If we can't get Lebron/Durant to sign here as FAs,who cares if Harden gets $15mil/yr?

Your popcorn is going to stay cold. James Harden was gifted to us, he played for Team USA and played in NBA Finals. If you asked Durant, who he really wants, I'd say he'd pick Harden over everything they got from the Rockets. Durant would rather play with Harden than Westbrook, who is known to clash with the best player for the Thunder. We are getting the #3 pick of the NBA Draft in 2009 and was a ball hawk when he was in high school and college. If you think Harden is known just as the Best 6th Man, you will be in for a surprise. We basically traded Harden for Lamb and draft picks because KMart is in a contract year, surely would not sign with the Rockets next year. A younger player with credentials over getting nobody this upcoming year, or years to come.

 

Let's assume the JJ comparison is valid (which I am not sure). Johnson did not attract any superstar. In fact, his contract made it hard for the team to get another star without sacrificing the supporting cast.

Also, I have said elsewhere. Martin is very underrated on this board because of last season. Harden is obviously better, but not "by miles" like some of you think. Martin is as good, probably better, a scorer than Harden. Harden is much better in play making. I am not convinced about Harden's defense yet. We'll see.

At this point, I see Harden as a poor man's young McGrady. (tinman, please don't come!) But then, what do I know? I once thought Wade was the poor man's Steve Francis.

 

And again they had no money to attract free agents because of the extensions they also gave to Josh Smith and Al Horford... which is the difference between the Rockets and the Hawks, they acquired top 10 picks for multiple years before giving JJ that horrendous contract and stuck with those guys they drafted.

We on the other hand have a chance to trade for someone else or spend some moolah on a big name guy while still giving max money to Harden if we choose to do so.

I know it's just my opinion but I'd put my money on Harden becoming 10x better than what JJ was in ATL and 100x better than what K-Mart ever was in his career.

 

I think you are forgetting that Kmart contract is worth 12.4 million/year. I believe Harden is getting 5.8 million playing for Rockets this year. His contract of 15 million per will not start until next year. Martin was not underrated for the money he was getting. You are just emotionally attached to KMart more than anything.

 

Even Lebron and Durant needs a Wade or a Westbrook.

 

Didnt they just have a lengthy CBA lockout so they could NOT adopt this attitude? lol

Its saying you have a built-in disadvantage from the start, so its gonna be a money churn of below A-Listers anyway. And the thread title implies that if you can't get a true A-List star Tom Hanks or Johnny Depp, big deal if you pay the same money over to Carrot Top if the movie still will be a draw. So "who cares" as long as you're coming out okay, not "your money".

There's just principles behind these things. "Worth" and valuations isnt something that you can assess fairly with consistency. But that approach is what got Juwan Howard a $100 million deal, even if it was well reasoned to do it at the time, your GMs are supposed to not buy into that approach

 

On a future note:
The new CBA incentivizes star players to become unrestricted free agents rather than sign extensions. Kevin Durant will be a completely unrestricted free agent in 2016, Westbrook and Ibaka in 2017. There's nothing OKC can do other than hope KD and co. will want to stay. If Morey signs Harden for a 5-year contract, Harden will still have 2 years left. Maybe, just maybe KD might want to play for Rockets in 2016!

 

In theory the CBA was supposed to create more even competition between teams.

It's a mixed bag.

The problem is, regardless of the salary cap, some cities are just MORE attractive to play in than others.

There's only ONE hollywood, ONE madison avenue, etc. And no matter what the salaries say, bigger cities = more fans = more press = more sponsorship dollars. Those are advantages the big cities will Always have.

The Salary cap addresses part of the equation, but I honestly don't think it's possible to fully fix the situation.

LA gets $250M in local TV revenue. OKC gets $28M. Without a salary cap OKC could NEVER compete. Even WITH the salary cap, LA doesn't even blink when it comes to going into taxes. And that's Before you factor in the Hollywood/fanbase factor.

For a team like Houston to compete, not only do they need to construct a team with good pieces, but they need to either bring in more $$$ so they can spend more, or increase the fanbase large enough that players don't see going to Houston vs LA, NY or Chicago as a financial penalty.

Asik, Lin and Harden all help in those regards.

Stealing Asik brought some Chicago fans, Lin brings international fans, and Harden brings NBA gearheads. Combine that with the possibility that all 3 combined represent a credible base roster for a playoff team (just add Superstar), the Youth (read potential) of the roster, and a roster full of potentially promising rookies, and you now have a credibly attractive FA destination that just *MIGHT* get you a superstar, or at least another solid tier 2 player like Harden.

And that's not even counting what happens if ANYONE on the roster develops into a Superstar... then all bets are off.

