All I am saying Kidrock, is in my opinion, it will be very hard for the committee to justify moving them past either team, and if they move past one team, its Kansas, because of the head to head matchup result. Kansas won the big 12 because: a) The North blows b) All of their tough games were practically at home(except for OU, and Missouri-who they got very lucky against) I just think its hard for the committee to say OU is better than either team because they beat 3 mediocre schools. UT/KU losing hurts OU more than helps them. I do think there is a possibility UT drops to a #2, but I believe Kansas will be the big 12 team on the outside if the selection committee bumps Oklahoma up.
oh well tech should still get strong consideration of a NCAA bid. I think they will still get.they had their chances ou was just more talented...good effort however
Interesting take. I don't think Texas gets picked over KU, simply because they beat us head to head. Not to mention that they won the conference. OU winning the Big XII tourney could bump us out. Right now, Arizona and Kentucky have locked up two spots. The other two are a tossup between UT, OU, KU, and hell, even Pitt. You have to remember that there's alot of pressure that comes with being a #1 seed. Sure it's a sign of prestige, but it means that other teams will come out with a "nothing to lose" attitude. Either way we'll have an easy first weekend against some loser team like Manhatten, SFA, or the like.
If OU takes anyone's #1 seed, it'll be Kansas. Not Texas. Texas just has a better case for the No. 1 than OU does.
I don't know about you guys, but a Big 12 tournament championship over Tech soothes the pain of last night I'm getting on the bandwagon now.
If OU takes anyone's #1 seed, it'll be Kansas. Not Texas. Texas just has a better case for the No. 1 than OU does. Depends on how much you value titles. KU has a regular season title; assuming they win tomorrow, OU has a tournament title; Texas has none. With three teams all bunched up in the RPIs, conference, and records, it would be very easy to just pick the two with titles. Regardless, tomorrow will be fun.
UT will get the #1, imo. No way OU gets it over them. OU fans last night said the same. IMO, in the tourney, you can't really play your way out of a seed, but you can play into one, if that makes sense. Pitt is the team I'm worried about. But, their sos is like 68.
Baqui, If the committee picks OU over Texas as the 4th #1 seed, they should all be castrated. There's this little thing called head to head play that they would be forgetting. Texas beat OU both times this year, and has an equal amount of losses compared to OU. There shouldn't even be a debate here. Beating Colorado, Tech, and possibly Missouri doesn't prove anything. If they had run the table through UT/KU then yes maybe I could see it, but they didn't. As far as Kansas goes: Like I said earlier, the North sucks. Colorado is only good in Boulder, ISU stunk, Nebraska is putrid, KState is below average and Missouri is schizophrenic. The South has UT, OU, OSU, Tech at least. Kansas' hardest road game this year was at OU which they got killed, and Missouri where it took a lucky end to survive. They played Texas and Oklahoma State at Allen Fogg Fieldhouse. And they had some serious ref help in the last 7 minutes or so vs UT. When you compare UT's schedule in conference to that of KU it's no surprise Kansas won the conference. They got Texas at home, and didn't have to play the stronger side of the big 12 twice, like UT did. Also, what quality wins does Kansas have. Texas, Missouri twice, OSU, at Tulsa, at Cal and Colorado(who stinks outside Boulder). That's it. UT has OSU, OU(2), Missouri, Georgia, Seton Hall, and Tech at home. I took out the road wins in Lubbock for both schools since that obviously is equal. Anyways, UT winning at home over OU equates to Kansas beating UT at home. Both teams trounced OSU at home, so that is equal as well. Georgia plus beating Missouri at home neutralizes KU beating Mizzou twice. Seton Hall on a neutral court matches up as fair with Tulsa. Tech at home for UT is about the same or better than Colorado at home for KU. And Kansas has no road win that equates to Texas winning in Norman. Cal is solid but not that good. KU lost to UNC(tourney), Oregon(away), CU(away), Florida(tourney), OU(away), Missouri(tourney), Arizona(home). UT lost to ND(tourney), OSU(away), Zona(away), Kansas(away), Tech(tourney), CU. We will throw Tech/Missouri out because both came in this tournament. Both teams lost in boulder so that too is gone. OSU away for UT is comparable to Oregon away for KU. OU away is like Kansas away for UT, so that is thrown out. Notre Dame is in between Florida and UNC for Kansas. And Texas lost to Zona by 3 in Tucson, Kansas lost a huge early lead to them at home. Basically, I have proven that UT has the best resume from the big 12, and if they don't need a number 1 seed, the committee should feel disgraceful. I could compare UT to OU but considering the head to head result this year, I did not think it was necessary. As far as OU/KU OU lost to Miss St, Alabama, Texas twice, Missouri, OSU. They beat UConn at home, Michigan State in a tourney, Kansas at home, OSU at home, Colorado at home, Tech at home. OSU at home and CU at home cancels out for both teams. UConn is similar to beating Missouri at home, Michigan State in a tourney is like Tulsa for Kansas, beating KU at home is akin to KU beating UT at home. Tech at home is decent, but Kansas beat Mizzou on the road, and Cal on the road. And Kansas won the big 12 regular season conference title. If it were me, Texas is the 3rd number 1 seed with KU the 4th, and OU the best number 2 seed. How it plays out nobody but the committee knows.
It seems to be an <i>ego</i> issue among some UT fans that their team gets a #1 seed. #1 Seeds Kentucky Arizona Kansas Pitt Texas likely in the same regional with Pitt.
