it. Everyone generally agrees that children are not mature enough to legally consent, but adults are. Whether any of these things are natural or not doesn't make them right or wrong. But consent does.
I'm not disagreeing. But on the argument of bestiality, should we outlaw eating meat? The animals can't consent to that so does it 'make sense' to outlaw it?
You've GOT to be kidding me. So you "never said you hated them or wished them ill will." I guess Obama's reference to the special Olympics was perfectly acceptable then? Because he never said he hated disabled people or wished them ill will, either. What you said was demeaning and dehumanizing... and then you turn around and bash others for "labeling" people... when you started it out by labeling all gays as having "an illness" or "mental issues." When are people going to understand that OVERT racism and sexism (i.e. "all gays should die!" or "blacks are inferior to whites!" etc.) is NOT the problem anymore? It's people like you who insist there's something "wrong" with people fundamentally different from the norm, and then hiding behind "oh, but I don't hate them... I just think they're defective." Disgusting.
what about people born with no, little, undiscernible, or both sexual organs? Technically and biologically speaking, they are flawed. Race is not a mutation or anomaly so don't bring that weak stuff in here.
What does that have to do with anything? That is just a handicap. Same as being born with only 1 leg. It is not comparible to being gay.
