Typical response from a troll. Everybody here didn't whine and b**** when Steve didn't take the team to the playoffs the first 3 years. I for one, didn't expect him to lead him to the playoffs during his first year, or his second and third. The same goes for Yao. I didn't expect him to lead the Rockets into the playoffs last year. And this year we're on pace for the playoffs. So much for your argument.
Hey, why am I not surprised. When Steve lead us close to the playoffs it's all Steve. When Steve play like crap it's never his fault. Well hell Steve sure led us this year.
I find it amazing that you find it amazing....unless you haven't been watching the Rockets last year and this year, that's the only reason why you wouldn't be able to see the difference, or if you were just another basher, pouncing like a vulture after a bad game.
Low expectations. MacBeth's post essentially can be summed up in a few words: "Steve isn't an ******* and wants to win." Holy crap. What a frickin' compliment. The same can be said of many, many players. The problem isn't that he's an *******, but that he's contributed little in many games when the team doesn't play his style... which, overall, is probably a counterproductive style.
I can say that It was Steve's Fault for not bringing it tonight, and on many other nights this year. Yes he is having a bad year, and it is YAo and our other players stepping up this Year, But you cant deny the fact that HE HAS LED the team in previous years. Thats what my argument was about, not weather its "his fault" or someone elses.
yes i can. in previous years his individual accomplishments led to a lot of wins. this year by defering to a team oriented style, he is leading the TEAM to the playoffs. his stats may have declined a bit but everyone is more involved in both the offense and defense this year. his willingness to go along with JVG's system is an example to the rest of the guys, that is leadership.
I was really disappointed with Francis's play recently. The big nights for him used to be 40 some points, tons of rebounds and dunks. And now, it is a big night for him if he scores 20 some points, shoot above 45%. Go figure, structured bball, slump, haircut, whatever it is. Can we be an true inside-out team while SF and Cat exist on this team. Should they defer to YM? I dont think they should, and I dont think they should co-exist with YM either. I would love to see either, 1) trade Cat for a pg, and move SF to 2 or 2) Trade SF We need Fisher, Parker kind of guys, who play their roles deferring to Shaq and Ducan, but makes shots when they are supposed to. SF is just too good for just doing that.
The Rockets should get a good passer who can shoot a good percentage from outside. That's not expensive.
I think what's happening is that most of us have followed the games too closely, got too emotionally involved, which makes us lose the perspective of the big picture, sometimes. I posted my taking on Steve's situation on another thread, Is Steve the heart & Soul of the team? --daoshi
I never mentioned Yao in this thread, you and others are the ones that brought it up. I am somebody that believes credit (and blames) where they're due. Kudos to Steve for his play during those years, bad Steve for his play right now. I hold the same standard for Yao. I thought he played like crap against Boston the first time and both times against Memphis so I posted that he played like crap. But I also credit him with being the one that's leading the team right now (the last 2 weeks or so). What I don't understand is what makes some people so persistent in defending Steve. We already CAN'T use the we have a bad team excuse any more, we CAN'T say we have a coach that doesn't do anything, we CAN'T pin it on Moochie and we CAN'T say Yao isn't playing well enough. Yet I see Steve, in his 5th year, being defended for boneheaded mistakes while Yao, in his 2nd year being blamed for normal mistakes (ie. bringing the ball too down, grabbing boards, stamina, etc). The bottom line is, Steve deserves every word of criticism, just as Yao did 3 weeks ago (just making it clear I'm not a so called YOF). So either he respond like Yao did, play better or play up to his level, or he'll be traded this summer.
I agree that he deserves the critisism, but as long as he is a member of this team, I will continue to support him and defend him and try to see the best in him. You can call that whatever you want to call it. It doesnt mean that I am going to defend every scrub on the team, but Steve CAN be a great player when he puts his mind to it and when he is ready to accept and take on what is necesarry to be a real Allstar.
Yep. That's what I see too. GREAT athlete, but good player. It's important to point out that a lot of fans are dazzled by his "great athletic feats" which tricks people into thinking that his *total game* is just as great. It's an illusion. By the way, "good players" have been known to be the SECOND/THIRD best on some rosters. So, don't be fooled by the "great athletic feats." What's that saying? All "Sound and Fury Signifying Nothing..."
Haven; the voice of reason. MacBeth, What you say about Francis is all very true, and I personally like the guy. I have never wanted anything but success for he and Mobley. Unfortunately, they have experienced the most success when Yao is at his best. That leaves the only truly relevant question: Are Steve and Cat the type of players that compliment Yao? If not, we are in the very enviable position of having one of the most popular, marketable, and desirable commodities in the NBA with which to find those players.
