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Horizon Deepwater

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by DonnyMost, Apr 29, 2010.

  1. rimrocker

    rimrocker Contributing Member

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    Yesterday's stats...

     
  2. rimrocker

    rimrocker Contributing Member

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  3. basso

    basso Contributing Member
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    Obama's GTD list:

    [rquoter]
    1. Waive the Jones Act: According to one Dutch newspaper, European firms could complete the oil spill cleanup by themselves in just four months, and three months if they work with the United States, which is much faster than the estimated nine months it would take the Obama administration to go at it alone. The major stumbling block is a protectionist piece of legislation called the Jones Act, which requires that all goods transported by water between U.S. ports be carried in U.S.-flagged ships, constructed in the United States, owned by U.S. citizens, and crewed by U.S. citizens. But, in an emergency, this law can be temporarily waived, as DHS Secretary Michael Chertoff did after Katrina. Each day European and Asian allies are prevented from helping us speed up the cleanup is another day that Gulf fishing and tourism jobs die. For more information on this, click here.

    2. Accept International Assistance: At least thirty countries and international organizations have offered equipment and experts so far. According to reports this week, the White House has finally decided to accept help from twelve of these nations. The Obama administration should make clear why they are refusing the other eighteen-plus offers. In a statement, the State Department said it is still working out the particulars of the assistance it has accepted. This should be done swiftly as months have already been wasted.

    Take Sweden, for example. According to Heritage expert James Carafano: “After offering assistance shortly after the Deepwater Horizon explosion, Sweden received a request for information about their specialized assets from the State Department on May 7. Swedish officials answered the inquiry the same day, saying that some assets, such as booms, could be sent within days and that it would take a couple of weeks to send ships. There are three brand new Swedish Coast Guard vessels built for dealing with a major oil spill cleanup. Each has a capacity to collect nearly 50 tons of oil per hour from the surface of the sea and can hold 1,000 tons of spilled oil in their tanks. But according to the State Department’s recently released chart on international offers of assistance, the Swedish equipment and ships are still ‘under consideration.’ So months later, the booms sit unused and brand new Swedish ships still sit idle in port, thousands of miles from the Gulf. The delay in accepting offers of assistance is unacceptable.” For more information, click here or here.

    3. Lift the Moratorium: The Obama administration’s over-expansive ban on offshore energy development is killing jobs when they are needed most. A panel of engineering experts told The New Orleans Times-Picayune that they only supported a six-month ban on new drilling in waters deeper than 1,000 feet. Those same experts were consulted by Interior Secretary Ken Salazar before he issued his May 27 report recommending a six-month moratorium on all ongoing drilling in waters deeper than 500 feet. A letter from these experts reads: “A blanket moratorium is not the answer. It will not measurably reduce risk further and it will have a lasting impact on the nation’s economy which may be greater than that of the oil spill. We do not believe punishing the innocent is the right thing to do.”

    And just how many innocent jobs is Obama’s oil ban killing? An earlier Times-Picayune report estimated the moratorium could cost Louisiana 7,590 jobs and $2.97 billion in revenue directly related to the oil industry. For more information on this, click here.

    4. Release the S.S. A-Whale: The S.S. A-Whale skimmer is a converted oil tanker capable of cleaning 500,000 barrels of oil a day from the Gulf waters. Currently, the largest skimmer being used in the clean-up efforts can handle 4,000 barrels a day, and the entire fleet our government has authorized for BP has only gathered 600,000 barrels, total in the 70 days since the Deepwater Horizon explosion. The ship embarked from Norfolk, VA, this week toward the Gulf, hoping to get federal approval to begin assisting the clean-up, but is facing bureaucratic resistance.

    As a foreign-flagged ship, the S.S. A-Whale needs a waiver from the Jones Act, but even outside that three-mile limitation, the U.S. Coast Guard and the EPA have to approve its operation due to the nature of its operation, which separates the oil from the water and then releases water back into the Gulf, with a minor amount of oil residue. The government should not place perfection over the need for speed, especially facing the threat of an active hurricane season. For more information on this, click here.

    5. Remove State and Local Roadblocks: Local governments are not getting the assistance they need to help in the cleanup. For example, nearly two months ago, officials from Escambia County, Fla., requested permission from the Mobile Unified Command Center to use a sand skimmer, a device pulled behind a tractor that removes oil and tar from the top three feet of sand, to help clean up Pensacola’s beaches. County officials still haven’t heard anything back. Santa Rosa Island Authority Buck Lee explains why: “Escambia County sends a request to the Mobile, Ala., Unified Command Center. Then, it’s reviewed by BP, the federal government, the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers and the Coast Guard. If they don’t like it, they don’t tell us anything.”

    State and local governments know their geography, people, economic impacts and needs far better than the federal government does. Contrary to popular belief, the federal government has actually been playing a bigger and bigger role in running natural disaster responses. And as Heritage fellow Matt Mayer has documented, the results have gotten worse, not better. Local governments should be given the tools they need to aid in the disaster relief. For more information on this, click here.

