If Kobe gets his ring this year, how is he not the GREATEST?

Who's better? At this point the best PF is either Gasol or Bosh, and it's very close, with my viewpoint being that Gasol gets it for now due to playoff success and being the best Laker. Whether he's an HoF is another thing, but he's definitely the best or second best PF in the league as well as a top 10 player.
And yes, Gasol is better, particularly given that Kobe has been inefficient throughout this season. It is because the Lakers have two skilled big men in Gasol and Bynum that they're dangerous, as has been shown by every flipping team out there figuring ways to beat it, from us hunting Bosh to the Cavs hunting Shaq to the Suns trying to get Lopez back as soon as possible. Kobe's frankly an afterthought compared to that problem.

 

The HOF is not limited to only the best players at their position. I think Gasol will make it.

Barely beat us? They dominated us when they wanted to. And lets not forget that this year's Laker squad has Artest who is better at creating his own shot than Ariza.

I think what we hate the most is how much he's overrated. The guy is one of the best to ever play the game, but he's not even close to surpassing Jordan as GOAT.

 

Jordan always had Pippen. Kobe always had Fisher.

Like I said earlier, you cant have it both ways. Either they both go through rebuilding stages or neither do.

 

Both Jordan and Kobe had one "rebuilding process" where a championship caliber team was built around them. For Jordan, it occurred at the beginning of his career. For Kobe, it occurred in the middle of his career after Shaq departed. Don't mistake Kobe's first championship experience as something similar to Jordan's. Kobe's career began on a team that had won 53 games the year before and had just traded for the most dominant post player on the planet. Shaq was the focal point. Kobe became part of a great 1-2 punch, but he was the "2" and Shaq was the "1".

 

Are you serious? Are you actually comparing Fisher to Pippen?

 

No we don't hate Kobe, we hate Kobe nuthuggers disguised as Rockets fans preaching Kobe's invincibility on a Rockets message board.

 

The title of being the "greatest" is not measured by how many rings you have. If that's the case, then Bill Russell should be the greatest player of all time.

This topic has been hammered to death and honestly speaking, even if Kobe wins 5 more rings, he still won't be known as the greatest. Why? Because of a guy named Jordan.

Why?

- Jordan changed the game completely. He invented the modern guard as we know it. Without him, we won't be seeing highlight reels of the Kobes, Carters, Wades, Lebrons, McGradys, Anthonys...etc

- Jordan elevated the sport of basketball from simply a game "played by blacks" in the US to a global phenomenon. His media presence and business savvy (Air Jordan) was the face of basketball during his reign

- He was a winner on every level: college, pro, international. Oh yea, and he lead a team that won 6 rings. And no, he was no second fiddle to Pippen. He was the MAN, he called the shots and he made the biggest shots

- Jordan is the only guard I can think of in NBA history who can alter the game at will. The only thing that is stopping Jordan from winning the game is Jordan himself. No player, coach, or injury can stop him. Sorry Lebron, that little elbow thing of yours is weak ****. Suck it up

- Rules were different back then, which made it even harder for him to shine that today's guards. 20 years ago, centers had it easy and guards were roughed up by all the hand checkings. Today, it's the opposite. Stern wanted to make things a fast paced game in order drive ratings up and thus $$$. Despite the stringent rules (remember the Jordan Rules?), he still did it like it was a child's game. That is no easy feat.

- The man had a phenomenal presence on the court. Everyone feared and respected him

 

I am being realistic. You set forth parameters and I provided a rebuttal using your paramters.

Pippen is obviously much better than Fisher, but Fisher was a stabilizing presence and a contributor to the Lakers' titles.

And much like Jordan never accomplished anything w/o Pippen, Kobe never accomplished anything w/o Fisher. And lets not forget that when Jordan did have the chance to do something w/o Pippen, it was either prior to or past his prime. Kobe had the chance to accomplish something w/o Fisher during his prime.

But all this talk about teammates leads back to Jordan's ability to win a title w/o needing a dominant big. Kobe has shown that he lacks this ability.

 

LMFAO

 

What's your point? In theory, McGrady can also do everything Jordan could from a pure basketball standpoint.

 

Which 5 big men would put ahead of Gasol, out of curiosity?

In 33 playoff games the last two years Gasol has averaged 18.8 ppg, 11.5 rpg, 2.8 apg, 1.9 bpg, only 2 tpg, and he's shot 57% from the floor. He's had double-doubles in 24 of the 33 games, and he's shot over 50% in 28 of the 33 games. Over these playoff games, he's led his team in playoff PER and win shares. Is he his team's best player? No, because in the most crucial moments Kobe is the one making the plays. But to say he's not consistent enough to even mention is pretty bizarre. He's a HUGE factor in their success.

 

Ring numbers will be about the same by the time Kobe's career is over and Jordans stats will be slightly better in almost every category. While Jordan had a great supporting cast, he has never, never had the same level of supporting cast as Kobe, or may I say Kobe was the supporting cast to 3 rings of Shaq. Kobe will make a top 10 player all time, but not number one. Unless he wins like 3 more rings in a row, leading it.

 

Imaginary scenarios? Is Fisher a figment of my imagination?

Everyone who wants to win. There's a reason promising bigs are taken early in the draft. A solid big man makes the game much easier for everyone else.

Interchangeable? How many players in the league have Fisher's leadership and ability to hit clutch shots? He's nowhere near Pippen's caliber, but he's nowhere near "interchangeable" either.

Yes, it's a tired excuse, but its also perfectly valid and proves you wrong. I can see why you're upset with it.

 

In comparing the amount of rings for who is the better player ever i think rings won without being the finals MVP do not count. So in that case Kobe has 1 and Jordan has 6. Like said before otherwise Horry, fisher, Pippen would also be in this debate.

If a player isn't even the best player on his team during a championship, how can he be the best ever??