I would be hesitant to give Harden max money. He's playing as a 3rd option on a team with 2 top 10 players, on a team with iso-centric type of offense that shoots 3s, which shoots his style. The difference b/t a 1st to 2nd to 3rd option is HUGE.
He is only 22, will get better. Try to get him with a max salary or we will never have a all star player since we can not draft one with 14th pick.
Just a quick question for the harden max player crowd, why isn't he starting? Why isn't he playing 37 mins a night? Joe Johnson was a starter early in his career. The bucks traded allen because of redd coming on. If he was a max player type, he wouldn't come off the bench behind thabo eventhough he plays 32 mins a night. If you don't think he greatly benefits coming off the bench, you're mistaken. That being said, I think he's a very good player. People saying he's a top 5 sg is like saying someone is a top 5 center. What does it mean really? is he a top 15 player regardless of position? I don't think he is or will be. He's like a 10m player at best. To those to say he's more talented than joe johnson, I have a slight problem with that. Not a huge problem, but a slight one. I think the only thing he had on johnson is 3pt shooting, but to me johnson was a more complete player.
James Harden is a top 5 player at his position and is probably on the cusp of being one of the top 15 players in the league. While I'm not arguing that he is a max contract player at this point in his career, but you do have to take into consideration the fact that Harden is only in the 3rd year of his career and is only 22 years old. I invite you to look at the 32 minutes from a different perspective. When Joe Johnson left for the Hawks, he was heading into his sixth season. If you look at Joe Johnson's stats following his 5th season with the Suns, he was playing nearly 40 minutes a game. Compare those statistics with Harden's and you will find that they almost identical. If you look at stats such as scoring, rebounding, and assists, you will notice that that are rather comparable, with only one slight caveat. Harden is able to produce at a similar clip, however at nearly 8 minutes less per game. Also, you'll notice that James Harden's shooting % is nearly 50, which speaks volumes about his shot selection and decision-making skills. While Joe Johnson is certainly no slouch, Harden I would argue is a more efficient player. And lets not forget, this is Harden's 3rd season. Johnson was already heading into his 6th season when he decided to jet for the Hawks.
This one is too easy. Who cares about who starts? It's about who finishes. He's not like Jet or Manu who prefer to come off the bench. He's obviously a bona-fide starter in this league. The best thing about Harden is that he gets his without jacking up too many shots. 16 pts on 9.5 shots a game is really solid (scored 43 on 17 shots )...anytime he shoots over 15 shots per game, he puts up big numbers. It's not about minutes...it's about shot attempts. Durant and Westbrook dominate the ball.. His percentages are through the roof. Harden also gets to the FT line and plays good defense. He's easily worth max money and can be a #1 or #2 for another decade.
Actually I think the best comparison for James Harden now is when Tracy McGrady signed the max contract with Orlando. McGrady was not a proven franchise player at the time but he had shown signs that he could be one.
If he's a max player, they should make it to the Finals easily. If you have 3 max guys, one of which is an MVP candidate, and decent bigs like they do, and you can't make it out of the West this year, then something's wrong.
I wouldn't say easily. Spurs and Lakers are 2 teams I say that would give them a run for their max money.
To answer your question without debating the topic at hand: Harden doesn't want to start. He stated that publicly at the beginning of the season to lay a hot Thunder topic to rest. He likes coming off the bench as a gunner extraordinaire. Finishing the game is more important than starting. He understands OKC can better spread it's talent around with him coming off the bench and playing the 1st half with their 2nd unit. IMO, Harden is definitely a top 5 SG. If anyone disagrees, please name 5 SGs you'd want on your team ahead of Harden. Kobe and Wade are obvious. Give me 3 more. If he isn't already, Harden will be a top 15 player. As guys like Kobe, Pau, Dirk, Nash, KG, Manu, Duncan, Paul Pierce slide further down the hill, Harden will move up.
