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Heisman Trophy Breakdown

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout' started by panamamyers, Nov 3, 2009.

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  1. SamFisher

    SamFisher Member

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    Actually I forgot about stupid ass Clausen. I think he has a chance to win since he's the only candidate not located in the south and might pick up a lot of Midwest/Eastern votes. ND needs to keep losing.
     
  2. moestavern19

    moestavern19 Member

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    They will almost certainly get their vaginas romped by Pittsburgh.
     
  3. DonnyMost

    DonnyMost Member
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    http://www.sportingnews.com/college...eat-heisman-voters-nd-administration-and-more


    One month remains in the race for the Heisman Trophy, and this thing is only "wide open" because voters refuse to buy into Case Keenum.
    These, of course, are the same people who a week ago believed Oregon was better than Boise State because, uh, they just are—no matter what that insignificant thing called scoreboard proclaimed in bold white lights on the first Thursday of the season.

    A quick aside to my Legends Poll friend Terry Donahue: Coach, there's no such thing as "if they played again." That's the NFL; this is college football. They played, Oregon lost (badly), move on.

    Now, back to the Heisman: The pressure rests squarely on the collective shoulders of the voters. Mark Ingram of Alabama is a good choice, but he's not the best tailback in the nation (see: Gerhart, Toby). And if Trent Richardson, Alabama's dynamic freshman backup, got Ingram's carries, he'd have the same numbers.

    I don't want to hear about Colt McCoy or Tim Tebow. While both have had nice seasons, neither has come close to the ridiculous standards they set the previous three seasons. Unless one of the two gets really hot, really quickly, I can't see voting for them—and I'm the guy who still will proclaim Tebow as the greatest player of the modern era.

    This leaves us with Keenum, whose candidacy is hurt only because his Houston team plays in Conference USA. In nine games, Keenum has thrown for 3,815 yards, 28 touchdowns and only five interceptions. He's completing 71 percent of his passes, and he likely has three regular-season games plus a likely C-USA championship game to further pad those numbers.
    He led the Cougars to victories over Big 12 South heavies Texas Tech and Oklahoma State, throwing for 801 yards and four touchdowns (two interceptions), and running for two more touchdowns. Against those same two teams, McCoy threw for 376 yards, two touchdowns and two interceptions.

    Keenum has thrown for more than 500 yards in a game three times, and in Houston's only loss, on the road to UTEP, he completed 51 passes for 536 yards, five touchdowns and no interceptions. Why does playing in a non-BCS league make Keenum's accomplishments less important than average seasons from McCoy and Tebow?

    In this season without a BCS player seizing the moment, maybe we should look to the best player regardless of conference affiliation.
     
  4. Tfj4

    Tfj4 Member

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    Tebow is so overrated...nuff said
     
    1 person likes this.
  5. rimrocker

    rimrocker Member

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    Don't look now, but McCoy is about to become the winningest college QB ever. With wins over Baylor and Kansas, he will set the NCAA record.
     
  6. zoork34

    zoork34 Member

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    There should be no heisman trophy winner this year because no one deserves it. If there's not an obvious winner, why have one at all?
     
  7. marks0223

    marks0223 2017 and 2022 World Series Champions
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    If there are 3 or 4 undefeated teams: There should be no national championship game because we don't know who deserves to play. If there's not an obvious pair of teams, why have a championship at all?
     
  8. moestavern19

    moestavern19 Member

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    They should give the Heisman Trophy to the SEC officiating crew.
     
  9. rrj_gamz

    rrj_gamz Member

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    There is no clear cut choice...If UofH didn't lose to UTEP and wasn't in C-USA, Case would definitely be in the conversation...It's a shame as not only does he have the gawdy numbers to support his case, but has won against good talent in the Big 12 and SEC, but also has led wins in come from behind victories...he has three games and C-USA championship...

    I would like him at least invited to NYC and if he continues to win next year, then we can talk...
     
  10. marks0223

    marks0223 2017 and 2022 World Series Champions
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  11. MourningWood

    MourningWood Member

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    C.J. Spiller, the electrifying back from Clemson, deserves to be in NYC for the ceremony.

    He leads the nation in all-purpose yards/game, and he's achieved that feat against a tough schedule - Clemson's one of three teams nationally to face three top-15 teams. He's had a play of 60+ yards in every single game this season.

    He recently racked up 312 all-purpose yards, which is an NCAA record (trumping the old record, which he held, of 300 yards) in a Clemson victory over FSU.

