A couple of things. First, just because Doc Rocket relayed something that was said on a plane doesn't mean that he was on the plane, although I don't know what difference it makes as he's regarded pretty highly. Second, just because Hakeem thinks the Rockets should trade him in order to get something in return doesn't mean that it's in the best interest of the Rockets. There is a reason why there are a lot of teams that would like that cap space, and the Rockets are among the teams that need it. Let's not forget that we need to re-sign Taylor and Anderson. With that in mind, there is no guarantee that Taylor will re-sign, which would leave the Rockets in a tough spot trying to fill that void. I'm not sure Webber is improving his chances much by jumping from Sacramento to Houston, at least short term. So, if a trade is made, it would have to be for a PF in my opinion, since Taylor will be gone. That being said, why not include Taylor in the deal since he would no longer be in the Rockets plan. Obviously, we'd have to wait until Taylor could be traded. I don't really hold much stock in getting Garnett or Webber, but wouldn't including Taylor in such scenarios be beneficial to both Sacramento and Minnesota. Everyone needs cap space, and both would need to replace there PFs with someone, and Taylor should re-sign for much less than Webber or Garnett which would allow for the signing of other free agents. So when could Taylor be traded? At least publicly, there has been no promises made by Taylor or the Rockets other than "let's see how this season goes." Also, it would give Dream a chance to prove himself on the court while we wait for Taylor to become trade-eligible. There you go, my 2 cents. BTW-Don't forget to set your VCRs. You never know when Hakeem's last game as a Rocket will be! Of course, the same is true if he's not traded - remember Barkley. ------------------ "Not just a layup, but a mundane layup." -- Calvin Murphy, not realizing that a mundane layup IS just a layup. [This message has been edited by Tb-Cain (edited October 28, 2000).]
Even if Olajuwon fits right now more than Fizer does, there is still no point in getting him. Cap space? Chicago has it. They will not want to gain a paltry 2+ million for Fizer, as he is worth more than a rookie contract. As for Miller, it would not make sense to trade him away "to clear up cap space." They just signed him this offseason. Both these players are young and promising. As a Bulls fan, I would rather keep them for the future. As far as Dream's value as a player to the Bulls...who cares? They will not make the playoffs with him, especially if you subtract Miller (their current center). I don't see it happening. Is it really worth it to trade two promising young players to climb one or two spots in the standing, while still not making the playoffs? The Bulls have trouble enough getting good players going to the Bulls, and now they're trading them away? Suicice, I'd say. In the Bulls' perspective, there is no logic behind getting Olajuwon. About their trade value. Fizer is young, promising, and plays with a small contract. Hakeem is old, is always injured, and had career lows last season. He makes more than $16 million. What does this tell you? Hakeem is valuable to teams for cap space or if they really believe he could give them something for a title run. The Bulls don't meet any of these conditions. ------------------ Nederland 2002 Garnett a Rocket? Read our latest column at ClutchTown.com
Wow, I hadn't gotten over to this forum in a while and then when I do there's this. A)Unless we're getting a legit superstar in return ala Webber or Garnett management should definately wait until after the arena referrendum has passed before even considering moving Dream;to the average Basketball fan Dream is Bball in Houston and has been for the past 20 yrs if you go back to UH,and moving him for cap space well let's just say Im' not too sure how that would go over here in Houston.And as much as I'd love to have youngstas like Stromile Swift,Lamar Odom,Darius Miles I'm not sure that names like these would be enough to curb public outcry. B)Simple,I'll believe it when I see it. ------------------ I'm not the type to eat it up but the type to hit it raw dog and seed it up.
Agreed, Ace. I wasn´t aware that Houston is only 6´6. Well, that limits our options a lot. Dickerson is also only 6´5. KG is dreamcasting at best. I don´t really see how we could get anything of value to us at the 3,4 or 5 for Dream. Unless we traded him for a lot of picks and a first rounder. Say, Swift, Fizer or something like that. Maybe Orlando? Outlaw and Amaechi? The numbers don´t add up. Mutumbo? Nearly perfect, but not a good deal for the hawks. I don´t know. Only a three-way deal... ------------------ "I have posted so much that what I say must be true"
1. Someone explain to me why in the world Vancouver or Minnesota would trade Sharif or KG to the Rockets for capspace? Look guys, you don't trade one of the Top-10 (Top-3 in Garnett's case) players in the game for capspace. If the Rockets trade Hakeem, the best case scenario would have the deal include some young, promising players, spare parts, and a mixture of mid-range draft picks. Not a bad deal, depending on who the young players are, but you have got to be smoking if you think Garnett or SAR is coming here. 2. If Hakeem signs with another team this summer, let me say that I will be pissed. The whole reason we didn't land the jackpot of #5+#12 was to ensure that Hakeem ended his career as a Rocket. We screwed ourselves out of a huge chance at improving by showing him loyalty, so the least Hakeem can do is end his career in Houston. He wants to be traded? Well this attitude could have been useful a couple summers back when we could have actually gotten something for him. [This message has been edited by thacabbage (edited October 28, 2000).]
