davis is on par; no more - he's an average NFL back. johnson is not better than ernest givins. might be one day, but not so far. johnson has a ways to go; so far, he's been flashes but mostly unrealized potential. more than carr, he's the guy that has to make the leap this year.
givens was tough. "great" is a word to often thrown around. they were a solid receiving core. but I've had this debate before on here and when you start breaking down stats like yards per catch, they really don't match up to the "great" receivers that played when they played. that also could be a product of the system.
i completely disagree. it's not as if jeffiries and givens and hill and duncan were costing us games. are you going to argue they should have caught more passes? scored more touchdowns? more yards receiving? they fit the system quite well. neither them nor moon were the source of our playoff losses. in turn, marino never had a back similar to what brown did for us, even as a one-year wonder. he never had consistent help at all on the offensive side of the ball. i'm one of the biggest marino detractors in the world. i really don't like the guy. but i have a hard time arguing that he had as much around him as moon did.
givins & hill were both there before the "system" (which didn't actually show up until 1990), and both were very productive. re: stats, bear in mind - they were splitting catches with three other receivers at any given time, so of course their numbers are going to trend downward. he still consistently caught 50-60 balls for 900+ yards with big ypc average.
i think it absolutely is a product of the system. and it makes it very difficult to compare them to other receivers of that era or any era, frankly.
i acknowledged that by calling him a one-year wonder. i'm still suggesting that marino didn't get that kind of production from a back.
if we both acknowledge he was a one year wonder, what is your point. was moon susposed to win a super bowl because gary brown had one good year? neither one of them ever played with a great running back.
no. not at all!!! look, honestly i think i'd make a compelling argument that moon was a better QB than marino. i'm sure tons of people across the country would take issue with that. and i'm sure i'm partially blinded by homerism, because i loved the guy. i'm just saying i think those oiler teams of the early 90's were more talented than any team the dolphins threw out on the field during the marino era.
I met mark clayton at my barber shop about 4 years ago. he was pretty cool. it was weird, he or his wife aren't from houston, she's from somewhere around dallas, he's from indy and i think they don't live in tx. anyway, he was a pretty cool guy. I was asking him some questions like did it hurt his hands catching passes from marino and how hard do nfl dbs hit. nice guy.
I was walking around the corner and somebody hit me in my stomach, I looked up, and said, "mark why'd you hit me" and he said "sorry, I thought you was somebody else"
How the heck did Earl not end up like Dennis Byrd on that play? The answer, of course, is readily apparent to anyone who's ever met him in person: the man was built like a tree trunk. I swear to God, his Dad must have been a redwood tree. And, considering his BBQ, maybe Mom was a Texas mesquite. I agree with those who say Givens' greatness is questionable. But, man, could he take a hit. I remember watching him catch passes across midfield that no sane man would catch, because you just KNEW the hit was coming. And, sure enough, he'd get levelled. But he always got up and kept playing. He was a fast little bugger, too. The one thing I remember most about those Oiler teams is how mentally fragile they were, despite their talent. I mean, everyone remembers the Buffalo collapse, but true Oiler fans know that it was just a matter of time before something like that happened to that team. No lead was safe with those teams. It was enough to give even the most loyal fan an ulcer. At least with the Texans last year, you knew going into the game that they had no chance. There's some comfort in that.
FrontRow, you seem to know a lot about Givens, so I wanted to ask: Who was the one who levelled him on Monday Night in a game against the Eagles? Was it Darrell Green? I forget, but I remember seeing a MEAN elbow graze his face. He ended up with a visor after that. I was scared for a while waiting to see what happened when he got up .
Definitely!! Reason why I wore #34 from pop warner through high school Best 34s of all time in Houston: 1) (H)Akeem (move to 1 required when he brought the title home) 2) Earl "the tyler rose" Campbell 3) Nolan Ryan
Not to sabotage the house of pain discussion from the early 90s, but found some more EC highlights for those that are interested: UT http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-RLOm3Rge8&mode=related&search=earl campbell http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tdvVaTbwMrE&search=earl campbell high school http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l02FgVWHv-k&mode=related&search=earl campbell
