Harden needs to be better

Not every sport season is like those corny movies, where the Mc and his ragtag team of slightly above average-mediocre players win it all by beating the favorites. Go back in time to Rockets championships to see that type of dream. Even then mc and team were pretty good just seeded low

 

Jim needs to #bebetter & #actright.

 

One thing that I wish (and apologies if it's been mentioned; I haven't had a chance to read the whole thread) is that the organization would ease up on the "Harden for MVP" gas pedal.

I'm not saying he doesn't deserve it, I'm not saying the organization is actively campaigning for it. But Westbrook pretty much has it in the bag, anyway. Hell, you can almost see OKC's bigs get out of the way so that Russ can snag the rebound (and the ensuing triple double).

There is no damned way Harden should be playing 39 minutes a game. Not with the firepower we have. We go and get Lou Williams and yet Harden still plays 39 minutes last night. Two things D'Antoni has in common with McHale: he makes few, if any, real adjustments; and he rides certain players (Harden chiefly) until the wheels go all wobbly.

If we're going to lose to these Eastern Conference teams desperate for a win, you can plug in Harrell and Dekker for more minutes and at least keep the main guys from complete exhaustion. This MVP quest is just an aside of mine, but I feel like the numbers-chasing, play-lots-of-minutes, help-Harden-win-MVP is detrimental to the team. There are times when I don't WANT Harden to check back into the game because the other guys are hot, and Harden has been excruciatingly game-planned, and will sometimes try to do too much. Which is what is being asked of him: too much.

 

Basically all the the last part. Which can be tied somehow to a couple of other minor arguments too, like the Dwight situation, why Durant didn't even considered us etc...still hope basketballholic (and a part of me) is wrong...obviously, but eh...cannot lie to myself.

 

I agree. We also lost few games or almost did because of this, i think most of people here knows what we're talking about, and this is another thing that can be tied with something basketballholic was saying. I'm all for helping James getting the MVP, but the team comes first, and by a large margin.

 

So, you agree with the following?

Bbholic:
"Harden is a great player. But he is not mature. He wants to control everything. And he's not capable, at this time, of bringing it all together. If he doesn't mature more and learn how to lead his team better he is going to be an also-ran for his career. Harden is lacking in humility and selflessness and a true commitment to winning above promoting himself and his brand. He has to correct that or he will not win a championship."

 

You're the one making blanket statements about this bbs being blindly pro-Harden. I'm talking about a specific person that blasted this board with only negative Harden takes before disappearing or going back to one of his other usernames. When you bombard people with nothing but that it's disingenuous and people tune out. Feel free to search for Joomba posts. Though I'm almost 100% sure he's posted in this thread.

I completely agree that Harden needs to be better. I've criticized him plenty. I've yelled at the TV countless times when he throws some dumbass ball across the court right to the other team. But I'm not going to have a back and forth with people who won't give him credit for anything positive. If the season ended now, we'd be the 3 seed and he deserves as much credit for that as he does criticism for not having this team be more consistent with an even better record.

 

I don't think he was talking about yesterday only...?. Personally i remember few times when we burned leads and/or lost games because we started playing to help him pad his stats while the games were not over (which tells you enough about the lack of winning mentality/maturity of this team), games when we had a 20 point lead and we still got him back in the game (risking an injury) just to reach the triple double, all the interviews where he says he should win it etc...i think what ROXTXIA was saying is that all that effort trying to help James having the MVP is not really helping him (and us) in the first place. I just don't like to think that the MVP chase might take away a part of his development as a player/leader.

 

Yes, i basically fear he might be right about most of this.

 

I complained about this many times...too inconsistent.. MVPs don't do that kind ****

 

How long have you been a Rockets fan? Did you feel this way about Hakeem when most of the fake fans wanted to trade him for Rony Seikaly?

Harden has acted in a professional manner ever since joining this team. Dwight was the immature character and once we eliminated him the Rockets became a thing again.

 

25 years basically, and no lol Dream is what made me a nba fan. And trust me, James is my favourite player in the nba as today, i would not trade him for anybody, not even for Durant like other guys said here in some threads, because i think the best Harden is not second to anyone in this league. I just want him to be as better as he can to help the Rockets win. That's why i hope to be ******* wrong.

@Tha_Dude never been a fan of Dwight, you can check the threads about him leaving, you'll definitely find some of my rants about him there.

 

James will be fine. Anderson and Gordon haven't been living up to their contracts of late, though. We paid these dudes the big bucks to make three's for us.... and we need them to just go ahead and do that. I hope they can get it together soon because #RocketsNation needs them.

 

He hasn't embraced lettuce yet.