We need a small forward, Suns need a center. Marion come to anyones mind yet? Of course he only gets paid like 1.6 mill. Not that I would trade Hakeem. ------------------ Fun Police Says: 1. Stupid threads & Stupid BBS names are not FUN! 2. Conduct yourself in a FUN way! The Fun Police are Watching. Vote for the Rockets & Have FUN!
Riiiiight, a ball-hogging shooting guard is what this team really needs. If we're going to do this, it should be for a big time 3 or 4 because, like some have already pointed out, it pretty much rules out Taylor coming back unless the trade is for another free agent. ------------------ When you make an assumption, you make an ass out of yourself and umption. visit www.swirve.com
Here's something I just thought of.. houston trades: Hakeem Olajuwon $16,000,000 to milwaukee TOTAL: $16,000,000 milwaukee trades: Glenn Robinson $8,120,000 to houston milwaukee trades: Scott Williams $4,200,000 to houston milwaukee trades: Ervin Johnson $2,700,000 to houston milwaukee trades: Mark Pope $498,500 to houston milwaukee trades: Rafer Alston $423,500 to houston milwaukee trades: Jason Hart $316,969 to houston milwaukee trades: Michael Redd $316,969 to houston TOTAL: $16,575,938 TRADE ACCEPTED Due to houston and milwaukee being over the cap, the 15% trade rule is invoked. houston and milwaukee had to be within 15% plus $100,000 of the salary given out for the trade to be accepted, which did happen here. This trade satisfies the provisions of the Collective Bargaining Agreement. Only problems are: milwaukee's Michael Redd cannot be traded because he is currently not tradeable. Redd is not tradeable because he was recently signed to a contract. He cannot be traded until the 15th December, 2000 milwaukee's Jason Hart cannot be traded because he is currently not tradeable. Hart is not tradeable because he was recently signed to a contract. He cannot be traded until the 15th December, 2000 milwaukee's Mark Pope cannot be traded because he is currently not tradeable. Pope is not tradeable because he was recently signed to a contract. He cannot be traded until the 27th December, 2000 Since the cap is gonna go up next year, Houston would have 6 million in capspace to sign Mo....I hope that's enugh....We'll have a back-up Center since hakeem's gone...and an all start small forward....don't gimme any bull about Big Dog, in the end, he's an allstar, and a heck of a player...Milwaukee obviously wants to start Ray Allen, so they'll have Big dog gone.....They'll have better Center than Przybilla or Ervin Johnson in Hakeem, they can become instant contenders for the east, a lock for the top 3 at least......The Cap space is a bonus for them...... The way I see it, everyone wins, it even works for Hakeem if he wants to play longer than next year, I think he'll do great in the East......Bucks get better where they need it, get what they want, Collier gets to learn from Dream, capspace as a bonus (16 million!!).....We get anough money to re-sign mo, shandon the next year...pickup a back up C, so if we get an excellent one in the draft next year, Cato is expendable if he dissapoints again.... Our line up: C - Cato/Ervin/Collier PF - Mo/Los (will be gone next year)/KT SF - Big Dog/Walt/Langhi SG - Anderson/Mobley PG - Francis/Moochie the others will be free agents in a year and will only serve on the IR, or get cut....AND I ALMOST FORGOT....This makes Walt expendable, and I think we can get one year contracts and a HIGH pick for him, then we're completely re-loaded... btw, Here's Milwaukees line-up: C - Olajuwan/Przybilla PF - Caffey/Ham SF - Thomas/Owens SG - Allen/Hunter PG - Cassell/Hunter Only problem they'll have is depth in the backcourt, and that can be solved by signing a 1 or 2 guard......or we can just let them keep REDD.... ANYWAYS, lemme know what u guys think, AND I'm ALL AGAINST trading Hakeem....I just thought this might be interesting.... ------------------
ok, here are the spelling mistakes: a better center Przybilla will learn from Hakeem I made mistakes writing the mistakes, LOL ------------------
Do you hate Hakkeem that much to send him back next to Scottie? ------------------ How Sweet it is! [This message has been edited by CompaqC (edited October 29, 2000).]
