Iranians may be ready to vote Ahmadinejad out of power

There are plenty more, including Israel's Mossad and miscellaneous conservatives:

http://jeffreygoldberg.theatlantic.com/archives/2009/06/mossad_head_ahmadinejad_good_f.php

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/06/12/right-wing-neocons-rootin_n_214698.html

 

Does anyone think that this could devolve into a factional civil war with parts of the government and Revolutionary Guard fighting against each other?

 

don't think so. seems all the big boys are involved and there will be some sort of compromise forthcoming. my guess is that the biggest loser will be khamanei.

 

I seriously doubt it. Mousavi is still a firm supporter of the Islamic Republic. I think he would pullback before anything like that happened.

 

Maybe, I hope this is the beginning of the end for the UNELECTED Mullahs....to where a true republic emerges.

DD

 

The Civil Rights Movement in the US was no doubt helped along by television coverage of the violence against protesters. television coverage that may not have been available ten years earlier

 

If a military dictatorship headed by Ahmadinejad emerges, that is the worst possible outcome.

 

Obama may not be talking much, but he's making sure to keep the fuel on the fire:


With a Hint to Twitter, Washington Taps Into a Potent New Force in Diplomacy:

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/17/world/middleeast/17media.html?_r=1&hp

 

I don't think they are officially called an Islamic Republic but Islam is official the state religion and there are official benefits to Muslim citizens. Malaysia is a federation of different Sultanates and from what I recall they take turns being head of the whole country. I don't think they hold much official power though.

 

Islam and politics is like the old Roman Catholic church from the Dark Ages.

Let's hope their turn at the top of certain countries is not as violent...and is much shorter lasting.

DD

 

Here is an article that should cast some doubt on the theory that Ahmadinejad won the election due to his popularity in the rural areas of Iran. It doesn't offer anything conclusive, but interesting nonetheless.



Iran’s Rural Vote and Election Fraud

By ERIC HOOGLUND

I just heard a CNN reporter in Tehran say that Ahmadinejad’s support base was rural. Is it possible that rural Iran, where less than 35 percent of the country’s population lives, provided Ahmadinejad the 63 percent of the vote he claims to have won? That would contradict my own research in Iran’s villages over the past 30 years, including just recently. I do not carry out research in Iran’s cities, as do foreign reporters who otherwise live in the metropolises of Europe and North America, and so I wonder how they can make such bold assertions about the allegedly extensive rural support for Ahmadinejad.

Take Bagh-e Iman, for example. It is a village of 850 households in the Zagros Mountains near the southwestern Iranian city of Shiraz. According to longtime, close friends who live there, the village is seething with moral outrage because at least two-thirds of all people over 18 years of age believe that the recent presidential election was stolen by President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad.

When news spread on Saturday (June 13) morning that Ahmadinejad had won more than 60 percent of the vote cast the day before, the residents were in shock. The week before the vote had witnessed the most intense campaigning in the village’s history, and it became evident that support for Mir-Hossein Mousavi’s candidacy was overwhelming. Supporters of Ahmadinejad were even booed and mocked when they attempted rallies and had to endure scolding lectures from relatives at family gatherings. “No one would dare vote for that hypocrite,” insisted Mrs. Ehsani, an elected member of the village council.

The president was very unpopular in Bagh-e Iman and in most of the other villages around Shiraz, primarily because of his failure to deliver on the reforms he promised in his successful 2005 presidential campaign. He did have some supporters. Village elders confided, “10 to 15 percent of village men, mostly [those who were] Basijis [militia members] and those who worked for government organizations, along with their families.”

Carloads of villagers actually drove to Shiraz to participate in the massive pro-Mousavi rallies that were held on the three nights prior to the balloting. And election-day itself was like a party in Bagh-e Iman. Many people openly announced their intentions to vote for Mousavi as they cheerfully stood in line chatting with neighbors, and local election monitors estimated that at least 65 percent of them actually did so. “Although some probably really voted for [Ayatollah Mehdi] Karubi, who also is a man of the people,” said election monitor Jalal.

Of course, the Basijis with their mothers, wives and sisters did come out in force but were quiet, apparently timid about revealing their voting intentions “because they probably voted for Ahmadinejad,” continued Jalal. But he insisted that they did not count for more than 20 or 25 percent of the vote.

