Iranians may be ready to vote Ahmadinejad out of power

Are you saying that Iran hasn't had major elections since the Revolution? I counted it was around 30 of them without factoring in local elections. Most of them had a high degree of participation too. That's not speculation. That's a fact.

 

Your assumption is that since Iran has experience with large elections, then they must have some sort of system to count millions of hand ballots in a short amount of time. That's speculation. Facts would be defining the actual system.

 

WOW!!!

Iran's senior ayatollah slams election, confirming split

TEHRAN, Iran — Supporters of Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad and his main rival in the disputed presidential election, Mir Hossein Mousavi, massed in competing rallies Tuesday as the country's most senior Islamic cleric threw his weight behind opposition charges that Ahmadinejad's re-election was rigged.

"No one in their right mind can believe" the official results from Friday's contest, Grand Ayatollah Hossein Ali Montazeri said of the landslide victory claimed by Ahmadinejad. Montazeri accused the regime of handling Mousavi's charges of fraud and the massive protests of his backers "in the worst way possible."

"A government not respecting people's vote has no religious or political legitimacy," he declared in comments on his official Web site. "I ask the police and army personals (personnel) not to 'sell their religion,' and beware that receiving orders will not excuse them before God."

 

Read up Montezeri's background and that really isnt so shocking.

 

Fact: the earth is round.

What's your freaking point man?

Saddam has lots of elections during his reign. He won 99% of the vote. That's a fact. I bet those were legit elections too by your logic, right?

 

I think we agree that Iran has had plenty of large elections in the past, right? Unless you consider all of those elections to be fraud, the final results were accurate. How do you think those results were produced? There's no need to be an expert on Iran to understand that they obviously have a system in place to deal with large, robust elections.

Here's another piece of evidence that has been disproven:

http://tehranbureau.com/2009/06/13/faulty-election-data/

by

http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2009/06/iranian-election-results-by-province.html

 

Ayatollah Montazeri has been critical of the government for years. He actually was under house arrest for a good number of years because Khamenei saw him as a threat.

 

Okay, lets be clear here, you're saying every election Iran has had has been fraudulent? That's only the conclusion I can come up with since you're comparing it to Saddam Hussien's regime. If not, please tell us which ones you consider fraudulent and which ones are legit, if any, in your eyes.

 

In a country where "elected" officials are merely figureheads, I would not consider any election legit.

 

Kwame, where are you seeing that most elections have had a high degree of participation?

 

Is he a member of the Assembly of Experts or Nat'l council on security?

something to that affect?

 

I believe he is totally removed from government. He was actually supposed to succeed Khomeini as the "Supreme Leader" but was removed from that position after he spoke out against human rights violations.

 

thanks

I've have a crash course in Iranian civics in the last few days that's for sure.

 

A similar proclamation was issued by Ayatollah Yousef Sanei:

[rquoter]
proclaiming that Mr. Ahmedinejad was "not the president and that it is forbidden to cooperate with his government."

[/rquoter]

I will agree that there definitely is no smoking gun proof that the election was absolutely rigged. There is, however, a lot of circumstantial evidence. And there is such a body that if there wasn't a conspiracy to rig the election, there was a massive indigenous conspiracy by people who were core to the original Islamic revolution to make it appear that the election had been rigged. So both solutions require massive fraud perpetrated on the people of Iran by high level clerics and leaders.

Adding to this, the camp that claims there was a conspiracy to rig the elections has members who in the past have issued edicts claiming that rigging elections is against Islam, while the camp who says Ahmedinejad was elected fairly has members who have recently issued edicts saying that it is a good Muslim’s duty to fake election results if it benefits Islam.

Following Occam's Razor, the most likely solution is that the election was rigged by pro Ahmedinejad forces. Refusal to see that seems to me to be the exact inverse of the western-centric bias that is often alleged, and often true with respect to Iran analysis.

 

Then why is there a 20 pg thread dedicated to understanding and analyzing this one ? We could've just said that all elections in Iran are fraudulent and there's no point in debating this one then.

From wikipedia mostly, but that doesn't seem to be acceptable around here.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elections_in_Iran

If you dig a little deeper you can find turnout results on other elections and referendums and stuff.

I've been on a crash course myself.

 

I knew this was coming. But that's bull, Sweety. Is it so hard get to know that the majority of major mass media including Walter Disney, Time warner, New york post co., New york times co. and viacom are directly controlled or run by Jewish people, and of course Jewish people have very heavy hands in Hollywood? More importantly, Jewish people control a significant number of US's financial institutions (Oh they are sucking now by the way)and big cooperations. I am not arguing anything, just stating the facts. Good for them to make in this country as individuals.

However, who controls money molds American ideology and psyche and controls the country. Do you agree? The Jewish controlling media concept is not about race, it's about power and class in this country.

Of course not all Jews are rich, Jewish people would often stay a low tone and shun from the question if they are rich, but as an ethnic group Jewish Americans are undeniably powerful and wealthy out of proportion to their population that they do have major influence on America's foreign policy especially in mideast. The Israel issue epitomizes the Jewish lobbying effort. They run that holocaust events over and over each every year and every day. Being persecuted is one thing, abusing it to reach a different goal is another. Well you can say the same thing to the Chinese running Najing massacre over and over. The difference is that some Japanese vehemently deny the historical crime.

Let's cut the political correctness crap for now. By the way, regarding NBA, you should look at who own and run the NBA franchises, not who's working for them. The same about doctors. Who have the most influential to AMA? Who are sitting on the boards? I am not saying they are Jewish people, just a suggestion.

Lastly, you don't consider Indians asian?

 

Obviously another pro-western shill as Kwame has advised us.

 

And they are already blaming the West again...LOL.....

DD

 

I'm sorry, but this is crazy. Ok, so by the same argument, since white people are in the majority of executive positions, they are conspiring to keep white people in power?

I am not one to be PC, trust me or ask anyone on this board...you my friend are being ridiculous. YOu have to back up what you are writing, because it's an awfully poor and shaky stereotype you are making. Problem is, I mean, what you write is ridiculous on so many levels.

So what if there's a lot of Jews in media and Hollywood? What difference does that make anyway?

 

Please... STFU.

Signed,
All Jewish people

P.S. - 1934 Germany wants it's thought process back.