Pitt has an RPI problem -- their RPI as of a few days ago was #16. That, I think, is too low to get a #1. The committee apparently is good at ignoring the polls, so there's not much going for Pitt here. I think it will 2 B12 teams - just not sure which two. The only other teams that had a chance, I think, were Wake Forest and Syracuse, and they both needed to win their tournaments.
Two things: As much as I hope head to head vs. OU is a factor in helping UT get a #1 seed, it has been reiterated by Lunardi on Bracketology that head to head is not one of the criteria for seeding. Could it subliminally, or implicitly, affect the committee? I hope so, because otherwise, the profiles of UT and OU are darn identical. Someone should be shot if Pitt gets a #1. They played absolutely NO ONE outside of conference. And while the Big East is a solid conference, I don't see any way it matches up with the Big 12 or SEC as far as in-conference strength. I am fine with them getting a good two, especially since everyone else lost this weekend. But no way they deserve a #1.
The RPI numbers for Kansas, UT and Oklahoma are extremely close.........if one goes on that criteria ..............shouldn't the early Tourny stumble of UT give it the short straw?
As a UT fan, that's what I worry about, Mango. However, I just hope that someone's theory that one can't "drop" in seeding, only improve in seeding via conference tourneys, is true. I hope that OU doesn't surpass Texas for #1 in the south because OU didn't beat the strongest teams, because Texas lost as many other teams did this weekend, or whatever other reason helps them claim the #1. My gut right now tells me it's a coin flip- an OU loss to Mizzou might help. But at this point, i thing it's pretty much going to happen, or not.
The RPI numbers for Kansas, UT and Oklahoma are extremely close.........if one goes on that criteria ..............shouldn't the early Tourny stumble of UT give it the short straw? I would think so. If OU wins tomorrow and I was a committee member, I would probably give KU and OU the two #1s. KU has going for it: B12 champion; win over UT OU has going for it: B12 Tourney champion; snubbing last year; win over KU UT has going for it: 2 wins over OU; "fame/hype factor" - they were considered the top B12 team for much of the season in analysts' minds and TJ Ford has been getting ridiculous hype for the past week or two. How it all shakes out, who knows. My gut says it will still be UT and KU, but I wouldn't be at all surprised if OU got one over UT.
I realize that UT fans dominate in this thread................but that doesn't bother me. Does it matter that much if they are the #1 or the #2 in a bracket? I can see a point of difference between #1 and #6...........but the bracket difference between #1 and #2 seems marginal at most (in terms of strength of opponents, not the ego factor). Then how about Wake Forest as the other #1......... if Pitt's RPI restrains them from getting it?
No, mango, it's a feeling that the pollsters and experts in any major college sport can't get their facts straight regarding UT. This past football season, UT beats Kansas State, at Kansas State, both teams have 2 losses, yet Kansas State is ranked ahead of UT through the end of the year. Then now, stupid bracketologists like Joe Lunardi want to rank OU over UT presuming the Sooners beat Missouri tommorrow for the tournament title. Yet, both teams have 6 good losses, both with similar quality wins..... but Texas has the season series advantage. And I have to justify a number 1 seed over OU? Memo to Joe Lunardi and other bracket dorks: head to head competition does matter. If it didn't why on earth play the games. Also, Pitt is a piss poor excuse for the 5th best team in the country, and they had numerous bad losses down the stretch of the season. If they get the 4th #1 seed, and we get the 2 seed in their bracket I have 3 words for you: Hello New Orleans. It's just a matter of respect. We beat OU both times this season, we have as good of credentials as any team in the country for a number 1 seed, and bracket idiots at CBS, ESPN are moving UT out for OU if the Sooners beat Mizzou tommorrow, considering they beat the Buffs who stink outside rarified air, mediocre Tech, and slightly above average Missouri. That is a joke my friend, a joke. And that is what the NCAA selection committee has and will continue to be perceived as if they do seeds like that. I could go on for hours about how dumb conference tournaments and championship games in football are, but I think you get my point. I mind a two seed because I want no part of Zona/UK until we had to meet in the final four and I highly doubt they want two big 12 teams as the top 2 seeds in a region. It's about doing things the right way for a change, and you cannot make a more convincing argument for Oklahoma to be a number 1 seed over Texas, unless you play dumb like other bracketlogists and throw out head to head play. That is my beef, Mango.
Major, You have to be kidding me, and I know you are an objective UT fan. How on earth can the committee justify putting OU over UT when they have equal credentials and UT won both meetings this year? Conference tournaments don't mean a damn thing for good teams. Especially this one, as OU will have beaten 3 mediocre opponents to win the big 12 conference tournament? This is why all the crazy upsets happened this week. Mango, Neither Pitt or Wake Forest have a resume for being a number 1 seed. Not compared to Kansas, Oklahoma, and Texas. The ACC was weak this year, and the only way they had a shot was winning their conf tourney, and even then it was a longshot, just like Pitt. I was not being overly biased when I compared the 3 big 12 schools, nor am I in saying Wake/Pitt aren't the best qualified for number 1 seeds. Bottom line: Let's play the games, and committee I dare you to give UT a number 2 seed, because if so you can watch them use it as motivation and get to New Orleans, but they stand a great chance of getting there anyway.
Some of you really have an elevated view of UT, let me get this straight, you've got 3 comparable teams. One team won the regular season Another team won the tourney championship And the other team lost to "mediocre" Texas Tech I honestly have no clue who's going to be the 1 seeds, nor do I care, but it's pretty funny how the team with 0 championships this year thinks they have the best chance at being a 1 seed... Conference tournies don't matter? Maybe they should to teams that want to be a 1 seed?