    6. Allow Sand Berm Dredging: The U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service has recently prevented the state of Louisiana from dredging to build protective sand berms. Plaquemines Parish President Billy Nungesser immediately sent a letter to President Obama requesting that the work continue. He said, “Once again, our government resource agencies, which are intended to protect us, are now leaving us vulnerable to the destruction of our coastline and marshes by the impending oil. Furthermore, with the threat of hurricanes or tropical storms, we are being put at an increased risk for devastation to our area from the intrusion of oil.” For more information on this, click here.

    7. Waive or Suspend EPA Regulations: Because more water than oil is collected in skimming operations (85% to 90% is water according to Coast Guard Admiral Thad Allen), operators need to discharge the filtered water back into the Gulf so they can continue to collect oil. The discharged water is vastly cleaner than when it was skimmed, but not sufficiently pure according to normal EPA regulations. If the water has to be kept in the vessel and taken back to shore for purification, it vastly multiples the resources and time needed, requiring cleanup ships to make extra round trips, transporting seven times as much water as the oil they collect. We already have insufficient cleanup ships (as the Coast Guard officially determined); they need to be cleaning up oil, not transporting water. For more information, click here.

    8. Temporarily Loosen Coast Guard Inspections: In early June, sixteen barges that were vacuuming oil out of the Gulf were ordered to halt work. The Coast Guard had the clean-up vessels sit idle as they were inspected for fire extinguishers and life vests. Maritime safety is clearly a priority, but speed is of the essence in the Gulf waters. The U.S. Coast Guard should either temporarily loosen its inspection procedures or implement a process that allows inspections to occur as the ships operate. For more information, click here.

    9. Stop Coast Guard Budget Cuts: Now is not the time to be cutting Coast Guard capabilities, but that is exactly what President Obama and Democratic leaders in Congress are doing. Rather than rebuilding and modernizing the Coast Guard as is necessary, they are cutting back assets needed to respond to catastrophic disasters. In particular, the National Strike Force, specifically organized to respond to oil spills and other hazardous materials disasters, is being cut. Overall, President Obama has told the Coast Guard to shed nearly 1,000 personnel, five cutters, and several helicopters and aircraft. Congress and the Administration should double the U.S. Coast Guard’s active and reserve end strength over the next decade and significantly accelerate Coast Guard modernization, but for the time being, they should halt all budgetary cuts. For more information, click here.

    10. Halt Climate Change Legislation: President Obama has placed his focus to the oil spill on oil demand rather than oil in our water. Regardless of political views, now is not the time to be taking advantage of this crisis to further an unrelated piece of legislation that will kill jobs and, in the President’s own words, cause energy prices to “skyrocket.” Less than 5% of our nation’s electricity needs are met by petroleum. Pushing solar and wind alternatives is in no way related to the disaster in the Gulf. It’s time for President Obama to focus on the direct actions he can take in the Gulf rather than the indirect harm he can cause in Congress. As Heritage expert David Kreutzer opines: “Fix the leak first, and then we’ll talk.” A crisis should not be a terrible thing to waste, as Rahm Emanuel said, but a problem to be solved. For more information, click here.[/rquoter]
     
  4. SamFisher

    SamFisher Contributing Member

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    Phase 1 Deny Global Warming Exists, don't limit Greenhouse Emissions
    Phase 2 ????
    Phase 3 Leak is sealed.
     
  5. rimrocker

    rimrocker Contributing Member

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    Jones Act? Seriously?

     
  6. rimrocker

    rimrocker Contributing Member

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    In the article I just posted, this passage needs a little more discussion:

    Why would Repubs be opposed to the Jones Act? The answer is obvious if you think about it... the oil companies don't like the Jones Act because it forces them to use American vessels and crews when transporting oil from Alaska to Lower 48 refineries. It would be much cheaper (and subject to less regulation) to do this with vessels of foreign flags and crews. So, as ridiculous as it seems, Repubs have crafted a phantom talking point criticizing a problem that doesn't exist whose sole purpose is to give more favors to big oil in the middle of big oil's greatest catastrophe.

    I cannot believe so many "Republicans" keep falling for this stuff.
     
  7. rimrocker

    rimrocker Contributing Member

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    From yesterday's Unified Command Fact Sheet:

     
  8. Space Ghost

    Space Ghost Contributing Member

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    Uhhh What other reasons would anyone be opposed to the Jones Act? The Jones Act is anti-capitalist, so I would expect a capitalist to be against it. Truth be said, not many people knew about it in the first place.

    I don't support the original intent of the Jones Act, but I do believe it provides us with better security.
     
  9. glynch

    glynch Contributing Member

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    The Jones Act also protects employers in some ways. One of my buddies has the wrongful death case of one of the 9 or 11 killed on the rig. The Jones Act is sort of like worker's comp in that respect. It makes it hard to get full negligence damages. I think gross negligence might allow him to get more than Jones Act damages for the deceased worker.

