fa, we were never in the running for Chandler. All we have is the mid-level exception (MLE), and since Chandler is a free agent, Chicago can and absolutely will match should Chandler for some reason actually take our MLE. Chandler will be offered much more than the MLE by Chicago or another team with cap room this offseason, so this is almost a moot point. Since signing him outright isn't likely, the only other way we could get him is through a S&T. We don't have anything realistic to offer the Bulls that would make them interested in a S&T, especially since they want to keep him. Memphis, I certainly respect your assessment of Swift over everyone else's, but I've also heard the 'stupid' or 'slow' tag (i.e. - low bball IQ) on Swift more than once before this season. I remember hearing that his Memphis teammates calling him "Slowmile" some time ago.
He played 1 year at LSU, thats all. He has been stuck behind Gasol in Memphis and hasn't really been given a fair chance. Remember, O'neal was stuck on Portland's bench for 5yrs before he became a star.
Still, that's one more year in college than Eddy Curry and Jermaine O'Neal... who was stuck behind Rasheed Wallace, Arvydas Sabonis and Brian Grant on a championship-caliber Portland squad. Stromile, on the other hand, plays for the Grizzlies. Though a good and competitive team, not exactly contending for a championship. I believe he would receive more playing time if he showed more. I mean, the last two years he's averaged less minutes than Pau Gasol, Brian Cardinal, Lorenzen Wright, Shane Battier and only .2 more minutes than Bo Outlaw. Of all the 11 players that received more than 10 minutes this past season , he was 10th on that list only ahead of Dahntay Jones. Perhaps Swift is in the wrong situation. Or perhaps he doesn't get it. Stuart
He was in the same situation as TMac was in. Except, Orlando was smart enough to trade TMac for what they could get. Memphis just chose to make it as hard as possible on Stro and then wave goodbye. Perhaps it was to send a message to present and future RFA's that they would try to ruin your career if you don't re-sign with them, I don't know. They did their best by playing Stro out-of-position at the 5 or not at all. Part of the problem was, look at your list, Memphis had a real problem at the 5. It was certainly unfair to Stro whether by need or intent.
What the heck are you talking about? Swift played 21% of Memphis' minutes at PF, and 11% of their minutes at center. He filled in at the 4 in the games that Pau Gasol missed. Swift got the same amount of playing time that he had in recent years, at the same position. The fact that he hasn't improved in five years is no one's fault but his own.
Here is the things about Swift: Worst case scenario: you have a solid back-up 4/5 who is pretty young and brings athleticsm in a long frame but it slightly a pain in the ass to manage. Best case scanrio: you have a force, a guy who is above avergae offensively (jump shot, a few occasional low posts) who is also one of the better 4 defenders in the league, think PJ Brown with a little more hops. Probably the reality is in between but even the low side helps the Rockets immensely. I don't care too much. Swift/JH, JH/Swift, SAR/JH--I see plus and minus to each. Swift adds the extra defensive presence and is younger, but he may fall kinda flat offensively. SAR is the legit (most proven) PF on the market and has a terrific all around offensive game. Swift can help out the back-up C when Deke is gone, SAR can help the back-up 3 spot. But overall, if we land either Swift or SAR we will have so much more of a formidable front line than we have had in years I would be ectastic with either. If these can't or won't happen (very plausible MLE is not in range), next plans are Donyell and Evans--but they have much larger downsides IMO.
Well, none of the players listed are real centers either and by that fact, the minutes should go up and not down for Stromile, but that didn't happen. We should ask "why?" As I said, he only averages the 10th most minutes on the team. The 10th. Behind Pau, Cardinal, Wright, Battier, James Posey... I'm not saying Houston shouldn't get him, but I was never one to think he was the answer to all our needs. He's an average rebounder and a good shot-blocker, athletic, but he shoots a poor percentage for someone that plays so closely to the basket (44 and 46% the last couple years) Stuart
On the flip side that is what Howard shoots and his overall production is on par on fewer minutes with a deeper team. JH and Swift are both about 45% last year, 47% career. Both are good Ft shooters, 71% Swift, 76% JH. If Swift is about = to JH offensively, and a better defender, that is an excellent player for us. I do like SAR's 50%/87% FG and FT shooting last year. But I know he doesn't bring some the the things Swift's does.
