No, not personally or in a vision or a dream. I have a question I really would appreciate your help with. Genuinely. I am trying to teach our church to act or become more and more like the Jesus we study in the Bible. When I was in high school I hated Christians and churches and I was a card carrying atheist. I would argue and fight over religion and against religion. But my Grandmother was a very sweet Christian woman who attended church and I was very close to her. Whenever I was around her I could never bring myself to say anything negative about religion. The women never lied to anyone, never was angry, never was unkind or unthoughtful. She had a weird peace and a unique character that seemed really pure and good. She would quietly without letting others know about it do all kinds of very good deeds. She was very loving and encouraging to me but she always quoted Bible verses and she prayed for me all the time- when I was right there with her. I just couldn't come against my Grandmother. Today I would say she had supernatural peace and love in her life. Until she died, she was a example of truth, integrity, character, love, patience, forgiveness, and she was opinionated but never argumentive or divisive. She was gold. Now I look back and say to myself- she was like Jesus Christ. She was a true believer. I am a pastor and often I am stereotyped as a right wing nut, or I am stereotyped according to a Jerry Farwell or James Dobson (not to criticize them I do not know them personally). I want in my life as a Christian that quality my Grandmother had. I am trying to teach my church that quality. If you have made it this far in this thread here is the question? Have you ever met someone like my Grandmother? Someone you got to know and thought, "That must be what Jesus Christ is like." I have met lots of other people like her since I have associated with Christians and many who are not like that at all. If anyone has had that experience and would share it I would appreciate knowing what qualities you found 'Like Jesus Christ' I am looking for real life examples Please. At the time I really didn't connect her character to Christianity.
One thing that has always puzzled me about Christianity. Is the "official doctrine" state that you go to Hell if you don't worship Christ? I used to hear that a lot from the Christians on campus.
Thanks, interesting comment, and I don't remember my Grandmother ever saying that. But she might have. That is not what sticks out in my mind. Wow- if I get no responses, that might be a big message to a pastor!
Jesus just left Chicago and he's bound for New Orleans. Well now, Jesus just left Chicago and he's bound for New Orleans. Yeah, yeah. Workin' from one end to the other and all points in between. Took a jump through Mississippi, well, muddy water turned to wine. Took a jump through Mississippi, muddy water turned to wine. Yeah, yeah. Then out to California through the forests and the pines. Ah, take me with you, Jesus. You might not see him in person but he'll see you just the same. You might not see him in person but he'll see you just the same. Yeah, yeah. You don't have to worry 'cause takin' care of business is his name.
i'm agnostic, and although i believe that forces of good and evil are very much at work in the world, i'm uncomfortable with the idea of worship, unless it involves a 6-foot blonde chick dressed in PVC and 6 inch stillettos, and then we could, uh, talk.
I think you would have loved her, and what's funny is she would have laughed so hard over your statement and probably gone on in to the kitchen and baked you some of her best chocolate chip cookies. Without saying a word in response. Some Christians feel there should be a growth in personal character that reflects the same character traits of Jesus Christ. That even though there are differences of culture and personality there are certain character attributes that can be attributed to Christ- honesty, compassion, holiness, purity, unselfishness etc. I am looking for 'experiences' where you met a Christian who seemed like the real deal.
When I play that song on the guitar my gives me that weird look like "Pastor, what are you doing?" (hands on her hips, scowl in her eye)
So do non-Christians go to Hell? I heard it from a pastor at a funeral just a few weeks ago. He said something to the effect of "what if we're right? wouldn't it be wise and prudent then to become a Christian then if non-Christians do, in fact, go to Hell?" That 6-foot blonde religioin sounds good too.
If you could help with some replies, like nope I never ever felt that way about any Christian I ever met, I would be helped. Could we start a different thread about hell?
Ooops... Maybe the stereotype is Christian means non-Christian 'go to hell' Am I reading into that.....
you'd think an omnipotent god would clue into the opportunism in such an approach, and maybe send those folks to a some sort of discount heaven...sorta like tasty delite.
