Israel now admits they tried to sterilize Ethiopian immigrants

There's no scandal when a government tricks women into taken medication against their will and which prohibits them from conceiving even if the women were trying to start a family.

What's the big scandal if a government takes the choice of reproduction away from free women. Who cares if medication is given to free people against their will. What's the big scandal?

 

Nope, but you did just go into my bigtexx/basso category. 'Grats.

 

He JUST went into that category? Where have you been?

 

Do you have any proof that "the government" "tricked" women into taking medication "against their will"?

Do you have any proof that "the government" "took the choice of reproduction away from free women" "against their will"?

Didn't think so.

If what you wrote actually was the case and this was indeed a government-led concerted effort - there wouldn't be any offspring from Ethiopian women in Israel, right?

You leftists and Islamists just believe what you want to believe.

 

Yes, I do have the proof. Have you not been reading the thread? There is testimony from more than 30 women who were in the program, and statements from the program itself.

Talk about only seeing what you want to see... geez.

 

Yeah you can tell even by the tone of his replies he's moved into troll mode. Won't ignore him because I enjoy his posts in the GARM, but definitely won't try to engage him here in the D&D.

 

And what you are basically saying is incorrect from any Jewish definition of "who is a Jew."

As for the Rotschild family, and the hate, especially for the Baron, it started when this happened:

Neturei Karta are a bunch of nutballs and are only taken seriously by anti-Israel organizations and governments like Iran.

There are many (mostly SECULAR) Israeli Jews who believe zionism has run its course, and there is a lot of debate within that community as to what that means (two states, bi-national state). No one reasonable argues that Jews shouldn't be entitled to a country, just the means by which they are going to have to deal with the reality of sharing the land with the people who have no interest in being a part of it.

 

It's interesting, from a theological standpoint, how quickly opinions changed. Before the 1940s, very few rabbis (from all over the spectrum) advocated a Jewish state, believing that exile was penance. Convenient that the Orthodox diverted from previous doctrine on this issue, but not on others.

 

Agreed with glynch. Haaretz is left of center, and is comparable to the NYT, and has probably the most diverse and literate Op/Eds of any Israeli daily. Unlike the NYT, their paywall is much more difficult to beat

The Ethiopia story broke a while ago on TV (channel 8, an educational channel).

It is a scandal, but the shots originated with two Jewish NGOs, the American Jewish Joint Distribution Committee, and the Jewish Agency, who aren't the Israeli government.

As to how the practice continued in Israel (Health Ministry or Ministry of Foreign Affairs) is one not likely to be admitted easily without investigative journalists, and Haaretz will probably be the ones to break it.

The important thing was, it came to the attention of women's group called Isha L'Isha a few years ago and they prompted investigation by the Association for Civil Rights in Israel.

The LA Times also has a decent piece on it.

Considering that Israel is housing hundreds of thousands of African refugees (mostly Eritrean and Sudanese) who are not citizens, and not Jewish, unlike the Ethiopians who were brought here, and don't receive any birth control injections, I wouldn't look for a grand conspiracy.

If there is a general right-wing, religious obsession, it's about discouraging birth control and making as many Jewish babies as possible to outpace Arab population growth. This doesn't really jive at all with their kind of racism.

I don't doubt the anti-Falasha racism of some places in the Israeli government, but no Prime Minister would ever sign off on this as policy (especially since Ethiopians overwhelmingly support Likud).

 

Well, the state was founded by secular socialists, to be fair, but even from an ultra-Orthodox standpoint, if their mothers were Jewish, they were Jewish, period.

And even the religious political parties make clear that they are absolutely against democracy, even if they are elected to office in one. Their ideal state is a monarchy, and that monarch will be the Messiah.

Of course the Al-Aqsa mosque will need to be destroyed to make room to rebuild the Third Temple. Some argue that doing it NOW will bring the Messiah quicker! But that doesn't seem to bother Hamas or whoever if it means they can parade around a small subset of the ultra-Orthodox that agree that a Jewish state is abomination in the eyes of god.

 

What I'm saying is that they aren't Jew in the Abrahamic sense of it. Many of their beliefs are far, far too occult to qualify.

Israel was created out of land owned by others and has been propped up by wealthy backers, mostly Zionist bankers, from the West since it's inception. Perhaps the Jews do deserve a nation state but they were the ones who left their holy land centuries ago (forced or not) only to force their way back in, insulting Arabs in the process. And I don't think we get a balanced look at the situation from the Western media, which always makes Israel the state look good compared to the Palestinians.

From what I heard, there's a reason Jews have not been welcomed and kicked out of many countries but that's merely far out conspiracy I haven't researched enough on it, so I'll be silent on it.

 

There is no proof. I have read several articles about this, in several languages, and in every one of them, the government as well as those who ran the refugee assistance programs disputed that there was a systematic attempt against the women's will to sterilize them or force them to take a 3-month contraceptive.

You basically have a few women claiming that and those who were in charge of the refugee assistance programs denying it. That's only proof if you have a bias and want one side's claims to be true because it would confirm your anti-semitic bias.

Remember, these are Jewish women and the program is designed to "bring Jewish people home" - why would they go through all the effort to bring these people to Israel to then force them not to have children? Doesn't make any sense from Israel's perspective.

 

Fixed.

 

Yes, the thread title is VERY misleading. Having said that, what has apparently been going on is despicable, and those responsible should be made to suffer the consequences of their actions. If they violated criminal statutes, they should be charged. And they should certainly be sued by those given these injections against their will (if that happened), or if they weren't told what the injections were for, or what the side effects could be.

But yeah, someone should change the thread title.

 

Agreed. As I said before, if there is a widespread bias among the most conservative and nationalistic, it is an obsession with making Jewish babies. The right-wingers are not at all pleased about this and the Falasha community is one that tends to veer strongly religious and nationalistic themselves in their beliefs and voting habits.

Ethiopians are considered Jewish by halacha, and suffer no discrimination that say many Russians or non-Orthodox converts do by the Rabbinate in terms of marriage and so on. In Israel, only Christians can marry Christians, only Muslims can marry Muslims and only Jews can marry Jews, and a couple has to go abroad (a significant tourist draw for Cyprus) to circumvent that to get a civil marriage, as all marriage authority resists within a person's religion.

From the religious and nationalistic point of view, a single Ethiopian Jewish woman would not only be encouraged to marry a local born Israeli Jew, but to do so as soon as possible in order to make babies. You can be sure that the conservative elements of Israeli society are as upset about this as women's and civil rights groups are, albeit for a very different reason.

 

Which is just as ridiculous as many similar laws in Muslim countries, of course.

 

Oh look, another anti-Israel article. How surprising on this forum. The fact that the poster's name is Zion is rather ironic. I just don't understand all the Jewish hate here.

 

Theocratic fascism is theocratic fascism and should not be tolerated anywhere, anytime, for any reason, by any reasonable person.

 

I'm not saying any reason why they would do something like this. I have no idea why they would do this. You can ignore statements by the organization and more than 35 women, and pretend like that isn't evidence if you would like. Your ignoring the evidence has been noted. Thank you.

 

So, still no proof, just more senseless babble from FranchiseBlade.