Cato is not a PF, Griffin played with Yao when he just got into the league and was still figuring things like boxing out. MoT does NOT have ups. And I dont know why you attributed that quote abuot SAR to me.
It;s a good point, we'd definitely be benefitting defensively, but Swift wouldn't be as effective an offensive player when placed in Juwan's role in our offense. Here's Why: I don't have the stats but my assumption is Stromile Swift gets a majority of his points on putbacks, layups, and dunks -- those alone should put him at at least 55% FG, why is he shooting 44 and 46% then? It points to his jumpshot being pretty bad. Whereas Howard gets the majority of his points on short jumpers where he isn't deadly but consistent. Stuart
i always think of swift as a poor jump shooter (and his 82games.com stats say he is) but it seems like he and wright were always draining mid range jumpers on us last year. has his jump shot just left him this year or something? i'm still not sure what to think of him. all that athleticism, but possibly dragging down the O with a poor jump shot. with howard draining his jumper and the 3 point shooters hitting, our offense was absolutely rolling in our 8 game winning streak mid-season. just tearing people up. with swift you're unlikely to get that. but i also have to imagine he would have the kind of offensive rebounding opportunities haslem has in miami and with his athleticism could take much more advantage of them than juwan. defensively, he would have to make us better if he tried. and i can't imagine someone getting away with not trying on D under jvg. so it seems he would have to be an upgrade to our team and with his youth and athleticism, helpful in many areas of need. however, i think it's all moot b/c someone will outbid us unless memphis wants to help us with a S&T. marshall still seems like the safer, lower-risk (read: cheaper) option but i wouldn't be unhappy if swift somehow ended up on a frontline with tmac and yao.
i think i would rather have SAR right now since we have Badaine who could be the same type of player as Stro. Imagine a PF combo of SAR/Badaine down the line!
Like it or not, here is my source: nWo34Life Contributing Member Posts: 5892 Joined: Jun 2002 Member: #4644 From Insider: By Chad Ford ...While every player in the postseason is battling hard for the ultimate prize � an NBA championship � it's no secret that many have multiple agendas this time of year. For the handful of players heading into free agency, the playoffs are the ultimate showcase for leadership, heart and the ability to make clutch shots... Stock down... Bonzi Wells, G/F, Grizzlies Playoff averages: 2 games, 7 ppg, 2 rpg, 44 percent shooting The skinny: Wells actually was a scoring machine in the 25 minutes he played. But his very public falling out with head coach Mike Fratello is going to come back to haunt him this summer. The Grizzlies aren't going to pick up their team option, and Wells, given his fiery reputation, is going to struggle to find a team willing to put up with him, regardless of his ability to score in bunches. He wasn't the only Grizzlies free-agent-to-be to get the shaft by Fratello. Swift had an amazing 25.3 PER, but could only get 16 minutes per game. His per 40-minute averages were 23 ppg and 17 rpg. Earl Watson didn't get any love either, though his play didn't do much to warrant it. He shot just 33 percent from the field... I guess that is what the heck I'm talking about.
IMHO, you and Chad Fraud are looking at this the wrong way... First of all, you're misinterpreting the article... Swift averaged 16mpg in the playoffs (a 3 game sample size, way too small to judge a player by, I think, but whatever), but he averaged 20.4mpg in the regular season under Mike Fratello, which is basically in line with the minutes he was getting under Hubie Brown. So again, I ask you, what the heck are you talking about?
IMO everyone will agree that a given player's stats are more revealing with the more MPG the player plays. As you pointed out Stro did not play many MPG this season. Therefore, his stats are skewed, I think to his detriment. I tend to take the more cynical point of view that he was played out-of-position without much regard to his well-being, image wise. Being 6'9" and 230 lbs. he's not very close to an even matchup to the Western conference centers. Unless he has amazing hops and athleticism he would not dominate PF's either. Regardless whether Stro is a great, good or average player was not really the issue of my post. The point was, you may have to read the whole article (long, and I cut up pretty good), that due to owner, GM, or coaches decision Stro and others were playing limited minutes and out-of-position and that made their stock go down as a basketball player more than it should have.
