my biggest concern is that he can not even play defense in playoffs. I don't think I can remember any of his moments vs Utah. Battier is a bench player who should never play more than 24 minutes.
that's what i'm trying to say. he's a defensive specialist so only play him if a scorer is goin' off for 30+. if we play a team like utah or new orleans, he shouldn't play much at all. but if we play the lakers or blazers who have a good wing scorer, then play him. that's all i'm saying.
how about watching the damn series? for people who claim don't read the stats, watch them. if you saw the series, tell me who had more impact? ak47 or shane the past 2 playoffs.
Because we have more depth at the 4 spot then at the swingman position. Also, Shane actually shoots the 3 well and is a solid FT shooter. Chuck can't shoot jumpers OR free throws. shane can guard all shooting guards and small forwards, whether they are short or tall for their position. chuck can guard ALMOST all forwards and centers, he does run into trouble eventually when they are too tall.
...and who do we give his minutes to? Wafer, Barry? What would you do after Utah runs 4 consecutive PnR on Wafer and he gets burned on 3 of them? Do you leave in Wafer? Maybe Wafer is up to the task. But you also know he will make several mistakes the directly result in points for Utah. The question is at what point is Wafer's strengths outweigh his weaknesses. Battier is essentially neutral or neutral +. Wafer has GREAT moments but he also makes big mistakes. So what's better? The stable guy that nets neutral or the erratic guy that nets neutral but with bigger high/low swings. With Battier, at least you know what you get.
Can chuck hayes run like Battier and guard the best players from opposing teams? can chuck hayes guard Kobe, Lebron ? I will have no problems to see chuck hayes getting more minutes if he does not blown lay-ups and can shoot free throws. chuck hayes is a good situational defensive specialist when there's bad match up for Yao. By the way, Les Alexander pays much less than $7 mil to Battier because of what he gets from the China shoe sponser in which Battier has a shoe endorsement deal from Peak.
As I said before, if Morey, Adelman, JVG, CD, etc. see a reason to keep this unskilled, non-stat-producing, non-NBA-quality player in the starting rotation, who are WE to argue? Those guys know more about basketball than everyone on this forum combined.
that's why you play all 3. all 3 have their strengths and weaknesses. if we need defense, put in shane real quick. if we need offense, put in wafer and barry. i didn't say bench the guy. all i'm saying shane is not equipped to play 35-40 minutes every damn game. that's all i'm saying. PS - shane doesn't guard deron so i doubt he'll help much in the pick and roll.
chuck can guard kevin garnett. lamarcus aldridge. and some of the elite PFs. can shane do that? they both can guard their position pretty well. sure it's fine for shane to miss wide open 3s all game though right?
i'm sure if adelman found his own doug christie, battier will be benched immediately. trust me on that. i mean chuck hayes played a lot before scola got here. he's now playing occassionally. battier would get the same fate if we get some more depth there (or if tracy was healthy all year). b/c shane is a veteran, he's getting the benefit of the doubt. it helps that he's a "nice citizen" who's great at taking orders. wafer is still too inexperienced and i'm sure by next year wafer will get much more minutes than this from battier as he gets smarter and knows more about the game. barry is just too old to play big minutes. that's why i want the minutes to be more spread out rather than shane getting 35-40 minutes right now.
When i wrote I looked up shane's stats, you should have known better than to make comments without being sure of the facts because I have no problem looking them up to prove you wrong: 08 playoffs -Pts, rebs, asst Game 1 AK 21, 4, 3 Shane 22, 3, 1 Matt 6,3,2 Game 2 AK 3,8,4 (1 of 8 FG) shane 8,5,0 Matt 4,2,0 Game 3 AK 5,2,2 Shane 12,2,2 Matt 10,4,0 Game4 AK 11,5,1 shane 10,3,0 Matt 2,1,2 Game 5 AK 5,2,1 Shane 3,6,1 matt 1,2,1 Game 6 AK 11,4,2 shane 5,4,1 Matt 10,4,0 Based on stats there is NO way you can conclude ANYONE outplayed anyone else. Matt was practically a nonfactor except for game 3 and 6 and even then did nothing special. AK and Shane pretty much matched each other until the deciding game. Neither played significantly worse than their norm, or significnatly better exceot for game 1, which they almost literally matched each other. That's stats. As for intangibles, defense, etc. Since they were guarding each other for the most part, play similar roles for their teams and neither consistently went off or consistently sucked, you can't possibly conclude anyone outplayed each other or had anymore impact than the other. Perhaps AK had a key block, or Harpring had a key steal, but there was nothing consistent from game to game or or even the majority of games. I'd look up 2007, but something tells me i'd find more of the same, either way, this is enough to prove you wrong.
