look, i honestly and sincerely don't want to rehash this, but... (deep breath) he did not suck his first three years; he was, at the end of the 2004 season, right where everyone thought he should be. no one was calling for him to be replaced - EVERYONE thought the team was on the brink of being a playoff contender. well, everyone but me, still... so he had developed propoerly, had the physical tools, and had proven himself to be a tough, durable QB. when he and the entire team, from the GM down, imploded in '05, it was reasonable to assume/hope it was a team-wide abberation, and that a new coach/system would bail him out and the team could continue building around him.
1. how is sucking in the present irrelevant? he sucked then...he sucks now...he'll suck tomorrow. the present is the future they signed him for, ric. in absolutely no way, shape or form was it a good idea to waste another year on david carr. sorry. you'll never convince me that signing an awful player to play QB was a good idea. 2. it's called sarcasm.
I felt that way at the time, too. But Max and many others were screaming that he sucked at that time. You know what? They were right. Imagine it and enjoy it in your imagination, because that's the only place you'll ever see it. It can't be more obvious. The guy is damaged goods. Not every 2nd rounder is a Demeco Ryans. At any rate, it's irrelevant because the first half of your scenario will never exist in real life. Sarc meter, bro. Look into one.
So you are saying the Texans are the better team than the Titans, besides the fact that they have a worse record because they lost to the Titans?
The fact that the Titans are the better team by virtue of one game where Kerry Collins was under center seems to counter any notion that Vince Young has much to do with their record or success.
I call that revisionist history because a good portion of the people in this town (myself included) thought Carr was garbage and thought the team was making a crucial mistake in extending him. I am baffled that I could see the sucktitude and the GM, coach and countless others who are paid to make these decisions couldn't. I understand that Carr had his supporters (you being one of them) but it is clear the team made a mistake. They put their support behind a suck-ass QB. You make it seem like there weren't planty saying Carr was garbage at that time and that isn't the case. We just happened to be right about it...........
You are forgetting the extra two picks.... I agree, I think Schuab will be ok and Mario looks good so far....
Interesting that you are willing to cut VY so much slack because it's only his 2nd year in the league. VY actually has more starts (25) than Schaub does (13). Yet Schaub isn't the one who is 29th in the league in QB rating.
Oh, so the game where Collins was under center counts in the one game difference but the game where VY was under center (the most recent one BTW) doesn't????
I'm lost. Who said it didn't count? The bottom line is that the Texans and Titans are separated by one game in the standings. Considering this thread is about Vince Young, it seems silly to evaluate Vince by a game in which he did not play. So, I'm taking that out of the equation.
I am also not saying Schuab sucks, or that he is garbage. I think when it is all said and done VY will be a better QB than him. Considering that Matt is also turnover prone (not as bad as VY but it's not like he is exactly protecting the ball) and can't stay healthy I would take VY over him this season as well. Could Schuab have started and performed as well as VY has in his 1st and 2nd year? We will never know but I don't think so, considering he is struggling and can't stay on the field now....
I am evaluating Vince by the fact that his team has been winning with him under center and that his performance for a 2nd year QB is solid. Most coaches wouldn't even rely on a 2nd yr QB to lead a team. I have seen too many games (especially in this injury plagued season) where a young QB has come in and been basically asked not to blow a game...trusted to do nothing. I know the VY lovers (mainly only in TX) have been proclaiming him as a GOD since he came out...but most don't expect young QB's to have any kind of impact this early. He was great last season and has been dissapointing this season. The main difference is the lack of big plays and the turnovers. He is still ahead of the curve for a 2nd yr QB.
is jabar gaffney succeeding relevant? does his performance excuse charley casserly? what about greg white's three-sack day... man, maybe we gave up on casserly too soon, huh? moving to a completely different team/staff/system renders success or failure as it relates to the texans irrelevant. like comparing apples and rocks. let me ask you something: what was the net loss of rolling the dice with carr? seriously, what did it actually cost them? understood; the problem was that it wasn't funny.
Was it a mistake, yes or no? Simple question.... To answer yours, it cost them two 2nd round picks. That is not cheap. Did the team take a cap hit for Carr (I don't know)? It also cost them the chance to draft 3 QB's that most expect to be better prospects than Schaub. I don't think anyone would give a #1 for Schuab.
Actually, Schaub threw 5 TD's and 4 INT's his first two years. VY has thrown 19 TD's and 29 INT's in his first two years so far. Granted, Schaub has a much smaller sample size, but VY has thrown 10 more INT's than TD's where Schaub has thrown about the same amount of each.
now, msn - we're talking about then. kubiak/the team had three choices: extend carr; start from scratch with a rookie QB; look for a QB on the open market, likely to cost you draft picks. or, four, i guess: hand the job to sage rosenfels. they didn't know carr was beyond saving/a never-was; they believed they could salvage him, and had ample reason to believe they could - kubiak has drafted williams, ryans, winston, daniels, okoye and bennett is the last two drafts, plus spencer and jones - dude's obviously got a knack for player evaluation. so if he saw something in carr, then this "he's always sucked" revisionist history takes a bit of a hit, no? if they could have stablized carr, that would have let them focus their attention elsewhere. [/QUOTE]Not every 2nd rounder is a Demeco Ryans. At any rate, it's irrelevant because the first half of your scenario will never exist in real life.[/QUOTE] the guy drafted exactly one pick after what would have been the texans' pick this year is the colts' starting LT. the second round is DOTTED with great, impactful players. after next april, we will have drafted exactly one since 2004.
Were any of those the face of the franchise? But not irrelevant as it relates to a Houston football fan. We also reminisce(sp?) here about Luv Ya Blue and Matthews/Munchak pretty often. They've moved on, too, you know. Yes, it was.