All I got to say on this subject is... MacBeth, I'm an even nicer guy than Steve. The Rockets can leave me on the bench all day (as long as I get a nice view of the court), and I won't say a word. I might never get my number called, I might never even touch the friggin' ball... but I guarantee you I'll be the happiest sonuvabitch this side of the Mississippi. Is it time to give me a job? Let's judge Steve on the merit of what we *really* care about (on this forum at least): his performance on the court right now, and his future potential performance. His performance on the court right now is appallingly awful. And again, he was a very nice guy (by all appearances) last night, but he also played like crap last night. He's making poor decisions (thanks MJ for reminding us how a real point guard plays), and he can't make open shots. For the amount of time that he holds the ball, this is a serious weakness in the team. But I'd agree that he still has potential. His willingness to try is encouraging, and his lack of public complaint is also encouraging. But none of these things are, of themselves, satisfactory. It's not enough for me for him to be trying... at some point, he has to turn it on and prove he belongs on *this* team. So, I say, it's still too early to write SF off... but the clock is definitely ticking.
MacBeth, I also wanted to say that your post is correct that we HAVE NOT seen any "ego" trip from Francis in terms of "It's MY TEAM!" We HAVE NOT seen any jealousy of Yao. And we HAVE seen a true effort on Francis's part to be a team-player (doing what JVG wants). I'm torn. Because I know that he's trying. But it's frustrating because there's no improvement. And let me tell you this....because Francis is trying to do the right thing, has probably saved is job for the time being. Because if there was even a HINT of "me me" or "ego" he would have already been thrown off the team (traded by infuriating the fans by demanding more, without giving back the same). So, in my case. I'm frustrated at his game. But I don't hate the guy. I'm sure he's a nice guy. But lets be truthful. In the end, winning is all that matters. Francis can either improve his game and enjoy the ride, or not.
I'm confused as to where people are getting that I was saying being a nice guy means we should keep you no matter what your production. And, no, it can't be reduced to "Steve isn't an ******* and wants to win." any more than haven's response can be reduced to " I disagree." There are certain nuances implied in both posts which transcend those oversimplified renditions. Part of what I was saying was that Steve does none of those things...things which we have been saying are second nature to him for years ...and it's gone by virtually unnoticed because of his recent poor production. Now, think about this. We have all agreed, or most of us, that a significant obstacle to Steve being able to maximize his talents over the years has been his attitude, and his unwillingness to trust his teammates. We all know he can produce, and I would suggest that judging a player's production based on a slump and completely overlooking what you already know about his capabilities is a bit short sighted. Yes, he's struggling...players do...all the time. And part of it might be because he's adjusting to a new system. Do his struggles mean that he is incompatible with the system? Not really...and especially not if his willingness to adjust is evident. THAT has been, I think, our gereatest concern. Steve is a supremely talented player, and any good coach in the league can find a way to use his talents effectively in a system, even if it's secondary to Yao, if he has the willingness to adjust. He has shown he has hthat. To me, this is huge. But people are blinded by box scores right now, and forgetting what they know. The point about inside out is that, eventually, it will make opportunities easier for the perimeter players. Steve has enough talent that that will resut in significant production...but it might take some time. Does this mean that he will become the ideal prototypical point guard? No, but he has enough talent that it's worth tinkering with prototypes within the system, and Steve and Yao are our future. People who make snap judgments based on a player slumping almost always live to regret it.It's not that Steve's a nice guy...it's that what we always thought whas a hige obstacle seems to have been overcome, and we've hardly even noticed...
I agree with this. But I've ignored is PPG. I'm only concerned about is FG% and TO%. Because those are telling stats that are directly linked to his understanding of the JVG system; teamplay, pick and roll, passing lanes....etc... I've said it before, I don't care if he scores 14ppg, 17ppg, 21ppg, 24ppg, 29ppg....as long has he shoots a high percentage for a guard (48%, or at least close to it) and can adapt to the situation by getting others involved if his shot is not there. Here's a question to ponder.... Which one of the two is more likely to happen in the next two years? .... A) Francis improves his passing efficiency? B) Francis improves his shooting efficiency?
1. I wasn't even replying to you in my initial posts. 2. Bringing Yao into the whole conversation was a joke... in other words SARCASM 3. And so AM I, I also give credit where it is due.