    Look it so obvious the Republicans are out for the wealthy and the corporate elite. It is sort of amusing yet frustrating to watch the unsophisticated or ideology fogged conservatives and libertarians struggle to avoid seeing the obvious. I think the GOP spazzing out during this economic crisis is opening a lot of eyes.
     
  10. TECH

    TECH Contributing Member

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    Why wouldn't the administration simply make their argument? If the Jones Act isn't an issue, why not clear the air over it?
     
  11. TECH

    TECH Contributing Member

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    All well and good, but I didn't see a timeline or date stamp on anything listed. Much of the criticism is that it took too long to accept much of the aid, or implement the strategies.
     
  12. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Contributing Member
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    I don't think anyone realized how bad the spill was early on.
     
  13. rimrocker

    rimrocker Contributing Member

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    Well, that was June 30. There's one of those fact sheets issued every day, but they only started mentioning the foreign support in the updates when this stupid talking point began sprouting up on every wingnut outlet.

    On June 10, WH Press Secretary Robert Gibbs had this exchange with a reporter:

    On June 15, the Unified Command felt the need to combat the wingnut idiocy and issued this press release:
    So, based on the answer Gibbs gave, we know that sometime before June 10 and sometime before the Jones Act talking point made its way into the wingnut consciousness, there were foreign vessels operating in the Gulf of Mexico as part of the response.

    As far as I can tell, that response included boom from a number of countries, and skimmers from the Dutch, Norway, and Mexico with additional stuff arriving since June 10. There's probably a better list with arrival dates somewhere, but I don't want to spend any more time on this ridiculous argument.
     
    1 person likes this.
  14. rimrocker

    rimrocker Contributing Member

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    See my last post. It's been addressed at WH Press Briefings and by the Unified Command. Just because the wingnut media refuses to report it doesn't mean it hasn't happened.
     
  15. Sweet Lou 4 2

    Sweet Lou 4 2 Contributing Member
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    wow, rimrocker just served up game set match. there are crickets chirping from the Glenn Beck camp.
     
  16. rimrocker

    rimrocker Contributing Member

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    Yesterday's WH Press Briefing with Gibbs and retired Admiral Allen...

     
  17. Invisible Fan

    Invisible Fan Contributing Member

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    While it appears the focus on the Jones Act is yet another ironic Republican diversion, that doesn't cover the horrid response to fast track approval for dutch or saudi oil skimmers.

    That's an EPA regulation issue, right?
     
  18. Deckard

    Deckard Blade Runner
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    You posted something related to this issue dated June 15, but the disaster happened on April 22. At the moment, I'm not interested in whether there has been approval during the last few weeks, but whether there was an absurd delay in the time period immediately after the destruction of the rig, and the few weeks right after that occurred. The column I posted was written by someone who, as far as I can tell, has no "agenda" with regards to the President, the Democratic Party, or anything related to them or the environment. In fact, I think he is an environmental activist, who is trying to get the information about the delay via the Freedom of Information Act. If I am wrong about that, I'd love to be enlightened. I haven't read posts from those I have on ignore, and could care less about what they posted, but I would like to know why everything has taken so long.

    Have anything to tell me about the time period I'm talking about that doesn't involve "wingnuts?"
     
  19. rimrocker

    rimrocker Contributing Member

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    Look Deck, there's a lot to criticize. I'm not defending every action or non-action. For instance, I think they were way too deferential to BP early on... but if you're going to criticize the administration, it should over something substantive and not a made up reason that if "fixed" does no good in the current crisis and makes things cheaper for the oil industry in the long run.

    Here's the most complete Federal response timeline...

    http://www.deepwaterhorizonresponse.com/posted/2931/updated_timeline_through_June_29.594723.pdf

    Looking at that, you could easily argue that the initial actions were bureaucratic in nature and not things that would help with oily water,

    I'll talk more about things after I go do some family stuff.
     
  20. Deckard

    Deckard Blade Runner
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    I was going to post that I didn't want you to take what I wrote as something directed at you as much as an expression of anger and frustration at the bungled early days of this spill. Work hard enough and I might find something to get irritated about, however. I think what happened in those early days is worth finding out about (thus the filling by the guy with that right-wing rag, The San Francisco Chronicle, for information about the subject under the Freedom of Information Act), and damn straight that finding out about it is substantive and well worth doing. I'm a Democrat with a perfect right to criticize the Administration or any Federal agency who screwed up when it might have made a big difference. If it wouldn't have made a difference, then no one should care if we get that info, correct?

    I'm pissed off about this. I don't care who was in charge, if they deserve to lose their jobs over an inept response. I'm not saying it was the President's fault, but if suits in the government stood in the way of a quick response that could have helped protect my Gulf of Mexico, a disaster that is impacting people I know and their families, then let the chips fall where they may.
     

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