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In This Thread Every Post Must Contain A Lockout Update

Discussion in 'NBA Dish' started by DallasThomas, Nov 1, 2011.

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ascaptjack Member

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IraHeatBeat Ira Winderman
When considering where NBA negotiations stand, keep in mind that Monday is closer to the true deadline for salvaging Christmas and 66 games

#1881 ascaptjack, Nov 25, 2011

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sam_amick Sam Amick
NBPA Executive committee members privately expressing unprecedented optimism that a deal will get done this time. League sources too.

sam_amick Sam Amick
Essentially replacing Kessler with Quinn is huge. Been there, done that, though, as far as "optimism." Now get it done.

#1882 ascaptjack, Nov 25, 2011

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DaDakota said: ↑

Ascaptjack,

Not an update, but I really appreciate all your hard work....

DD
Click to expand...

My thoughts exactly. I check this thread constantly to see what the insiders are saying/tweeting. Thanks bro!

#1883 JamesC, Nov 25, 2011
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Just to add a few things...

Spurs owner Peter Holt, chairman of the owners' labor relations committee, also was in New York for Friday's settlement conference on the 148th day of the lockout, as was former union president Derek Fisher, sources told CBSSports.com. Tempestuous players attorney Jeffrey Kessler will not be present. While Kessler still is "very much involved," according to a source, he no longer has the role of lead negotiator for the players and has been replaced in that capacity by Quinn, a voice of reason with a long history of deal-making with key figures and attorneys on both sides of the dispute. CBSSports.com
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Howard Beck: A few notes about the framework for today's NBA talks: 1. They are picking up where they left off Nov. 10: Same 50-50 proposal on table Twitter
Howard Beck: 2. These are technically "settlement" talks bc of players' lawsuit, but they are being treated as extension of previous negotiations. Twitter
Howard Beck: 3. All parties agreed IN ADVANCE that nothing in these talks would impact the litigation or be used to prove either side's case in court. Twitter
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With those dynamics in mind, the talks take the form of a legal settlement as opposed to a collective bargaining resolution -- with many of the same participants still involved but some new faces, too. The players' lead attorney in the antitrust action, David Boies, has teamed with former NBPA lead outside counsel Jim Quinn in an effort to push the deal across the finish line. Multiple people connected to the talks have told CBSSports.com that the discussions could move quickly towards a deal after the momentum gained in the past week from back-channel talks spearheaded by Quinn, who was a key figure in ending the 1998-99 lockout. But one person in frequent contact with ownership cautioned that it may take the entire weekend to find common ground, adding that there "could be some anxiety" in the room Friday. CBSSports.com
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Bernie Lee: unfollow every person who tries to sell "optimism" 2day its bs bcuz the truth is, no one IN THE ROOM is talking, therefore its all guessing Twitter
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#1884 coachbadlee, Nov 25, 2011
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KBergCBS Ken Berger
Negotiators taking a break. Adam Silver, Peter Holt and Dan Rube just stepped out of office tower. They'll be back, league spokesman says

#1885 ascaptjack, Nov 25, 2011
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HowardBeckNYT Howard Beck
Break in NBA talks, which will resume shortly. Could be another long one

KBergCBS Ken Berger
Stern, Silver, Buchanan, Dan Rube and Peter Holt are representing the league in tonight's talks.

KBergCBS Ken Berger
For the players, it's Hunter, Derek Fisher, Mo Evans, Ron Klempner and Kevin Murphy.

KBergCBS Ken Berger
Jim Quinn is not present for players, though one of his partners is. Jeffrey Kessler also not present.

#1886 ascaptjack, Nov 25, 2011
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HowardBeckNYT Howard Beck
As you can see by the lineups this is basically the same people discussing same issues. The antitrust lawyers are not part of the talks

#1887 ascaptjack, Nov 25, 2011

what Member

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Somehow I think that the Christmas Day games were the deadline all along. It sucks that Stern and Co. knew this all along, but here we are.

We will get a deal soon, I think.

#1888 what, Nov 25, 2011
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alanhahn Alan Hahn
Hours upon hours of time the #NBA and players have spent talking. Today should have been simple: give on 2 system issues and shake hands.

#1889 ascaptjack, Nov 25, 2011
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http://ken-berger.blogs.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entry/11838893/33495634

NEW YORK -- Negotiators for the NBA owners and players were meeting Black Friday for litigation settlement talks in the hopes of laying the groundwork for a collective bargaining agreement to save the 2011-12 season.

The starting point in the negotiations essentially is where the bargaining talks left off Nov. 10, when the players were left with an ultimatum from the league to accept the framework of a 50-50 revenue split or face a far worse offer. Instead of sending the proposal to the union membership for a vote, the National Basketball Players Association dissolved Nov. 14 and launched multiple antitrust lawsuits against the league's owners.

UPDATE: With those dynamics in mind, the talks take the form of a legal settlement as opposed to a collective bargaining resolution -- with many of the same participants still involved but some new faces, too. The players' lead attorney in the antitrust action, David Boies, has teamed with former NBPA lead outside counsel Jim Quinn in an effort to push the deal across the finish line. But neither Boies nor Quinn was present at Friday's negotiations. Kessler, stripped of his role as lead negotiator for the players, also was not present.