    I know this has nothing to do with the 2009-10 Heisman race, but here some of his career accomplishments:

    He's the ACC's career leader in all-purpose running, and he's tied for the national record for career kickoff returns for TDs.

    He joins Reggie Bush as the only players in college football history with 2500 yards rushing, 1500 yards in kickoff returns, 1000 in receiving, and 5000 in punt returns.

    <object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/MooMhKt-wKw&hl=en&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/MooMhKt-wKw&hl=en&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>
     
  12. Major

    Major Member

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    The 300 can't be an NCAA record. Ricky Williams had consecutive games with 300+ rushing yards, the larger of which was around 350, and I don't remember that being an NCAA record either. Perhaps it was an ACC record?
     
  13. moestavern19

    moestavern19 Member

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    I was thinking the same thing, pretty sure there have been 400 yard rushing games alone.
     
  14. Franchise3

    Franchise3 Member

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    Didn't Reggie Bush have 500+ all-purpose yards in that Fresno State game?
     
  15. moestavern19

    moestavern19 Member

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    Googled the article, it was actually just a school record.
     
  16. Brando2101

    Brando2101 Member

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    I think the best thing he has going for him is his performance against OK ST and Texas Tech but his numbers are so inflated from conf USA.

    Talk all you want about how bad the big 12 is but the conference holds a 8-2 advantage of CUSA. Any other year and I would say no way but there really isn't anyone else that is having a really outstanding year.

    If a QB from a non-major was going to win, this would be the year.
     
  17. bigtexxx

    bigtexxx Member

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    If Bama beats Florida, I think Ingram gets it. I just don't see a system QB like Keenum getting it. In a spread offense like UH has where you don't run the ball much, your QB will throw a bunch of dink passes for a high completion percentage and rack up big numbers.
     
  18. SamFisher

    SamFisher Member

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    As others noted, the NCAA record is way higher:

    578 total yards by Emmett White, Utah St., vs. New Mexico St., 11-4-2000. 322 rushing, 134 receiving, 2 punt returns, 120 kickoff returns.


    312 may be a school record.

    Barry Sanders averaged nearly 300 APY/game during his Heisman season.

    That's acutally why, IMO, a guy like Ingram really has to be special to get it. A lot of truly great backs like Adrian Peterson, Marshall Faulk, LaDainian Tomlinson etc all put in far superior performances to Ingram this year, who appears to be the beneficiary of a fine offensive line and is posting good, but not spectacular, numbers (will finish around 1500 yards). In terms of being an RB in the NCAA, I think you should have to hit up around 2000 yards to be considered.
     
    #78 SamFisher, Nov 11, 2009
    Last edited: Nov 11, 2009
  19. DonnyMost

    DonnyMost Member
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    2009

    RUSHING YARDAGE 1298
    Yards gained rushing 1450
    Yards lost rushing 152
    Rushing Attempts 294
    Average Per Rush 4.4
    Average Per Game 144.2
    TDs Rushing 16

    2008

    RUSHING YARDAGE............... 2095
    Yards gained rushing........ 2399
    Yards lost rushing.......... 304
    Rushing Attempts............ 406
    Average Per Rush............ 5.2
    Average Per Game............ 161.2
    TDs Rushing................. 23


    The average BCS team runs the ball about 500 times a year.

    So we're 20% behind. Not exactly "not running the ball much" when you nearly have two 1,000 yard rushers in Sims and Beall. You must be thinking of Tech and Hawaii, who typically run the ball around 250 times per year. Less than half of teams like UT and Florida.

    And if the "system" is so good (or cheap/easy to run, for that matter), why isn't every school, and every QB, running it?
     
  20. DonnyMost

    DonnyMost Member
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    Dick Justice... grains of salt required?

    http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/college/houston/6714496.html

    No college football player in the country deserves the Heisman Trophy more than Case Keenum. Want to argue? Let’s go.

    He’s more deserving than Florida’s Tim Tebow, more deserving than Alabama’s Mark Ingram, more deserving than even Texas’ Colt McCoy.

    If the Heisman Trophy were a lifetime achievement award, McCoy would have earned it as he puts the finishing touches on an amazing career. He’s in the mix anyway because his team is unbeaten and because he’s completing 73 percent of his passes. He’s 41-7 as a starter. That’s the most victories of any UT quarterback in history, and years from now, McCoy will be mentioned in the same breath as Earl Campbell, Tommy Nobis and Vince Young.