You couldn't be further from the truth. Adelman has shown he will play who HE WANTS to play. Just like he benched Wafer after he blew up during a string of games, he'll bench whoever he thinks isn't right. He's not playing shane because there's just no one better or because he's a good person. And you may see it as "he's good at taking orders", but that's not any different than just being able to do what the coach wants a player to do. Thats exactly why shane is highly regarded, he does what is needed, and stays within that role. To you it may seem like that means he's limited, to a coach that means he's important to a team. I'm not even sure what u meant with your christie comment, Battier IS his doug christie. all succesful teams have that role player, it doesnt have to be exactly a doug christie or a shane battier, but the role is very similar. As for chuck, if it wasn't for the acquisition of Scola,the emergence of Landry, and the fact that he has ZERO offensive abilities, then he'd still be playing. A lot of good things had to happen to this team for chuck to lose his PT, it wasn't a demotion. Quit comparing chuck and shane just because they are role players who play D well. They aren't mirror images of each other.
were you on the message boards during those playoff series? surely you weren't. when deron was out of the game, ak47 was responsible for some of hte playmaking (regardless of what his assists say). harpring actually had plays ran for him also, making him a threat. they're not just stand-still guys liek shane. both harpring and ak47 switched off to guard tracy mcgrady, along with 2-3 others. their workload was much higher and thus their impact was greater. who did shane defend on utah that stood out? what did shane do on offense that stood out? seriously? if you saw the playoff series game-by-game, surely you know what i'm talking about.
I guess you didn't read my earlier post. both of them can guard their position well, BUT Shane can be out on ANY swingman, from the short shooting guards to the taller small forwards and everything in between. Chuck can guard the smaller power forwrds and centers, but he has trouble with the really tall ones. He may be able to get a good stop here and there, but overall is overmatched, shane however can consistently compete with his guys.
The only point made by any of the Battier Haters here that I can agree with are that he's somewhat rendered useless against Utah. The reasons for this is pretty obvious: they don't have elite 2/3 that Battier is accustomed to dealing with, he's not quick enough to guard Deron Williams or deal with the constant PnR'ing Utah does and, finally, Utah primarily plays Yao one-on-one unlike most teams. If the Jazz are playing Yao on-on-one with just the flash-threat of a double, players like Battier that used to punishing teams for leaving him open don't get those opportunities to shoot open shots. If you can't create your own shot like Battier, Rafer, Head and Hayes that's a huge problem to have. Fortunately for us, Morey has adjusted the roster accordingly and got rid of Rafer/Head and injected enough talent into the team that we can relegate Chuck to the bench for situational minutes. That's called smart management.
1) go watch doug christie in his kings days. please. i'm sorry, but that comment was a diss to christie if you think their role was similar. doug christie actually had the ball in his hands and were expected to make plays on offense for both himself and the team, along with playing defense. shane's role in this offense is park himself in the corner and just stay there till someone passes him the ball. 2) um...b/c scola and landry are "better" talents than chuck is. both of them combined don't have his defensive greatness. but he sucks offensively so when we got scola and landry, it was only a matter of time before he went to the bench. nobody wants to play guys who can't score. no coach does. that's playing 4-on-5. like i said, if tracy was healthy or we have another defensive minded guy who can score, shane wouldn't play as much. so i'm not blaming adelman. wafer is too young and barry is too old. adelman isn't a fan of "scrubs" offensively. that's why he hasn't played deke much or hayes much. he has other offensive options that aren't porous defensively. wafer and barry are porous defensively. so he has to play shane. i'm sure he doesn't.
hopefully shane is next. he's good for situational minutes also. his situational minutes-whenever a top wing scorer is playing.
lol, do the rockets really have that bad of a post entry passer right now...everyone is doing a decent job of getting the ball to yao, unless yao cant get open, and then nobody can give the ball to him Co-sign....his offense has packed up and headed west... Kinda true also...but this has to be addressed by the coach's or something..If shane would have had any offensive production in utah then the rockets could have won... I dont mind when yao has a bad game because he could explode the next game for 30...same with artest or brooks and even wafer...but battier gets a pass for some reason...Artest plays as much defense as shane, but if artest went 5 games of only putting up 4pts, then some of you guys would crucify him on the boards
when did aldridge and garnett "smaller" PFs? if 6-11 or 7' are "smaller," i guess my eyes must be really bad.