 

It's really incredible how you can respond to all of my arguments without really answering to any of them. I am getting tired of having to re-hash my arguments simply because you disregard them.

I am not disputing the difficulty of the schedule in January. What I am saying is, as more losses pile up against these same types of teams, you will no longer be able to use the schedule as a reason for poor play. I never said they didn't play a difficult schedule, I said the reason for the losses during that time should not be blamed on the schedule.

That is quite different from saying that I never took into account we had a "statistically" tough January schedule. I think you know that though. but your way of responding to arguments is to pick out one thing I said, and pretend like that was the entirety of my argument.

This trend continues....

Another non-response here. When did I ever mention Dubose? I am responding to you in reference to the discussion you and I had earlier. Saying you agree with Dubious that harden has to shoot better, completely disregards the fact that you said in a previous post that criticism of Harden was unwarranted. What good does saying you changed your argument at a later date do?

This is stunning. You just either refuse to read what I write, or you just choose not to respond to it. When did I ever say that MDA was talking about harden? Further, when did I say that MDA was trying to convey some secret message to Harden. Honestly, stop putting words in my mouth.

The point is: MDA conveyed a message to the team. As the leader of the team, it's harden's job to enact the messages given by the coach to the team. SO, when MDA says something like that, more of the burden falls on Harden to make sure the message permeates the team (and himself), I never once said it was covertly or overtly directed at Harden. This is just another one of your attempts to shield Harden for lacking in leadership.

I'm throwing a "b**** fit" because you are using another excuse. Instead of conceding a point, that harden was bad last night, it becomes, well MDA was out coached. This is a pattern of yours. you routinely accuse me of "making things up" but, when I throw you facts you simply deflect them with more excuses.

Another non-response. ok, so you said they didn't have "significant" lulls compared to top teams.

I told you, there are more losses on the rockets ledger than the other top teams due to lulls.

Your response: n/a

You didn't respond to my argument that there have been other losses prior to this one that they could have "learned" from.

Would a GM turn down James Harden if his only choice was having him, or having a shitty team? probably not. That has no bearing on my ability to question whether a guy is able to lead a team to a championship. Obviously, there have plenty of guy's in the MVP conversation who have never, and will never lead their teams to championships. MVP Conversation = Championship player? This is absurdly false.

I am going to grant you that I do spend a lot of time focusing on Harden's inadequacies. I will also grant you that what he has done this year, with this team, plants him squarely in the MVP conversation.

First, let's not forget, that these same people, who you believe have an infallible opinion when evaluating talents, people who you believe prove your argument that Harden is on no less solid footing among the other MVP talents, not only left him out of the MVP conversation last year, but didn't vote him on to any of the three all-nba teams.

Here are the 2 valid reactions to this:

"these people didn't know what they were doing and this is obviously absurd"-- In which case your entire argument above about how I should listen to higher ups is nullified.

OR

"Maybe I could admit that the flaws in Harden's game as compared to the other super elite players, are greater than I thought, and it has less to do with the numbers he puts up than I thought"--in which case I would agree with you.

This is what is happening.

you are putting the emphasis on his Individual accomplishments with respect to the team, and saying that I am not acknowledging that other great players have weaknesses too. You will always be able to use statistically charged arguments, and tell me "how could you argue that this MVP level player is not championship caliber??" I agree with you, he is on the level of those players statistically. But, in my opinion, he is clearly lacking in some other intangible, but equally important areas. Areas that deal with matters of the mind, heart and soul. Areas that make an "MVP Conversation Player" turn into a championship player. I am not alone in these beliefs. And, don't call me a reverse homer because I call out people who refuse to acknowledge these vitally important parts of the game, because they don't fit in a stat sheet.

time will tell...

 

Again, where's the evidence? I've seen plenty of legitimate criticisms about Harden being written off as act of hate on this board. I've never seen joomba bash Harden when he actually played well. People just couldn't accept the fact that Harden was not playing at an MVP-level back in January, whereas they do now. As I've said before, it's the people's perception and attitude towards Harden that has changed, not the reality.

Why is it that people like Mathloom or SF3isBack! who NEVER say anything negative about Harden gets a free pass and doesn't receive any flak, yet only those who are generally stingy about giving credit to Harden becomes a problem? There are extremes on both sides, yet you seem to have issue with only one side of the spectrum, which shows your bias. In case you haven't noticed, this is not a Harden fan forum. Not everyone here is an ardent Harden supporter; most people (should) put the team first ahead of Harden. As long as their opinions - positive or negative - are based on reality and facts, the compliment to criticism ratio shouldn't be a problem. If you have issue with that, then you should also pick bones with the likes of Mathloom or SF3isBack!, but you don't.