Representing the players Friday were former union officials Billy Hunter and Derek Fisher; executive committee member Maurice Evans; general counsel Ron Klempner; economist Kevin Murphy; and one of Quinn's law partners. For the league, it was commissioner David Stern; deputy commissioner Adam Silver; Spurs owner Peter Holt, the chairman of the labor relations committee; general counsel Rick Buchanan; and deputy general counsel Dan Rube.

So the so-called litigation settlement talks had very much the same dynamics as the bargaining talks that broke off Nov. 10, leading to the players' decision to dissolve the union and launch antitrust lawsuits against the owners on Nov. 14. This, with one exception: there were strong indications that Quinn, one of the key figures in ending he 1998-99 lockout, had laid important groundwork during secret discussions he brokered earlier in the week. Stern and other league officials were seen Tuesday at the same location where Friday's talks were taking place.

Multiple people connected to the talks have told CBSSports.com that the discussions could move quickly towards a deal after the momentum gained in the past week from back-channel talks spearheaded by Quinn. But one person in frequent contact with ownership cautioned that it may take the entire weekend to find common ground, adding that there "could be some anxiety" in the room Friday.

On the 148th day of the lockout, but the first since the labor impasse was transformed into a court battle, there seemed to be little effort to hide the appearance that the faces and issues hadn't changed. A key difference was the absence of Kessler, though the tempestuous attorney was still "very much involved" behind the scenes, according to a source.

The players are hopeful that the owners will be willing to offer substantial movement on a handful of system-related issues around which the talks crumbled two weeks ago, resulting in the unprecedented disclaimer of the NBPA and threatening that the season would be swallowed up by lengthy, costly and unpredictable antitrust litigation. To account for some of those concessions, which would result in a more flexible and opportunistic free-agent market than the owners last proposed, it is possible that the split of revenues could inch upward above 50 percent for the players -- with the remaining difference accounted for by an escrow system capped at 10 percent as teams and players adjust to a reset of player salaries and more restrictive system than the one that existed under the CBA that expired July 1.

The most difficult issues to resolve will be the availability of the mid-level exception for luxury tax-paying teams; sign-and-trade transactions for tax payers; and the definition of a tax payer. Coming out of the collapsed bargaining talks, these were the items that bothered the players the most in terms of restricting player movement -- especially the notion that a team would be considered a tax payer prior to use of an exception that pushed it over the tax line, as opposed to afterward.

But while league negotiators were not expected to fully move toward the players on all the outstanding system issues, there has been "positive movement" from the owners in recent days "to get a deal done," according to the person in contact with ownership. The biggest factor in the potential for a deal by the end of the weekend is not the players' lawsuits, but something much more predictable and relentless: the calendar.

Both sides understand that a season tipoff on Christmas, which would deliver a 66-game regular season with the NBA Finals pushed back only one week, would require an agreement by Monday at the latest. Even that would be pushing it; the league will need about 30 days to finalize the deal and hold an abbreviated free-agent period, training camps and preseason games.

As necessitated by the union's disclaimer, any legal settlement wouldn't be able to take the form of a CBA until the union reformed and was recognized by the owners.
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#1890 ascaptjack, Nov 25, 2011
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AlexKennedyNBA Alex Kennedy
Derek Fisher and Mo Evans are at today's meeting. They didn't want to leave their families but were told that the NBA is ready to negotiate.

#1891 ascaptjack, Nov 25, 2011
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WojYahooNBA Adrian Wojnarowski
As for progress in today's NBA talks, high-ranking league source says: "They literally just started talking about the actual deal points."

#1892 ascaptjack, Nov 25, 2011
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Chris_Broussard Chris Broussard
Another good sign: NBA owners have Labor Relations Committee conference call scheduled for later tonite, sources say

#1893 ascaptjack, Nov 25, 2011

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Chris_Broussard Chris Broussard
First good sign is DFish, Mo Evans at meeting. Union would have to re-form 4 deal to take place, so their presence may b sign of progress

#1894 ascaptjack, Nov 25, 2011
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SamAmicoFSO Sam Amico
In restroom at D-League game, prominent NBA agent says: "I think we're close to getting this thing over with." Have fun with that one.

#1895 rocketblaze, Nov 25, 2011
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Chris_Broussard Chris Broussard
Source close to talks gives vague update, says progress being made...

Chris_Broussard Chris Broussard
Labor Relations committee must approve any changes owners make in proposal to players

sheridanhoops Chris Sheridan
We've hit the 10 hour mark at lockout talks. ESPN says owners' labor relations committee holding conference call. They must approve changes.

#1896 ascaptjack, Nov 25, 2011
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Chris_Broussard Chris Broussard
Labor Relations committee must approve any changes owners make in proposal to players

Chris_Broussard Chris Broussard
Source close to talks gives vague update, says progress being made...

#1897 rocketblaze, Nov 25, 2011
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Wait.., so if they are holding the conference call, then that means that they have already agreed with each other, right?

#1898 coachbadlee, Nov 25, 2011

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rocketblaze said: ↑

Chris_Broussard Chris Broussard
Labor Relations committee must approve any changes owners make in proposal to players

Chris_Broussard Chris Broussard
Source close to talks gives vague update, says progress being made...
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I like your optimistic sig

#1899 RedNation, Nov 25, 2011
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coachbadlee said: ↑

Wait.., so if they are holding the conference call, then that means that they have already agreed with each other, right?
Click to expand...

#1900 ascaptjack, Nov 25, 2011

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