The problem here is that some fans want to assign an "objective" valuation on players to determine their salaries, while others of us are looking at it from a more holistic point of view.

Lin isn't a "star" in terms of production at this point, but he brings a huge fanbase and international exposure. And he does have the *potential* for star level output being only 23 years old.

People can argue that the probability is small or large, but people who say that Lin for Sure can't ever be a star producer are about as credible as people who say that Lin will be a star producer for Sure.

The same applies to Harden and Asik.

The history of the NBA is that 23 year old players improve. In fact, if I were a betting man, I would bet at least ONE of them (if not more) end up playing at a perennial all star level.

Given their playing levels last season, and their effectiveness from analyzing the advanced stats, I think one or more will end up surprising us to the upside.

Basketball players understand this as well. Guaranteed, alot of the younger stars are looking at Houston and thinking, "Hrm, I wonder how I would do if I was on that team?"

For alot of Non-Houston fans, Houston is now one of the most potentially exciting teams in the NBA.

Loaded with Young rookies, a credible starting 5 with Harden, Asik and Lin all having something to prove, and still loads of cap space to get another star.

The future is bright in Houston, and it's not just the Houston fans saying it.

 

I always find your post good. I would rep you again but I already did earlier.

 

Huh? Isn't this thread about Harden getting 15 million next year and the future? What does his current contract has anything to do with this discussion?

I was saying that Martin was underrated by this board. Nothing to do with his contract. Most people on this board appears to think that Martin is garbage. Some people claim that Harden is "miles better" than Martin. These are evidence of underrating Martin.

First time in my life described as being attached to Kevin Martin. Martin has never been one of my favorite players on the Rockets. And I knew he was a goner before last season ended.

 

4 stars
Lin
Harden
Parsons
TJones

 

Seriously, guys, Harden for $15.6 mil a year is a no-brainer.

I'd sign that any day of the week and twice on Wednesdays.

 

I don't think they're viewed any differently because they haven't won anything or been close to winning anything in a long time. Guys aren't saying trade me to houston cause they have lin and harden. The best thing the rockets can do is make great basketball moves,not publicity or off the court moves.

 

Well, other than primadonnas like Dwight, most players don't tell teams to trade them to any teams. Obviously, how the team looks and plays together on the court will be a factor, but the team having a wider national appeal will definitely be a factor with other players signing or re-upping here (if we get a potential free agent via trade).

 

Why does it seem like that most haters on Harden are those that joined CF around July 2012 and so forth...LOF's? lol

 

They aren't mutually exclusive.

And don't think that marketing/publicity makes no difference.

Alot of players have Ego's. They not only want to play well, but be SEEN playing well -- not just in their own arena's, but nationally.

Similarly, players watch their bank books. If a player has to decide between two similar situations, the one that sways their pocketbook the most nearly always wins.

Marketing/publicity isn't the end all be all, you STILL need to field a good product... however, team owners ignore them at their own peril.

 

Exactly. It's why New York and Los Angeles are preferred destinations over Milwaukee and Minnesota.

 

The problem here is you're assuming you'll be able to get a Lebron/Durant as a FA with no one significant on the team. Teams like LA or NY can pick and select who they're gonna get, because they're an extremely attractive destination. OTH, Houston has to make sure that the team itself is star-worthy. Let's say for example LBJ is a Free Agent, do you think there's gonna be a higher chance of signing him on the squad with or without Harden?

Joe Johnson is a good example, because as overpaid as he is, his trade to the Nets convinced Deron to stay there long term. If they cleared the entire squad and said to D-Will we will rebuild around you ground up, do you think he'll stay there or go to Dallas?

Players don't think based on available capspace, their priority is money 1st, then teammates 2nd. Whether or not JJ is overpaid doesn't matter, as long as he's good enough to make the squad viable.

Your issue of "not being to pay your 3rd star after you paid your 1st and 2nd" is putting the cart before the horse...to put it mildly. Why don't you worry first about getting the 1st and 2nd stars LMAO.

 

I know there are people like that here. But there are also people here who give him undue credit for 'almost' pulling off deals every year. Almost as much credit as if he had actually pulled them off.

Then there are those, like me, who are only willing to give him credit for the deal(s) he actually pulls off. Like this one.

Anyway, agree with the OP. I've been screaming for this team to start rebuilding for 3 years now. What better way to do that than trading away a few unproven young guys - including some we haven't even drafted yet - for a PROVEN young guy.

I would have a bigger problem with this trade if Harden wasn't 23 years old. Sure, me may not be a superstar right now but he's already better than most other 23 year old players in the league.

If you're going to gamble, gamble on a guy who hasn't already reached his prime.