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Harden With A Real Point Gaurd Is The Point

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by pgabriel, Jan 1, 2021.

  1. pgabriel

    pgabriel Educated Negro
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    All you Pat Beverley lovers, his lack of ball handling was a burden to Harden. Harden maybe the best pg in league, but he is a better shooting guard.

    Westbrook lover, he isn't a point guard. Harden can play with anyone but Chris Paul is who he should have won a ring with.

    Can Wall be like Paul? He has put up the numbers but is it really like Paul?
     
  2. HP3

    HP3 Member

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    Paul Wall?

    [​IMG]
     
  3. HP3

    HP3 Member

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    But to answer your question OP, Im not sure if we'll ever see the level of play Chris Paul brought here. Look at how he is with the Suns. Its really impressive. This Westbrook trade gets worse every day man. We really could have had a Harden, Paul, Roco, Tucker, Woods lineup.

    But maybe he doesnt need to be Cp3. I think he can provide volume scoring at good efficiency with good playmaking and I think with the level the rest fo the team is playing at, that might be enough to win....maybe.
     
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  4. pgabriel

    pgabriel Educated Negro
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    Paul's shooting was also very valuable..He could play off Harden also
     
  5. Roxfreak724

    Roxfreak724 Member

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    I think a "real" pass-first pg is not the ideal for James, since he likes to have the ball so much and do a lot of the playmaking/creating himself. However, James needs some help in the playmaking dept otherwise the burden will be far too big. Wall could be the "just-right" mix of scoring, distribution, and personality that can peacefully coexist with James (I use "coexist" b/c I think everyone has shed the fanciful idea of Harden sincerely blending his game with another pg in a collaborative manner).

    Like Westbrook, Wall doesn't need Harden to pick up the pace since he can just generate his own. He doesn't need to ask/persuade James to play faster the way CP3 always used to get in James' ear since he's dynamic enough by himself. He also doesn't appear to be as arrogant/egoistic as either WB or Paul and I think he understands there's a clear pecking order between him and Harden. His catch and shoot 3 isn't as good as Paul but it's also not as bad as Westbrook's so the spacing isn't completely screwed.

    So in sum, I think Wall could be one of the few guards in the league that can actually peacefully coexist with James b/c he meets the following criteria;

    1. Can generate his own pace (since James has a penchant for trotting, this especially helps in the playoffs to mix up our style)
    2. Can get his own bucket
    3. Can make catch-and-shoot 3s at a reasonable clip
    4. Can make plays for others (enough to let James take a couple of plays off)
    5. Sees a clear order between himself and James.
    6. Not too "in your face" (like it or not, constantly getting in Harden's ear is a recipe for getting shipped out of Houston)

    If you look back at all the guards that have played with James in Houston, they all violated at least one (if not more) of these criteria. Except for Wall (the jury is out on #5 I guess but I think we can safely assume that).
     
  6. Roxfreak724

    Roxfreak724 Member

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    How would we have Roco, Woods, and Paul? We traded Capela for Roco b/c of Westbrook and then basically traded Roco for Woods after Westbrook left.

    It's easy to forget how unclear the path forward was in 2019 after losing to the dubs the way we did. Not saying I still wouldn't have CP3 but let's just be realistic about how the team would've turned out if we had kept him.
     
  7. HP3

    HP3 Member

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    Chris Paul is not here because Chris Paul wasnt Chris Paul for a year, and it wasn't solely James who was responsible for that trade as far as we know.

    Edit: Also please dont mistake this for me not thinking that trade was trash. It was and its one the biggest mistakes James has made in his career. Cp3 is great.
     
    #7 HP3, Jan 1, 2021
    Last edited: Jan 1, 2021
  8. HP3

    HP3 Member

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    Getting Covington was always the plan. I dont know if going small was always the plan but getting Roco might have always been that way. With Capela traded for Covington, and with the picks added for Westbrook its likely Woods is on on our roster at the deadline last year.