If we somehow sign Swift, what do we do with Juwon Howard, 'Spoon, & Vin Baker? 1/2 our payroll will be tied up in one position like the Knicks. No other team wants any of these players at their salaries for the full year. I know 'Spoon & Baker have expiring contracts, but we won't be able to dump them until near the trade deadline. Any trade before the season starts (assuming no lockout) will result in us receiving garbage in return. If we get rid of Howard, we STILL have a problem with DEPTH at the PF position, which is the real problem anyway.
We definitely do have a problem. Vin Baker is a 'player option' re-up, while Spoon is a guaranteed salary. Now, I think we can pay Vin not to come back. NIKEstrad said part or all of his salary would count against the cap, but not against the head-count. He, of course, immediately re-upped out of pure greed, IMO. He hasn't contributed in several years. Piss on 6/7 year contracts. Spoon will probably stay until the trade deadline. Ward? Padgett has one more year, so he expires this coming year like Spoon. We can make a few spots, but don't expect wholesale changes this year. 1-3 players is my guess. The players that are UFA's are as follows: Jon Barry Ryan Bowen Torraye Braggs Dikembe Mutombo Expect some re-signings, some UFA's gone, some UFA's new, and some S&T's like maybe Wesley, Sura, or James all of whom have Market Value. Hopefully Mutumbo will be back, but his stock is high and he may be out of our price range if he wants to make it so.
Most of the time, your posts are fairly logical but this one stinks. If the opportunity presents itself to sign or SnT Swift at a reasonable price, it's a no brainer. (Just like it would be for Donyell Marshall). I disagree with your concept of "garbage". While it's true that more teams throw in the towel at the trade deadline, rotational players can be had during the July-Oct time frame. A quick review of last summer.... * Danny Fortson for Calvin Booth * Kittles (expiring) and cash for a future 2nd rounder * Amal McCaskill re-signed and expiring Derrick Coleman (expiring) for Corliss Williamson. * Los Angeles Lakers traded guard Gary Payton, forward Rick Fox (who then retired) to Boston for guards Chucky Atkins. Jumaine Jones and center Chris Mihm. * Dallas traded forwards Eduardo Najera and Christian Laettner (both expiring), the draft rights to guard Luis Flores and forward Mladen Sekularac, two first-round picks and cash to Golden State for centers Erick Dampier and Evan Eschmeyer, guard Dan Dickau and the draft rights to guard Steve Logan. We're not going to get Kevin Garnett for Spoon and Vin but there is a market. And if the new CBA has shorter contracts, the contracts of players like Ricky Davis and Raef LaFrentz look worse. Their not All Stars but far from garbage. Baker makes a whopping $3.9m. We're going not sign Swift or Marshall because we're paying an IL player $3.9m? Ridiculous. You need to re-think this.
Yes, 'Spoon and Howard are the ones who make real money. I threw Baker in for good measure. Sorry if this didn't meet your standard. I'll take a bath and use deodorant next time. If you or anyone else thinks we will do a SnT and get rid of 'Spoon or Howard for an UFA like Swift or SAR, I've got a bridge in Brooklyn for sale at a steep discount. There has to be enough in it for the other team! The other team also must feel what they are getting from the Rox is the best deal available for them (or they must want what we could give them in the case of a SnT). Each of the trades you mention were of roughly equal value. In most of those cases, very little value switched hands. The same would happen to us. The only players on our team that other teams want are T-Mac, Yao & Mike James. Either because of age, injury, bad contract or lack of ability, no one else on our roster attracts much interest. If you disagree, tell me who else. Sura? Wesley? Padget? We can't trade UFAs like Barry and Deke. Juwan Howard can play but his contract is terrible. Remember the Mo Taylor trade? Nobody wanted him because of his contract. The Knicks took him off our hands only because they dumped Baker and Moochie off their hands. That trade bit us this year when Howard went down but we got shorter length contracts in return. So it was a good deal for us longer term. For the sake of trade value, Juwan Howard is pretty much this year's Motay. Anything is possible, and after what CD did last year, I'll give him a chance. My point is there are so many people who think a trade (or SnT) is such an easy way to improve this team. You must give up quality to get quality. What do we have to give another team? To answer your point: Of course we take the opportunity if it presents itself, but don't hold your breath. Oh yeah, bath time!