Yes McGrady showed signs because he was an all world talent that had the skill-set, physical tools, athleticism and most importantly size. Harden is a good player but he doesn't excel at anything. With all the posters gushing over him it only makes me question why? Yes, I understand he's only 22 but his ceiling is limited in my honest opinion. 22 is young but it's not like he's an 18 year old phenom with loads of untapped potential. How much better can he get realistically? This is his 3rd year in the league and this is when most guards really show big improvement and a lot of that potential has been tapped this year. He took that big leap this year and I just can't see him improving much more from what he is. He does everything well with no glaring weakness but he's not superior at anything. I think what we saw of him this year is pretty much what he will be on another team if he were a main option (obviously he'd have slightly higher averages across the board) I say that because he's a young player still but it's not like he's sitting on the bench with loads of potential not getting an opportunity like when Kobe first came into the league or Tmac in VC's shadow. My 2 biggest questions about him would be 1) Can he be a leader? I'd like to give him the benefit of the doubt and so I'll say yes but 2) Does he have the fire and killer instinct to be a Superstar level player? I don't think so. And I have no problem with that because not many players are but when they're not superstars I have a hard time paying said player MAX money. When I think Max worthy players I think Kobe, LeBron, Durant, D12, Dirk, Rose, Wade etc. NOT James Harden
What skillsets did Brandon Roy display on the floor that were so "superior"? Another question: In game 4, you think Roy could have euthanized the Mavs any better than Harden did in the 4th quarter? I'm not saying Harden = Roy so let's avoid that distraction.
This is a good point. A team with 3 max guys with good bigs and decent depth should be championship favorite. That said, I hear those who pointed out the "max" in Harden's case isn't as big a deal as other max players in the past. Perhaps the question should be: Is Harden a potential superstar franchise player? (You know, kind of like on Durant's level. ) Or is he a second banana kind of "max" player, like Bosh or Pau?
When you talk about max players, you're talking about players with a special skill andtraits. Either the guy is height-weight-speed or he's exceptional at a facet of the game.. harden has a good skillset, nothing special. Good is 10m, max is special. If you put harden on toronto, would they be a playoff team? Doubt it and his effeciency would go down too. That doesn't mean he's a worse player, just a bigger target on his back.hesin monte ellis money range to me.
Harden has made big improvements from year 1 to 2 and from year 2 to 3. Why do you think he will stop improving from now on? Youth is the most intrigging part about Harden and why teams maybe willing to throw him a max contract even if he's not a proven franchise player. Also I don't agree that Harden doesn't excel at anything. He is a great 1 on 1 player. He is a great three point shooter. He is the best playmaker on the Thunder (albeit that's not saying too much). No Harden is not a freak of the nature type of athlete, but I would argue he is the best SG prospect in the league. This guy was drafted no. 3 overall in the draft. It's not like he was not considered to have high ceilings.
In the 4th quarter of game 4 vs. Dallas, OKC had Harden as the primary ball handler, ran the pick and roll 12 times and came up with 24 points. I think this is an elite level "special" skill, no? http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-t...k-and-rolls-helped-oklahoma-city-sweep-dallas Besides, the max for 4 year players from an outside team is 4 years, $55 million. There are far worse ways to spend this money than giving it to Harden.
Funny you ask because I was actually thinking of B.Roy and I was going to mention him since he doesn't have superior skillsets/athleticism but what he had was worth more than those things. For starters Roy was a natural leader. Another big thing was he was clutch and had a killer instinct. One of the biggest things that made Roy so good though was that he could finish with both hands and he impacted the game even if he wasn't scoring by being able to dish out 10 assists and or grab 10 boards on a night when his shot was off. What Harden did in game 4 is what Roy night in and night out.
Harden is physically very well endowed. 6'5" in shoes, almost 6'11" wingspan. 37' max vertical. The guy is an elite level athlete and has great physical tools at the SG position. http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/James-Harden-1241/