TWolves do NOT want to part with KG & the league will lineup if the TWolves even hint at a trade involving KG. After CWebb & Mutombo, next years FA market is not highly regarded. Capspace doesn't mean much since KG is locked in until 2004. If the Rockets truly want Garnett, they need to involve the Clippers who have too many contracts AND even though they are LOADED with talent, they are in the West and have a high learning curve for their young talent. Thus the TWolves get draft picks AND capspace. Here's how: Minn: KG to Rocks, Wm. Avery to Clips Rocks to Minn: Dream, KT, Moochie Rocks to Clips: 1st round picks in 2001 & 2002 & 2nd rounder 2003 Clippers to Minn: Maggette, Nesby and 1st round picks for 2001, 2002, & 2nd round 2003 Clips lineup: Dooling / Avery Q / Miles / Piatkowski Odom / Miles Skinner / Strong / Odom Kandi / Rooks / Closs The Clips have fewer contracts, more PT to go around, and Rocks picks which probably won't be as high but will provide good influx of talent. TWolves lineup: Brandon / Norris Maggette / Billups / Peeler / Jacobson Szczerbiak / Nesby KT / Patterson / Hammonds Dream / Nesterovic / Garret Wolves get capspace AND Clips picks and are no worse off as this team is as much a contender for the 7 or 8 PO spot as their current team. Plus a healthy Dream may sign for less money for two following seasons. Rockets lineup: Steve / Cat / (Boseman/CBA) SA / Cat KG / Walt / Bull / Langhi Mo / Bull / 'Los Cato / Collier / 'Los There is a lot of flexibility in this roster. I really don't think Dream is going anywhere. If the TWolves do trade Garnett, it would be silly to get picks from the team Garnett is going to play for as that team will surely be PO contenders. The TWolves main question is can KG carry them for 5 years because his huge contracts prohibits them in the FA market and his incredible ability and drive means they won't be getting high draft picks. Glad it's their decision and not mine! ---------------- GATER [This message has been edited by GATER (edited October 29, 2000).]
No disrespect intended but I would have to have the whole context of the conversation in which Dream said that. Maybe he was talking about the past with Toronto that business wise it would have been in the Rockets' best interests (but I think the fans would have rioted) even if it's not what Dream really wanted. I'm just saying it doesn't mean he was talking about right now, this season. Frankly, right now I don't think it is in the Rockets best interest to try and get something for him. If Dream truly believes that right now, it does not mesh with what he has said publicly so far. ------------------
Ace, Maybe I am not making my arguments clear, this Chicago trade is not about clearing cap space. This trade is about improving their team and to maintain fan base (he might even increase it). As I have stated before they over paid Mercer and are willing to over paid Smith just to keep their fans interested. Judging from their past & current personal moves they will be interested in Olajuwon that could keep their fan base and improve theirs team at the same time. You as a fan might not care about Dream's value as a player to the Bulls but the Bulls do, their action of over paying Mercer and courting Smith with 6.5 millions proved their intend. As for Miller, I doubt he would stay as a Bulls because I recall he turned down their first offer and only signed on with them when they included a clause that let him go to any team he chose after December. They signed Miller to show their fans they could get players to play in Chicago, any players even when they know there is a good chance he will leave after December. The problem these two young and promising players are 1) They have no playing time for Fizer at power forward. If you play him out of position, he will be less effective thus his trade value will decline. 2) They have a slim chance in keeping Miller. In an idea situation they would keep these player if they can play their rookie with meaningful minutes and keep their center, but in their current state they are not likely to do either. About trading value: Hakeem is old and has been injured the past two seasons. But if an older Ewing came back from a more severe injury so can Olajuwon. His career lows are 10.0 points, 6.2 rebounds and 1.59 blocks per game. That tells me a healthy Olajuwon is worth a promising young power forward name Fizer. You appear to base Olajuwon's main trade value in this case with caps pace where as I base his trade value with his skill and fan appeal. You are correct when you say that the Bulls do not fit your definition of needing cap space or are in a title run. But that is not the reason why I think the Bulls want him. I believe the Bulls would want Olajuwon for the same reason they wanted Mercer and Smith. The Bulls wanted high profile players to keep their fans interested. Olajuwon could do that plus he could actually improve the team at the same time.
I'd rather send Hakeem to a true contender than to a lottery team like the Grizzlies. Would be sorta ironic that they sent us Clyde to help us win a title, we'd be paying them back.
<Another thing: Sacramento wants cap space in order to keep Webber. Duh.> How can you say some things other people say are ridiculous and then make this comment? Webber has bird rights, caproom means nothing. ------------------ [This message has been edited by NewGuy (edited October 29, 2000).]
I'm surprised no one's thought about the Pacers. They have the talent (Bender, Harrington) and the need (center is the toothpick Jermaine O'Neal, who prefers PF) to do this. They no longer have any big contracts to make it work. What about New Jersey (KVH, K-Mart, in cap hell) or Phoenix (Marion, TskTsk, Rogers, Robinson). Hakeem likely hasn't gone public to: A-help the Rockets position, and not force them into "must trade", and B-Not force torture on the arena deal. ------------------ The Serious Police are watching. Follow the rules or be assimilated. Shandon is underrated.
LilFrancis, we don't need a 6'5'' ballhogging "SF". ------------------ When you make an assumption, you make an ass out of yourself and umption. visit www.swirve.com
