So . . If I allow Smoking in MY BAR I should be FORCED to not allow it because YOU SAID SO? Simple answer on this one. . . Don't come to MY BAR I don't think anyone is forcing people into these spots It puzzles me the mentality I like that bar . .except for the smoking . . . rather than goto another bar. . . i want to force that one to stop smoking Now someone who like the bar .. because of the smoking well screw him . .he is a smoker and his opinion don't matter anyway Rocket River
Crack = illegal Smoke = legal Rocket River that is all . . . How about we Ban Alcohol in Bars next How many people die behind Alcohol?
What is lame about pointing out you don't have a 'right' to work any particular place? You can make a choice to work at a smoking establishment or not, just as you can make a choice to smoke or not. And if your argument is correct then there shouldn't be exemptions for cigar bars. Are those workers entitled to less protection? I agree. I was just being disingenuous and throwing out some of the normal non-smokers lines.
Not just to quote you, but everyone questioning the analogy. We are talking about legality here, right? The new law, in effect, makes smoking in those restaurants illegal. What we are arguing here is if something should be illegal or not, and de-facto, whether or not that decision should be based on a free-market response, correct? In one case, crack is already illegal, everywhere, all the time. In the other case, cigarettes aren't illegal yet. But the law is saying they should be, in certain instances. I purposely compared it to crack because crack is in fact already illegal, and the reasoning behind that decision is, theoretically, NOT because it wouldn't sell well in bars.
Wait, aren't you the one upset about the "Chinese posters" on this board protecting their government by bashing ours? We're talking about cigarettes in public places here, not car pollution, or other items, correct? Do you actually know the definition of a bar? Cigarettes aren't integral to it. Oh, and this
It's an exception that probably won't hold up very long. Just wait till for the law suite. People do have the right to a safe work environment. I thought that was established. OSHA? Why do we protect any worker then? Coal companies have to protect their employees from the dangers of the mine (as well as every other company) right? The argument "just let them find another job" doesn't work. Or is that people in the service industry don't deserve the same protections under the law because they don't matter as much?
Beaumont went through this exercise earlier this year and as a very infrequent bar patron, I thought I'd chime in. I am against this idea in principle, because I think if non-smoking bars were better for the population as a whole, they'd get that way on their own. It has definitely supressed bar business and the first of the "just-out-of-city-limits" bars have started up. I kind of like it in practice and think it does make the bar experience more pleasurable. But I am not the bars' target customer, and those who would be more likely to go to a non-smoking bar are typically infrequent bar patrons anyway. I did talk to the owner of a comedy club who said if the law were repealed today, he would have a non-smoking early show because of the few new customers, but the law has reduced his overall business by about 20%.
The end result of this is that you will see bars that do not have outside seating areas build them, and they will sometimes be more crowded than the inside bar area. The type of bar this ban will really hit is the live music venue.
I'm not a smoker, so I'm genuinely, honestly asking this question: do you think not being able to smoke will stop people from going to bars to hear live music? i love listening to live music. i love hanging at sports bars. i can't imagine not going because there's no smoking....but again, i also understand that my viewpoint is framed from the starting place that i'm not a smoker.
smoking is being slowly legislated out.. next up, obesity. i feel for those who made the decision to start smoking, you're really being railroaded now, but sh*t happens, so nut up and get with the program.
Second-hand smoke simply isn't verifiable. People are still having longer and longer life expectancies, and the baby-boomers and earlier generations had smoke everywhere. My dad had an ashtray in the classroom. You used to be able to smoke everywhere, and yet, people are still living longer and longer. Who wants to live to be 110??? My grandmother is 92. Not a pretty site. Of course she was a smoker, and contracted alzheimers. Guess which part makes her life hell? Clue: She still smokes.
Ask the people working in bars which they would rather have. Especially the recently unemployed workers in Austin.
Houston's live music scene is fragile at best. This ban gives some people another excuse not to go out, that's all.
ahh...you know far more about it than i do, that's for sure! but someday you're gonna teach my son how to play guitar...you just don't know that yet.
Apparently you haven't been out in Austin lately. Bars are dropping like bar flies. the business is hurting and it is a direct result of the smoking ban. they have already taken the first step towards revoking the ban and I bet within the next two years it is repealed entirely. Regards, Brock
Oh, and what? Your analogies are worse than your reading comprehension skills. This ban is a result of the desire to protect the public health. I say if you are in a bar you aren't feeling very healthy that day. You are in a bar. People in bars smoke and drink. I swear that half the people who voted for the smoking ban in Austin probably bummed a cig from me at one point or another. Freakin' hypocrits. As far as the Chinese debate, the thread was about China's policy in Tibet. Not about American policy in the 1800's. This thread is about cigarette smoking in bars and public health which is directly related to the examples I posted. Thanks for listening, Brock
i'll say this much...your rights notwithstanding...i'm really glad i can go to a sports bar with a friend..and come home to get in bed with my wife without smelling like a chimney. i'm just sayin' hugs and kisses, max
