I understand people here want Bosh, but at what price?

I just dont understand why TOR would want to take our garbage and expiring contracts and pick(s). Why would they commit 10m+ salary just for a pick or 2?

They will ask AB, even Martin in return and are very likely end up with AB.

 

Then I do not want Bosh, he is not worth that much and Toronto doesn't have that much leverage.

DD

 

Obviously Morey likes Bosh very much. If Bosh agrees a SNT, TOR gains some control over the ROX.

 

I guess a bit, but then not really because the Rox are in a good situation without him and Toronto can not just let him walk...

And you would have to consider what Toronto is doing, and their roster...who are they building around etc?

We have a lot of picks etc, and perhaps they want to build around their own style of players and pick their own team.

If Bosh leaves they are into complete rebuild....

DD

 

I'm kinda hoping theres a situation where we can offer cash to Toronto to buy out Battier so he can come back to here on like vet minimum or something (Because he'd have the money from the buyout). Have him in there just so we can match salaries. Because I don't think the deal you posted would work.

But, Toronto may would want to keep Battier. But if not, I think that would make us even more of a contender. Brooks/Lowry at point, Martin/Buddinger/Taylor at SG, Ariza/Battier at SF, Bosh/Patterson at PF, Yao/MLE signee/Hayes at C. That is an incredibly deep team.

 

There is almost no chance he just walks in a straight up signing, and even if he does decide to do that he can't do that with the Rockets.

 

Yeah I know....but you know what, we are all just wasting time, because unless Bosh says he wants to come to Houston, it is just not going to happen.

DD

 

Agreed on all points. We are wasting time. I wish I had a case to work on today.

 

If Bosh decides he wants to sign with the Rockets, knowing Morey, he will involve a third team. Maybe something like the following:

Houston Out:
Jeffries
Battier
D.Anderson or younger assets
2012 Knicks Pick

Houston In:
Bosh

Toronto Out:
Bosh

Toronto In:
Al Jefferson
2012 Knicks Pick
Minny 2nd rounder

Minny out:
Al Jefferson
Future 2nd Rounder

Minny In:
D. Anderson
Battier
Jefferies

Houston gets Bosh.
Minny gets rid of Al Jefferson and cap relief
Toronto rebuilds with a tough center and picks

 

Makes a lot of sense.

DD

 

I'm reading all the chatter about giving up Scola, (and now that Bosh signing in Houston is not a wish but now looks possible) and Bosh would be a upgrade no doubt. I'm not on board up giving up Scola or Brooks. These guys will carry the Rockets for years and haven') reached their peaks. As much as we call Morey a great GM, this is a chance for him to show us how good he is. I don't think he wants to have to trade Scola either, or Brooks. Wishful thinking but maybe he can pull a few tricks and get it done.

A core group of Yao, Bosh, and Scola would be deadly. Add Brooks running up and down the court, wow!

I'd hate to see Martin, Lowery, Chase, Ariza, Battier, Patterson, Hill, Hayes, or any of those picks or players, but any of them would be what I'd be trying to get Toronto to bit on. I'm no GM, but I'd dangle Martin, Lowery, Battier, or Hill or PP., picks and some cash.

All they have to do is convince Bosh that Houston is the best option, and give Toronto a better deal than everyone else. If Morey gives a great sell to Bosh, Bosh can twist Toronto's arm and make it happen.

We've seen Morey do some crazy things.
In Morey We Trust.

 

I have seen enough games. AB isn't going to grow and taller and he can't be much heavier without losing his speed, so his defense will always be a problem. And his court vision will not be up to elite level either due to various reasons.

Martin has been one of the worst defensive SG in NBA for quite some years, if not the worst. I don't see that can change a lot with/without Yao.

Yao is not the one for all solution on defense. He has his limitation too, namely pick'n roll defense. Neither Martin and AB has the body strength and size to fight through the screens, so the problem will become bigger.

Without Yao, opponents can attack the rim, with Yao, opponents can pick'n roll Rockets to death with the combination of Yao/Martin/AB.

Rockets will be contedning a top 4 seed in WC, not contending Championship with current lineup.

 

Bosh is leaving no matter what so TOR is already in rebuilding mode. It's reported that they are moving JC too. Look at their roster, there is no one capable of being the new core. They only way to get a star this year is through that snt. If they cannot land a young star, they may refuse any deal which would only make a bad team worse.

 

Toronto does have a decent amount of leverage specifically against the Rockets. If they don't agree to the deal, the Rockets will not get Bosh, even if Bosh does pick Houston. Sure they may lose him for nothing to a different team with cap space, or they may do a sign and trade with someone else, but the Rocket's wouldn't get Bosh in either situation and the entire benefit of a sign and trade for Toronto is getting something back they really want. The Raptors certainly will not do the trade just to get expiring contracts back, because if that is all they wanted they could let Bosh walk and his entire contract would be off the books right away without having to pay players they don't want for a year.