I would count my own parents. I grew up with many foster babies, our garage was periodically into a bicycle restoration shop for poor kids. My mom went around and took photos of poor neighborhoods and confronted our Priest etc with them when it was time to decide on the church's new building addition. We also took truck loads of poorer kids to Astros games with us. (imagine a timid little 9 year old MR.MEOWGI riding the back of a truck with a group of inner city youths on "bat night"). I also have vague memories of fixing run-down playgrounds when I was very young, but I was too little to help much. My mom still teaches at an inner city high school after having a stroke and heart attacks. She has taken gang members to the Holocaust museum and gave them rebuilt pcs. My dad brews kegs of beer. And my parents put up with me too which was probably the hardest thing that they ever did.
I didn't mean it that way. Some of the most kind and caring people I know are Christians. I don't know if that is their innate nature - or that religion has made them better. Probably a mixture of both. I'm thinking about joining a Church one day when my daugher is a little older. I do think that most Christians preach good values and churches do provide a good community network. All the people I've met at Church functions (picnics, festivals, etc.) do seem like kind and genuine people. I just feel that I've met my share of self-proclaimed Christians who have used the hellfire approach to scare me into church. Some Christian acquaintances denounce the "hellfire theory" while others seem to uphold it. After learning about things like the Holocaust and Nanking massacre - the legitimacy of the "hellfire theory" is important in my decision-making.
Thanks, Actually I plan on really using this info. Because I have seen the same link to helping the less fortunate being important, it touches something in me. You had some great parents.
To respond to the idea of worship, IMO that comes later on in ones faith. I mean, why would you worship something you don’t believe in? Further, worship without belief is kind of empty. I think the first step is working through the question of spirituality and this is not strictly and intellectual exercise although that is a component. I think rhester raises one of the key triggers to cause someone to question spirituality, although there are many. Why would Mother Teresa do what she did? And as he says there are a number of people we meet in our lives who seem like truly special people, they exude something different. I think there are probably different people who respond to different kinds of people but I think most people have had this experience. And I think it’s natural to question, what’s that about? I think that can be the beginning of a long questioning process or a short one, and it can have various intermediate stops too. I take a slightly different stance on the language. It’s a minor point but it’s significant to me which is why I bring it up. I don’t think anyone really behaves like Christ. I also don’t think the behaviour itself is the focus. I think we are to live by the spirit of Christ and that shows in some of the things we do and the positions we take. Unfortunately we are all also very deficient in many ways and we all do and say many things that are very much not like Christ. I think people, including non Christians can see this, though, and I think it’s the good things, the Spirit of Christ, the fruit of the Spirit to be more precise (i.e. love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control) that shows and that people notice. And that raises questions. Why would someone be like that? What’s that about? And I think that can cause people to start to question the whole area of spirituality. Examples for me would be people like Mother Teresa, and even people like Bono. Now, Bono is an example of someone who in many areas is quite human, shall we say, but in some areas, for example his “heart” for Africa, I do very much see the fruit of the Spirit. I usually don’t see any ego in him w.r.t. that issue, for example, and his motivation seems to be very pure.
then I do pray you get the Bible version. hell IS in the Bible, but some time I would like to give so of my thoughts on that. I don't think scaring people with hell is good practice. The mind and the conscience work differently. What scares the mind can be way off base, what troubles the conscience can be a very good thing. Thanks for sharing, I think there are some very good qualities that Christians can reflect, but as a Pastor we have on these thick Christian glasses and we can't always see Jesus. That is what I am trying to see.
Very cool! That sound like the kind of person I’m talking about. Now you’re going to tell me that she isn’t a Christian and ask me how do I explain that right?
But don't think for a second that only Christians can be this type of person. To me it springs from compassion, and compassion is not exclusive to Christanity by any means. You just have to "be awake".