    As legacies go, that’s a pretty good one. McCoy also could be the poster boy for pretty much everything a college football player should be.

    The Longhorns lean on McCoy as much as the Gators lean on Tebow, so the argument that this player or that player is more important to his team is hard to make. All the great ones are important.

    Keenum is still more deserving because he has done things none of the others has come close to doing. He’s the most productive player on the most productive offense in college football.

    "I’d say when it comes to performance among the top 15-20 teams, he’s as good a player as there is in the country," UH coach Kevin Sumlin said.

    About the only person you couldn’t get this kind of endorsement from is Keenum himself. Sumlin swears Keenum would love to win the Heisman, but he has steadfastly kept the focus on team goals.

    "I don’t know what to think about all that," Keenum said. "That’s a lot of stuff I don’t know about and am not experienced with. I’m going to ignore that as much as possible and just do what I do. I would rather be on the practice field taking a snap and not answering questions about it."

    Say what you want about McCoy, Tebow and Ingram, but their teams are led by their defenses. Texas, Florida and Alabama are ranked first, second and fourth in total defense. Houston is 116th.

    The Coogs are 8-1 because they outscore opponents. Did you say defense wins championships? That’s essentially true, but sometimes a player is so good and makes so many plays that he can overcome the things a team doesn’t have.
    Comeback specialist

    Keenum has led the Coogs to four fourth-quarter comebacks. Three times, UH has scored the winning points in the final minute.

    Whatever UH has needed, Keenum has delivered. He’s on his way to leading the nation in total offense for a second straight season, and the Coogs are tops in the nation with 42.1 points per game.

    "I’d follow him into battle in any game," UH wide receiver Tim Monroe said. "He’s a great leader. He’s the same guy on the field as he is off the field. He just doesn’t show any fear."

    If he doesn’t win the Heisman, it’ll be because the Cougars play in Conference USA, because they’ve played just three teams from BCS conferences, because some voters believe UH doesn’t deserve to be mentioned in the same breath as Florida or Texas.

    To penalize Keenum for things he has no control over is unfair. He completed 71 percent of his passes and averaged 412 yards a game against the three teams from BCS leagues. Against his two best C-USA opponents, Southern Miss and Tulsa, he threw for 1,081 yards and eight touchdowns. In the loss to UTEP, he threw for 536 yards and five touchdowns.

    UH has begun a twitter campaign in an attempt to raise Keenum’s profile with voters around the country. Even if he doesn’t win this year, the goal is to get him an invitation to the big show in New York and position him to win in 2010.
    Why should voters wait?

    But if the award is supposed to be given to the most productive player, he’d win in 2009.

    Before the start of the 2008 season, Sumlin cautioned his quarterback that individual awards might be tough to come by until the Coogs won enough to get back on the national map. They’ve done that, and Sumlin is Keenum’s biggest fan. Sumlin says it’s not just the knack of making winning plays; it’s Keenum’s work ethic and how he interacts with teammates.

    "What you see on the field is what you see here," Sumlin said. "That sense of confidence and calm adds to his leadership ability on the field. He’s the same guy off the field: very, very humble but a competitor. He doesn’t get too hyped up, doesn’t get too low on himself. He really adds a sense of calm to our younger guys. Because of that, you can have a bunch of young guys play — like we did last year. You can also have a new guy like James Cleveland come in and work with him and be able to communicate those things, not just on the field, but off the field. I think that has really helped us."

    Quarterbacks have a position unlike any other in sports. They’re not just the guys who get more of the credit and more of the blame. They’re also the guys who are supposed to unite all the other groups.

    "Football is a really, really interesting game," Sumlin said. "We’ve got guys from all different walks of life. Everybody’s not from Abilene. His ability to reach all the guys and to lead ’em is really, really a gift. It takes a chemistry to do that. It takes more than coaches. Coaches can do a lot, but on any team, the guy that’s touching the ball the most has got a huge, huge job."

    Sumlin said he thinks of the Heisman as a team award. But it helps a team when the most productive player is the same every week, when he accepts blame and deflects credit, when he’s exactly what a leader should be.

    "God calls us to be humble," Keenum said. "I know I’ve been blessed to get to play the game. I consider every day going out there a blessing and a gift from God. I don’t want to take anything for granted. Every day is a new blessing."
     

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