As for Bosh being a superstar or not, I tend to agree that he isn't, at least not on the Kobe, Lebron, Dwade level. But he could very much be like KG who had plenty of playoff problems prior to moving to the celtics, with only 1 trip past the first round the year Cassel and Sprewell joined him on the twolves.

There are limits on what I would give up to get Bosh of course, but I trust that if Morey thinks the deal is good, he will have a plan to fill in any holes that potential departures create.

 

Bosh is better than Brooks, Martin, or Budinger. None of them being included will stop a deal from happening. Now, if Toronto asks for ALL of them in a deal, then that's a different story.

But including one of them plus picks plus another throw-in (Hill or Battier?), and it gets done.

 

Tony Parker says hello...

Yeah, having a 7'6" guy blocking the rim doesn't make any difference, did you see the defensive stats last year without Yao?

Defense is better with him than without him.

Yeah, that is just wrong, Yao can sag in the paint and not bother guarding the outside shot....zone defenses are now legal.

I disagree, and since it is just opinions......oh well.

DD

 

I want production not a name too many times people get caught in this hype or the sexy pick shall I say sometimes the so called "poor man" version is almost has close too if not the same production without all the hype.

Theres a few guys out there with that profile Carlos Boozer. The closet thing this league has to Karl Malone. I know I'm an Alaska Boy, but seeing how Boozer has been are kryptonite for years.
And I know many are rolling there eyes because he generates so much hate on this forum. But there's a reason he generates so much hate. When he's killing us I'm hating him too. Plus he's a good character guy. Maybe we should look at him.
Look at the Stats.
Career Season Averages

Year Team G GS MPG FG% 3P% FT% OFF DEF RPG APG SPG BPG TO PF PPG
02-03 CLE 81 54 25.3 0.536 0.000 0.771 2.5 5.0 7.5 1.3 0.7 0.6 1.27 2.77 10.0
03-04 CLE 75 75 34.6 0.523 0.167 0.768 3.1 8.4 11.4 2.0 1.0 0.7 1.79 2.65 15.5
04-05 UTA 51 51 34.8 0.521 0.000 0.698 2.8 6.2 9.0 2.8 0.8 0.5 2.69 3.51 17.8
05-06 UTA 33 19 31.1 0.549 0.000 0.723 2.2 6.4 8.6 2.7 0.9 0.2 2.09 3.18 16.3
06-07 UTA 74 74 34.6 0.561 0.000 0.685 3.2 8.5 11.7 3.0 1.0 0.3 2.62 2.93 20.9
07-08 UTA 81 81 34.9 0.547 0.000 0.738 2.4 8.0 10.4 2.9 1.2 0.5 2.59 3.62 21.1
08-09 UTA 37 37 32.4 0.490 0.000 0.698 3.0 7.4 10.4 2.1 1.0 0.2 2.14 3.57 16.2
09-10 UTA 78 78 34.3 0.562 0.000 0.742 2.3 8.9 11.2 3.2 1.1 0.5 2.72 3.46 19.5
Career -- 510 469 32.7 0.541 0.111 0.728 2.7 7.5 10.2 2.5 1.0 0.5 2.23 3.17 17.2
All-Star -- 1 0 18.0 0.467 0.000 0.000 4.0 6.0 10.0 0.0 0.0 0.0 1.00 0.00 14.0

Not only that this guys has major playoff experience. And unlike many others Carlos takes his game to whole other level. Let the Stats speak.
Career Playoff Averages

Year Team G GS MPG FG% 3P% FT% OFF DEF RPG APG SPG BPG TO PF PPG
06-07 UTA 17 17 38.5 0.536 0.000 0.738 3.2 9.0 12.2 2.9 1.0 0.3 3.00 3.06 23.5
07-08 UTA 12 12 36.8 0.415 0.000 0.714 3.5 8.8 12.3 2.8 0.5 0.2 3.00 3.92 16.0
08-09 UTA 5 5 37.2 0.528 0.000 0.771 2.4 10.8 13.2 2.2 1.6 0.4 3.00 3.60 20.6
09-10 UTA 10 10 40.2 0.530 0.000 0.543 3.3 9.9 13.2 3.0 0.4 0.7 2.40 3.80 19.7
Career -- 44 44 38.2 0.503 0.000 0.707 3.2 9.3 12.5 2.8 0.8 0.4 2.86 3.52 20.3

 

Look at all those seasons of missed games...33 played, 37 played...man...that is a lot of missed games.......he is too much of an injury risk.....to pair with Yao.

DD

 

Tony Parker says: "I'm taller, I have better court vision, I don't need 3 point shooting to win Championships."


No doubt Yao makes a difference, I've said Yao has a big defensive impact when people was still calling him bad defender. But Yao can't cure every defensive flaw Rockets have, namely AB/Martin combo.

Yao played best defense the in 2008-2009. But even in that year, RA took him off thy court on the last defensive possesions frequently because opponents basiclly play nothing but pick n' roll against Yao in those situations. Now you have AB/Martin to guard pick n' roll?

Oh, pack the middle and let oppoents shoot open jumpers at the end of the game, is that how championshp is won? Haven't you seen this years playoffs?