Of course racism is a cause of mindless violence. You know that's not what I'm implying. However, it's not the ONLY cause of mindless violence. You are going to get **** on for many reasons in your life. From the amount of money you have to the way you dress. What do you about it? You don't let it affect you negatively. That's my point.
This is b/c the average person in America already has well-ingrained stereotypes and prejudices against certain groups - that's why they find it funny. That's how Norman Lear and Silverman are able to get paid. Frankly, the likelihood of them telling jokes that appeal to people with certain prejudices to make a buck is far more likely than this contention that they are simply trying to rehabilitate racists with some form of psuedopsycho reverse therapy
Actually, it's funny because the speaker altered statement A. in order to fix a conflict, but her fix actually doesn't fix anything. It is funny because it is absurd and incongruous. Given that you don't really seem to find it funny, I'm not sure you should be explaining where the humor of the joke lies. If you don't get the urge to tweak conventions in order to lampoon them and break them down, I can't say much more. Obviously it's not a rational well thought out process. A comedian who analyses their humor probably isn't too funny. I guess it's either something you get or don't get, but I take it you didn't actually listen to the interview that I posted. The world can be a great big Rorschach Test.
Respectfully, how does my bring up a solitary case which violates your theorem translate to claiming that the "only cause of mindless violence" is racism?
Part of the reason it's funny (to you) is because it is absurd and incongruous. The other component is the perception of stereotype that is already familiar to or accepted by you. Otherwise instead of talking about "ch!nks" she could just do a skit using racial slurs that are used in New Guinea for the minority Ewak Ewgok tribe. No, she clowns the Chinese because mocking and stereotyping them is already commonplace and widely accepted around the country. And the same goes for blacks - I just went into a country club this past Friday where I probably heard the word "ni**er" derogatorily used about the staff working there about 6-7 times. But that was a private club and on the public airwaves the networks know "where to draw the line." Hence, Chinese are more fair game for Silverman to do her skits on.
I'm sure Vincent Chin tried not to let racism affect him negatively. http://www.asianweek.com/061397/feature.html
It doesn't. My statement, admittedly, is a bit personalized. I wanted to point out that even without a lick of racism (which would mean that ignorance would be eliminated, which in turn means the end of the human race as we know it), that people will still be murdered for difference in opinion, difference in beliefs, other forms of misguided hatred, etc.
If I had a dollar for every time someone brings up that damn case when discussing racial issues directed at Asians. First of all, yea, it started off as some ignorant assholes screaming WORDS at this guy which were unfounded. He should've left it that. Ignored them, went on with his night. It could have easily been a fight started over a girl, some money, ANYTHING.
I doubt Sarah Silverman or most Americans know anything about the minority tribes are on New Guinea so rather than being funny for her to use that it would be mystifying. From seeing Sarah Silverman's humor there is nothing that I've seen about her that would say that she has anything against Chinese and is mocking them in particular. Anyway the joke wasn't targetted at Chinese to begin with. It was targetted at the idea that someone would be such a dumb@ss racists that they would say something like that at a jury interview and then at the the more incongrous idea that you could still use a term like that except change it to "love" and not "hate" and get away with it in this society. Its called satire and part of the role of satire is to challenge stereotypes and I see her use the term "Chink" is to riff on the how loaded the word is. Like how Camilia Paglia would use the term "C*nt". She's not ignorant that its offensive or using it in a way to degrade she's using it in a way to riff on the social taboo of the term.
Yes it could have but it didn't. Yes people get beat up and killed for all sorts of reasons that doesn't mean people don't because of racism and prejudice. Racism exist. Ignoring it isn't going to make it go away.
I doubt racism will ever go away. All of these advocate groups think that racism will go away with all of their media watch dog groups, rallies, etc.. It's not going away, are you going to test everyone for racism and then brain wash them? You can hope that as the older generations pass away, and people are more educated that racism decreases, and as time goes on, it becomes a minor nuisance, but that's all. So no, ignoring racism will not abolish it. At the same time, ignoring racial slurs could save you a lot of wasted time in your life.
if it's such harmless satire then why is network tv censoring her from applying it to blacks? on the contrary, you would think the networks would like to showcase "ni**er ni**er ni**er" in her theraputic context as much as possible in order to cure some of the country's prejudice ills
What sterotype is that? She is not making any judgement about Chinese or Asians in the joke. There is no assignment of any characteristic to the group, just the use of an epithet.
I guess that could work for some people, but that wasn't what you said in the beginning. Chappelle Show Mind of Carlos Mencia Some of the most racist shows ever.
She doesn't need to qualify the epithet - the whole country, audience included, already has myriad judgements and stereotypes about asians floating around in their minds. That's is exactly what she's playing off of. Hearing said epithet on tv only triggers such thoughts and in some apparently, brings out chuckles. It can't possibly be argued that the audience gets positive vibes and thoughts about asians when they hear the word "ch!nk." Invisible Fan, I haven't seen those shows, but do not believe they air on network tv anyways. Not that this makes them any less offensive, just pointing this out b/c apparently the networks feel it is okay to offend some groups with epithets but not others.
Regardless of Vincent's wrong in the case, you can't tell me it wasn't total B.S. for the men to go free, the orginal fight ended, a retaliation (with pre - meditation) occured (required tracking down) and they got 3 year probation and a fine? It's not the act of murder that I find a problem with, it was the total break down in justice system. You meant to tell me we live in a country where if I insulted some one in a bar, got in a fight, track the guy down and kill him all I should expect is a 3 years probation and fine?
I agreee that racism will probably never go away but at the sametime its wrong to ignore it because there is a lot of racism out there that comes from sheer ignorance. For instance the Steve Kerr "Chinaman" comment. I fully believed Steve Kerr isn't a racists and he used a racist slur out of ignorance and once aware of that he apologized. The other reason why its necessary to challenge racial slurs is that to not too it breeds impunity on the part of racists. A skinhead going around flinging racial slurs at people might feel free to escalate if he sees there is no consequence to that action. Finally free speech only works when we exercise that right. While we could choose to remain silent at the sametime if we are offended we have the right to disagree. Without even expressing that offense was taken there will never be any resolution, education, or reconciliation.
Personally I think the network erred in a few respects here but that's their fault and not Sarah Silverman's. Even if Sarah Silverman had intended for that joke to be that way the whole time I still wouldn't take offense to it. To follow up on my response to Coma I will say that this is a complex issue and as much as I don't think we should ignore or excuse racism I don't think this is racist and will even go a step farther and say I don't think we should be censoring racial slurs. I agree with Coma that racism will probably always exist but trying to totally hide it isn't a solution. I would rather have it out in the open where we can address it than just having people keep it away where they can act on it covertly than deal with openly. To the extent that comedians like Sarah Silverman, Dave Chappelle and others address I think in many ways helps us address it.
Wouldn't the people who hold those negative stereotypes feel the same thing if Silverman had replaced chinks with Asian-Americans in her joke? Do racists only feel negatively toward other groups when those groups are called names? Your indictment of her is based on the preconceptions that OTHER PEOPLE have in their minds. When I read/heard the joke, I thought it was a clever shot at racism, based on an unexpected twist at the end of the "story". So if she told the joke to me privately, it would not have any perception of stereotype? That seems like an unbearable burden you are placing on comics, for them not to say anything in their act that causes other people to bring to mind some preconceived notion they may or may not have about yet other people.
