I think that *some* white people are just good at being white. Whenever there is an opportunity for them to beat their chest in the face of racial discussion involving black people, they press forward with negative connotative jargon putting the black on the defensive. Soon after referencing some phantom double standard. Mind you, I said "I think" which is my opinion and "*some*" which means "not all."
The people from China are Chinese. in the mid 1800, Irish Americans and the newly arrived Chinese workers were vying for jobs in the Railroads in the Western States. The "C"words were derogatory terms invented by the Irish to insult the Chinese, to deride the Chinese as being inferior (cuz they don't understand English) and can't be trusted. The "C" word = cotton-pick'n "N" word for blacks very insensitive and insulting !
Generally, it depends on context. Everything depends on context, even the word "American". Let me give you an example. Let's say you are in a foreign country, you are an American, and a few teenagers on the street say this: Hey, look, an American! Hahahaha......American......Hahahaha" Now, would you feel offended? Of course. But, in a neutral context, I personally feel that the word "Chinamen" is a bit offensive. I can't explain why, but that was the first impression I got when I saw that word in the thread title.
It's all about context and what the word has become. If you look at the N word, I believe it had latin roots or something that meant black. So initially it could be associated with just a short or different way of saying a "black man". But over time, as it start to be used in negative and racist context it became a racist term. Look up a couple of threads, you can see the same progression for the C word.
droxford, The word is a racial slur on the same level as the n* word. Whether or not a person know this, the word is still a racial slur. It doesn't mean the person (who use it) is racist, but does mean that the person is at least ignorance (of the word.) I don't know if Kerr understand this. I do give him the benefit of the doubt, and there is no need to hang the man (unless he understand exactly what he was saying), but do educate him. And since it was used on TV where thousands/millions have heard it, there needs to be an apology of some sort so that these same viewers (those that are not aware of the meaning of this word) are educated about it.
I don't think so but I am using the term Englishman to answer the question. Sting is English right? Well he has a song (don't know the name) saying that he is "just an Englishman in New York...". Then again I don't think Englishman and Frenchman have been used in history as a derogatory comment like chinaman has. Of course I'm sure I'm wrong. I do think chinaman is offensive though and I may think that because I have met my Grandfather. He is the most racist thing I have ever met and he would say chinaman to anyone who look as if they were from China, Japan, Vietnam, etc... Even when he knew the person's name he would call him chinaman. He would also refer to any black man as "boy" and many other titles for different people, but a white man always received a name. He didn't care who the person was even if it was my girlfriend's son. I haven't had any contact with him since the day I met him. That's the funniest line I've read all day.
You can call me "Chinese Man" not "Chinaman." You wouldn't call someone from France, a "Franceman" would you? or someone from England, "Englandman?" English, French, Chinese. England, France, China.
Let's get that ****** to work harder... I need that negro to wash the dishes... Not necessarily with derogatory intent, but with a functional intent... so i guess all is good.
I asked a buddy and he said it was offensive, so I just call him chino.....but he is my buddy. I wouldnt go and call all Asians this.
Why nobody saying the same for the N-word? Cword=Nword, end of story. Don't quite understand why people are still arguing about it, except for those who enjoy pointless debate, or who has something against Chinese.
Droxford: The C word offends me as a Chinese American, I hope you can respect that. Its negative connotation might fade away in time, but not yet, and definitely should not be used on national television w/o at least a sincere apology. I didn't watch the game and did not find out about this incident until earlier tonight from the BBS. The fact that no major news source or sports related publications that I frequent each day on the net even mentioned this bothered a lot. Maybe there are too many people out there who thinks it is ok to use the C word.
*****man is offensive because the word is associated with coolies who did the white man laundry and gettin blowing up building the railroad. the word itself reflects a negative impulses in Chinese-american history. ie.. ***ger is an offensive word because it brings back memory of slavery. in this day and age dont you people think that Americans must refrain from insulting people race? whether we percived to be offensive it or not.
Yes it was a popularly used term to refer to Chinese through most of American history but so was "Darkie", "******", "Spic", 'Kike", "Pollack", "Dago", "***" and I could go on but you get the picture. One of my best friends had a grandma from Louisiana who was the nicest sweetest old lady you would ever meet. Even if she only knew you for 5 minutes she would want to feed you. Yet she always called African Americans "Darkies". Why because that was what she grew up with and she never saw anything wrong with that. She wasn't racist but she was ignorant and even though her family tried to correct her she kept on because she didn't know any better and was too old to change. BTW I hope people are offended by my using these terms because I'm making the point that these terms have resonance and even using them in a discussion like this where I'm trying to combat racism it is still uncomfortable hearing or reading them. Just like it is uncomfortable to hear the word "Chinaman" even when spoken innocently.
One more thought. Why I did vote that I found it offensive I don't support outrightly banning "Chinaman" This debate does revolve around political correctness and while many people are bothered by it there is a reason for it. Speaking for myself I am not always a fan of political correctness as it has become. We do live in a free society and the ability to voice ones thoughts, even if they are abhorrent, is a freedom not to be dismissed lightly. In this situation though I political correctness should be used to combat ignorance and not to silent. From reading Kerr's (not Stockton) statement it appears that he was truly ignorant about the term and not a racist. He has apologized and now understands why he shouldn't use it like that. That to me is how political correctness should be used. OTOH though because terms like these have powers they shouldn't be outrightly banned. Like the Asian American rapper who calls himself "Chinaman" or the group "*****z With Attitude" and "Queer Nation" these terms can at the same time be used to empower by turning the tables on those who used the term to oppress. These terms also have artistic and historical value because they are loaded terms. At the same time I also prefer my racists to be out in the open where they can be challenged rather than have them hide it. So I would never want to see these terms banned but their use should be carefully considered.