By Saturday evening, the shock and disbelief had given way to anger that slowly turned into palpable moral outrage over what came to be believed as the theft of their election. The proof was right in the village: “Interior Ministry officials came from Shiraz, sealed the ballot boxes, and took then away even before the end of voting at 9 pm,” said Jalal. In all previous elections, a committee comprised of representative from each political faction had counted and certified the results right in the village. The unexpected change in procedures caught village monitors off guard, as it did everywhere else in the country.

By Saturday evening, small groups of demonstrators were roaming the main commercial streets of Shiraz, a city of 1.5 million residents, and protesting the announced results as a fraud. People refused to believe that Ahmadinejad could have been re-elected. Larger demonstrations took place on Sunday, Monday and Tuesday, beginning in the late afternoon and continuing long after the sun had set. These attracted carloads of supporters from Bagh-e Iman and other villages, including several that were 60 kilometers from Shiraz.

Although the crowds shouted slogans such as “Death to Dictatorship,” most protestors shouted “Allah-o-akbar,” the popular chant of the 1978-79 Revolution. Indeed, in Shiraz, thousands climbed unto the roofs of their homes Sunday to shout ‘Allah-o-akbar’ for several hours.

Most villagers are supporters of the Islamic Republic, but they are ready for the reforms that they say are essential so that their children will have a secure economic future. They saw hope in Mousavi’s promise to implement reforms, even though he is a part of the governing elite.

But that political elite is divided over how Iran should be governed: a transparent democracy where elected representatives enact laws to benefit the people or a ‘guided democracy’ in which a select few make all decisions because they do not trust the masses to make the right ones. This astute political insight is one that is prevalent in Iran but seems to have escaped the notice of the Western reporters who are trying to explain Iran’s political crisis with resort to simplistic stereotypes.

Eric Hooglund is professor of politics at Bates College, Lewiston, Maine, and editor of the scholarly journal Middle East Critique. He is an expert on Iran, and his most recent publication is “Thirty Years of Islamic Revolution in Rural Iran” in Middle East Report, no. 250, spring 2009.

http://tehranbureau.com/2009/06/17/irans-rural-vote-and-election-fraud/

 

What about these Middle Eastern journalists being censored and thrown in jail?

http://cpj.org/2009/06/israel-sentences-two-to-prison-terms-for-censorshi.php

 

Hey go ahead and start a thread about it........that is not related in any way whatsoever to this topic.

DD

 

IMO, We cannot be mad at Bush for interfering with another sovereign power
because we don't like the leader
and
then turn around and be mad at Obama for not interfering with another sovereign power
because we don't like the leader.

Iran had elections
Dude lost.
Weather it is a farce or not . . .is not for us to say.
They have to work this out.
we cannot go giving support to every loser
[ie. money, guns, or economic sanctions]
just because we like them better than the winner

Rocket River

 

They counted votes 10x faster than they did in 2005. Americans aren't the one all up trying to push Ahmadinejad out... it's Iranians that want reform. We are just spectators on the sidelines.

 

I guess me and most in this thread and most in the media would qualify as this:

http://travellerwithin.blogspot.com/2009/06/to-you-new-iran-expert.html

Lol, it's pretty funny and definitely worth a look.

Of course it is...this thread has discussed many issues. Why do you think the media and posters here are ignoring these journalists being censored and jailed while, at the same time, expressing outrage over lack of press freedoms in Iran. These two things are happening in the same region and at the same time.

Also, I have no problem with peaceful protests, but what do you think the Iranian government should do when protesters become violent and start rioting and attacking government buildings?

 

So whats your opinion of the Iranian Government's response to the protest so far?

 

Take a cyanide pill and let the people start to rule their own country?

DD

 

From what I've heard it's been a measured response. I'm surprised they've let so much violence and rioting occur to be honest with you. I thought they would suppress these protests more ruthlessly African style. Like I said, I don't have any problem with peaceful protests, but I don't think any state would tolerate violence, rioting, and lawlessness.

Any thoughts on the question I asked DaDakota (the one you quoted when you asked me a question)?

Also, what do you think the reaction in the West would be if everything was reversed in this situation with Ahmadinejad and Mousavi?

Last question, what are your thoughts on those journalists being jailed and it not receiving any attention in the media?

Sweet!

What should Ahmadinejad supporters do? Take a cyanide pills as well? That would be like millions and millions dead!

 

I don't know what you've "been hearing", but all the violence and rioting has been from the Basij, Ansar, and the imported Arab thugs, loosed by the members of the coup.