Why? Not to sound like a broken record, but everything was pretty much okay till Pakistan intervened. Also Chievous I like your point C. The majority of people in India and Pakistan could care less about the hatred that is being spread by the government. One moment that will forever be ingrained (sp?) in my mind took place during a cricket match between India and Pakistan. Let me give you a mental picture. Imagine Rockets vs. Jazz, Cowboys vs. Skins, Yankees vs. Red Sox, Brazil vs. Italy, Sampras vs. Agassi and times that by 10! That is the level of hatred that exists during a cricket match between the two countries. Hate would be an understatement. Anyways I think all of you get the point. I was probably around 16 at the time this happened. I thought everyone in India and Pakistan hated each other. I thought the players hated each other with a passion. Well during a break I see all of the Indian players and Pakistan players in a circle talking, sharing a coke, huggin like best pals! I know for some of you this might be hard to comprehend, but I was just floored by this. I find out later on that alot of the players from the two countries were really good friends (match fixin might have something to do with that, but that is a completely differen topic ). Anyways the point I am trying to make is that the regular people of both countries probably do wish that they were on friendly terms with one another. I know I have said this before, but when I lived in India I had many Hindu and Christian friends and I never felt anything between us. My dad probably had more Hindu friends then Muslim friends. Now my girlfriend is Pakistani, and my best friends are also all Pakistanis. I sincerely hope that one day these people who are constantly in favor of war between the two countries realize the harm they are doing. I hope one day they actually start thinking about their kids. Do they want to pass on their hatred to the kids or do they actually want a better life for them? This is the 21st century. Let bygones be bygones. Apologize even if its not your fault. The majority of people killed in skirmishes and terrorists acts are of course innocent people like you and me. If Pakistan and India ever became friends it would be the happiest day of my life. Same goes for Israel and Palestine. I know I might be overly idealistic but it is time this world comes together and thinks of their future instead of the past.
Just giving you a hard time. I sorta read most of the posts here but not in-depth, but that quote jumped out at me!
Hey chievous, Maybe it's working already! ROckets03, Good story. I empathize entirely with your feelings and have the similar hopes. Lets look at Jerusalem. It has strong religious meaning to the big religions, and all are willing to kill over it. The city with arguably the most religious import is the most contested city? Does that seem like the ultimate irony? If the goals of religion are to practice divine ideals and get closer to God, how exactly does conflict and death accomplish that? Individually, we are on this world for a brief time. Why don't these 'religious' people worry more about their souls and eternity than conflict and death? BTW, is there really any ethnic difference between Indians and Pakistanis? Isn't it just religion?
ethnically its a bit different but most of the people are 'brown'. pakistan has four distinct enthic groups plus the 'muhajir' who are the muslim folks that moved from india to pakistan at the seperation. and pakistan has had numerous problems with ethnic fighting. india im not sure to be honest but for instance i can bet two of the five ethnic groups in pakistan are not in india...yet the punjab province in pakistan which is the biggest province borders the punjab of india which is also in india one of the richest states i believe. you have a vote cause thats the right thing to do. if you really do believe they all want to be in india..well fine thats what the results will show. if not you honor it. i don't think pakistan should control kashmir at all...however i think kashmiris should have a voice. thats what happened in puerto rico, montreal, timor, and should happen in kashmir.
i am too. no way in hell i'd want to be a president of a country or any important political figure in todays world. i don't know what to do right now...can't imagine how it would be to be a leader and have pressure from all sides pulling at you.
Great thread Ottoman. Rocket03 and opthers. It's is all new to me. Know next to nothing about India and Pakistan. I especially enjoyed Ottomans reference sources. Too lazy to do it on my own. I think that this shows the value of the give and take approach vis a vis what I call the lecture format in much of the university. The only time I had given any thought to the partition of India was when I was like Ottoman thinking about the Balkan thing. I was thinking that the British partition of India had perhaps been a good thing. Do those of you who know something about this think that the partition might have prevented Balkan type ethnic cleansing and warfare?
There is barely any ethnic difference except for what boy explained. I dont know if one can even claim a differentiation based on religion. India is the second largest Muslim nation in the world. More Muslims in India then in Pakistan today. One way to tell a difference would be language. The major language spoken in India is Hindi. In Pakistan its Urdu. And even they are basically similar except for a few words.
India before British rule had survived with Muslims and Hindus. Muslim invaders had basically conquered India in around the 15th century I think. There were many Muslim kings and Hindu kings ruling different parts of India. Later on it was predominantly ruled by Muslims for a while. Most rulers did not try to force religion upon the Hindus. It was quite peaceful actually as far as I understan. Then in comes the British with their crappy colonial dreams. They constantly caused skirmishes between Hindus and Muslims to prevent the people from thinking about British takeover. I recommend watching the movie Gandhi with Ben Kinsley for those of you interested in the partition. Definitely one of the best movies ever made.
by the way to my suprise and most others...there were numerous islamic scholars of that time who opposed a creation based on religion. so this 'india=hindustan/pakistan=islam' concept isn't really true. and as was mentioned...cricket games....they can hate each other they can have wars but they'd still have cricket games during the war against each other. god bless sports.
Actually the two nations have even stopped playing cricket against each other for the last year or so. Pakistan must be reeling from that ass whoopin India put on in the last world cup!
Wasn't Hindu/Muslim what caused the 'split'? The argument that supposedly Mulsims would not get a fair shake in the Hindu-dominated India. As far as the cricket, I wonder what would happen to the dynamics of this situation if the best players from Pakistan and India joined to form one team. With both peoples cheering for the same team, maybe it could break some ice...or maybe not.
I dont think that is ever going to happen anytime soon. The International Cricket body would not allow that. It is suppose to be a country vs. a country. Not countries vs. country. But if that were to happen it is safe to say it would be the best team of all time. Pakistan has some awesome bowlers and India has the best batsman of all time.
yes thats what supposedly caused the split however there were numerous muslim scholars of that time who didn't agree to the split...only after the formation did they leave behind their opinions and help pakistan...before hand they didn't want to see the split. rocket...my bad i haven't watched cricket in years
India: Population: 1,029,991,145 Religions: Hindu 81.3%, Muslim 12%, Christian 2.3%, Sikh 1.9%, other groups including Buddhist, Jain, Parsi 2.5% (2000) Pakistan: Population: 144,616,639 Religions: Muslim 97% (Sunni 77%, Shi'a 20%), Christian, Hindu, and other 3% (Figures from www.cia.gov) While your statement is technicaly correct (although only marginaly) I think it's a little bit misleading because of the vast size differences in the countries. The United States has more Catholics than Vatican City, but that doesn't make us more of a Catholic country than they are.
I think its pretty simple. Indonesia has the most Muslims so its the biggest Muslim country in the world. India has the second most Muslims in the world so its the Second biggest Muslim country in the world. Everything else is irrelevent.