    Hmmmm. I mean look at the way we lost. Do you really think teams would be able to double team James Harden with Chris Paul in the lineup? The answer is no imo. That has never happend to the degree that it did with Cp3 on the roster, that is just the truth. And Chris Paul was also amazing last year as well. I definitely think we could beat the Lakers with said lineup. They didnt have any other way to guard James.
     
  9. RocketsFido

    RocketsFido Member

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    All those years of Harden not moving off-ball I blame Dantoni.

    Harden moved the most I've seen him off-ball in years tonight and still took over the game in the 4th.

    This team definitely needs a lot more team practice for sure, team activities should be banned when they involve closed spaces.
     
  10. DLT

    DLT Member

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    I will say give Wall a chance. He hasn't played in 2 years and even the year before that people forget that he only played like 30 games. This is literally the worst you will see of him. He will only get better and I can tell that he likes the fact that if everything fails, he can pass it to a historical player that can bail them out at any time. Wall is also passionate so I know that after the game he was like, I'm going to get open 3 after open 3 with James and I have to make the defense pay. I know that he's shooting those same shots nonstop just to make them next time and he wasn't always like that. He will look even better next game
     
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  11. Cstyle42

    Cstyle42 Member

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    Wall is not quite on the level of CP3 point guard wise he's just one tier below but he has the athleticism and quick first step that CP3 has lost.
     
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  12. MorningZippo

    MorningZippo Member

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    CP3 simply can’t take it to the next level, as his game doesn’t allow him to do so without losing efficiency.
     
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  13. AroundTheWorld

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    Paul is the better shooter and floor general. Wall is more athletic and still a great passer. Once they had some time to mesh their games, I am excited about the potential.

    Would still like to see us make a few upgrades. Hope Wall and Boogie can stay healthy.
     
  14. opticon

    opticon Member

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    Tonight Harden looked fresh in his movement in the 4th and seemed to really have his legs late in the 4th quarter on his deep balls. Wall can make a lot of plays early in the game and which lets Harden conserve energy so he can use it when it really counts. Another thing that is really great about Wall is his defense. That block he got on Haliburton was amazing. Beverly, Lawson, Paul, or Westbrook would not have made that block. Wall's amazing speed with the Ball also translates to lateral quickness when defending. If we did not have to deal with Covid restrictions we would be undefeated.
     
  15. HardenVolumeOne

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    If Silas was our coach when cp3 and harden were teammates, we do not go 0-27 from three in game 7. adjustments and timely timeouts is something silas does better than mike did at any point in his career as coach for the rockets
     
  16. bleedroxred79

    bleedroxred79 Member

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    CP3 got traded because he was always hurt and checked out in the playoffs. Everybody thought he was on the decline physically (with a horrendous contract) I don't blame the Rox for trading him, but WHO we traded for and WHAT was included was 100% the wrong move.
     
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  17. beardsanity713

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    I don't think it works personally with the exception of CP3 bc he is a basketball genius.. I believe Harden would thrive more with a all star Wing or Big.. Someone who can take the bigger load defensively on stars & playmaker or shot create when needed..
    Kobe MJ Wade as far as SG. None of those guys played with elite Point guards they had serviceable 3 & D PG's just to get them the ball
     
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  18. pippendagimp

    pippendagimp Member

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    wall had an easy layup all alone but waited and got cousins the trailer an easy dunk instead. as long as he stays healthy, he's an upgrade over both westbrook and '18-'19 CP3
     
  19. DM'sVP

    DM'sVP Member

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    The offense is a beautiful thing to watch this season. Everyone on the court can either shoot or make a play so teams cannot double Harden. Harden is simply unstoppable in a 1:1 situation.
     
  20. napalm06

    napalm06 Fertitta-McNair School of Management
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    But WesTbrOoK gets TriPLE DouBlEs!
     

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