The skillz you have mentioned so far are english and a cash register. A cash register is trained by each store right? I mean I think each store has a different computer system. Your argument is that they pay the same and who fills which position is based on skills. I am saying that if they both pay the same then who fills which position is based on one is illegal and the other is a legal worker who can speaker english.
no, its based on americans aren't willing to do those jobs, not at minimum wage. the industry isn't viable paying people more than minimum wage. the reason the industry has exploded in the last 10 years is an obvious reason, cheap prices because of unskilled laborers willing to do work that americans weren't willing to do.
What about cleaning toilets. Would that industry also fail without illegals? I think not. We still need to clean them. If you are talking about the lawn care industry, you are just wrong. The change in technology has far outpaced the lowering of labor cost per hour.
No I am saying if they both pay the same and one is more desirable than how are the different workers placed? My argument is the illegals are excluded from these jobs limiting their available job market.
So is this a good summary? Me: Illegal immigrants lower wages for americans. You: Americans are unwilling to do those jobs, thus wages are not lowered Me: Americans are unwilling because the wages have been artificially lowered. You: Well some industries only exist because of those artificially low wages. Me: Not for Hotel, restaurant, custodian, and lawn industry (gives numbers for lawn care profit margins) correct?
Well obviously before illegals it was legal workers. these jobs salaries have been stagnant. Why raise wages if you have plenty of labor willing to work for current wages. This trend can be found even if the job market is not dominated by illegals. Just enough employers willing to hire them to cover a certain percentage of jobs can drastically bend salary curves with respect to time.
And think about this, we all know that the lady who turns down your sheets in a hotel (in Houston anyways) will probably not speak english. 5 custodians for a 100 room hotel. they are likely the only illegals working there as front desk staff and manager need to be legal and speak english. Move them from 7 per hour to 10 per hour at an average of 50% occupancy. does that kill the hotel business if it increase the room rate by a dollar a room? No it just decrease profit margins. hotel rooms are market priced anyways so the price would likely not change for the customer. Illegals hurt honest workers and help owners and high income bracket. They directly expand the gap in rich/poor by being here and making less and indirectly by lowering lower middle class wages and increasing wages of upper class business owners.
this is a silly argument, laborers are paid according to skill required to do the job. we have a job market where wages are pushed up by Unions (and I'm not anti union), the auto industry. look what happened and look what happened there. to argue that an employer can just increase the pay willy nilly for no reason is silly. there has to be a reason.
I find it hilarious that a conservative would argue that employers should pay higher wages just for the hell of it
Not for the hell of it. They obviously will not do it for the hell of it. they will do it when the government starts enforcing labor laws. also way to realize I am quite liberal on this issue. I think a true conservative and being pro illegal worker is being pro big business. The illegal worker has a limited market to sell their labor. so they must sell it at a lower price. It is like painting your car hot pink, you just drastically reduced your market. So the markets they can sell in have an excess of labor and the wages artificially drop and are stagnant. since this portion of the market is now artificially lower you, as a legal worker, did not even consider them. Why would you sell your much more desirable car at the place that is going to paint it anyways?
and how do you come up with a minimum charge of $60 costs no more than $500. I mean considering that the regular mower is 10 times less, its hard to see that you're saving that much gas.
60 per hour is the minimum usually. Like in my example if I can mow and trim your 8K Sq. Ft. lawn in 15 minutes I will still charge 20 bucks not 15. So I was comparing 22.5 of labor plus gas/equipment costs to the gross revenue. Oops sorry I should explain further. 1 dollar per minute is the usual charge so that is 60 per hour. the above example shows yards that would yield more.
lets just keep it at the mower costs since this your claim of why the industry has exploded. you're taking on $38 more dollars because of difference in mower. how do you come to that conclusion.
I was just giving you an example of what the gross revenue is and what the typical major costs are. No I am saying the difference in the newer mowers allow the time spent mowing to be greatly reduced. Sorry it thought you understood it a while back. The new machines are much much faster.
not buying Casey, given costs of larger mower vs. time saved, I don't see that big of a difference. and as stated earlier, its kind of an irrelevant point because a lot of these guys are still using regular mowers
Not the guys trying to make money. The reduced cost of labor destroys the cost of a better mower. Have you ever seen a modern commercial ZTR mow? they can MOW at 8mph or better. Stop and reverse instantly. Turn in one spot like a tank. Trees and other obstacles are these things bread and butter. A homeowner would never pay 6K to finish their yard in 15 minutes compared to 1 hour right? But if I am paying someone an hourly rate it pays for itself FAST. <object width="640" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/jNQIFLzKOds&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/jNQIFLzKOds&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="640" height="385"></embed></object>
the illegal worker is limited by his sill. there are plenty of illegal workers here with more skills than the guys who are limited to jobs like mowing lawns. the illegal worker is limited by their skills like any legal worker
So Macy's will hire an illegal if he is a genius on cash register and speaks perfect English? I doubt it. their market is limited certain industries and it has little to do with what their job skills are.
