1. Welcome! Please take a few seconds to create your free account to post threads, make some friends, remove a few ads while surfing and much more. ClutchFans has been bringing fans together to talk Houston Sports since 1996. Join us!

Harden asked to be traded before

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by JW86, Dec 9, 2020.

  1. wekko368

    wekko368 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2008
    Messages:
    8,915
    Likes Received:
    1,028
    I'm serious. I've never heard that Olajuwon forced the Rockets to trade Thorpe. Can you provide a source?
     
  2. treyk3

    treyk3 Member

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2008
    Messages:
    8,844
    Likes Received:
    16,340

     
    Nook and D-rock like this.
  3. Verbal Christ

    Verbal Christ Member

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2009
    Messages:
    19,925
    Likes Received:
    31,270
    I was just trying to apply even logic. James is expected to win playoff series with scrub teammates - why isnt Embiid if they are similar talents?

    Well Its hard to win NBA games with a 1 vs 5 roster. Wasnt that the eye opener everyone needed? Neither Jordan or Lebron could win with the types of teammates Harden had. Thats the central theme to why we are where we are now.

    Fairly obvious, but even the GOATS needed help.

    bad, bad games. No doubt.
     
  4. D-rock

    D-rock Member

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2006
    Messages:
    40,743
    Likes Received:
    64,232
    Look it up peanut.
     
  5. B-Bob

    B-Bob "94-year-old self-described dreamer"
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2002
    Messages:
    35,984
    Likes Received:
    36,836
    If you could convince most of the players that this was ultimately bad for business, you might be able to fix it. But I don't know how you could really prove that.
     
    Jontro likes this.
  6. wekko368

    wekko368 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2008
    Messages:
    8,915
    Likes Received:
    1,028
    I tried and couldn't find anything. Can you provide a source?
     
  7. blahblehblah

    blahblehblah Member

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2006
    Messages:
    4,689
    Likes Received:
    3,832
    The rockets catered to Hardens every demand on and off the court and this created the diva we see today.

    It's not the first time this has happened nor will it be the last time. Remember LeBron was/is quite the controlling LeGm everywhere but with the Heat. He tried of course. He famously pressured to replace spo but riley and the heat wouldn't bend the knee to king james.

    Eventually LeBron left the heat and became LeGm once more in CLE and then LA. He was ever the diva and ever controlling. Firing and hiring coaches and players. But because he was the great king james on the court, it was ultimately worth it... He brought titles to those kingdoms.

    While james Harden like LeBron james had his hand in the firing and hiring of coaches and players... He hasn't had nearly the same results.

    The moral of the story, cater to every whim and demands of your superstar at your own peril. Imagine if Curry was a diva and wouldn't let the team fire his beloved mark jackson. Whom he publicly supported 100% yet was also clear that he was NOT The gm. With Jackson at the helm, I'm guessing Curry loses at least 1 mVp and ring.
     
    #87 blahblehblah, Dec 9, 2020
    Last edited: Dec 9, 2020
    LosPollosHermanos likes this.
  8. jdiggidy

    jdiggidy Member

    Joined:
    Jul 9, 2018
    Messages:
    431
    Likes Received:
    374
    The owners would have to enter very specific language into the CBA around hold outs and impose crippling fines. Fines that would significantly hurt star players.

    This doesn't mean players could report and start playing bad or create disruption on the team in other ways to force their way out. The fines would just be significantly less because the team does not have the leverage to levee huge fines.

    At least this BS James is pulling would be nixed because players wouldn't want to start losing like $500K by the league for missing the start of the season or whatever. Just a thought.
     
    Jontro likes this.
  9. SkareKrow

    SkareKrow Member

    Joined:
    May 10, 2015
    Messages:
    289
    Likes Received:
    110
    To get Westbrook you had to move CP3. Who actually thinks those 3 on the court at the same time would result in a title? And how else would you fill out the roster with 3 $30+ million dollar players who play the same position? Why should tillman go into the tax for a team realistic people know cant/wont win a championship?
     
  10. wekko368

    wekko368 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2008
    Messages:
    8,915
    Likes Received:
    1,028
    Wouldn't a CBA with a hard salary cap and no max contracts also achieve this?
     
    Jontro likes this.
  11. s3ts

    s3ts Member

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2007
    Messages:
    3,111
    Likes Received:
    2,851
    And rightly so.

    Nobody wants to come to Houston. Our targets should always be below the top-10 players list because if you're a top-10 player you'd rather play somewhere else.
     
    Jontro likes this.
  12. D-rock

    D-rock Member

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2006
    Messages:
    40,743
    Likes Received:
    64,232
    "While Olajuwon loved the idea of being reunited with his Phi Slamma Jamma fraternity brother, teammates Robert Horry and Mario Elie criticized the trade. With Drexler, 32, the Rockets (47-35) finished the regular season 17-18. This was progress?"

    https://www.courant.com/news/connecticut/hc-xpm-1995-06-11-9506110274-story.html

    No one on Rockets EXCEPT Dream wanted the older and recently injured Clyde Drexler.

    The trade not only lost a popular and productive teammate in Thorpe but it unhinged an already unstable Vernon Maxwell who felt that Drexler was supplanting his starting position.

    But Dream and Glide had been plotting to play together again for years. As soon as Adelman was fired in Portland (after Duckworth traded), Drexler demanded a trade and Hakeem convinced Rockets to do it.

    https://www.houstonpress.com/news/c...e-houston-rockets-miracle-playoff-run-7373022

    Some additional required reading on your "favorite" team.

    https://grantland.com/features/an-oral-history-hakeem-olajuwon-ralph-sampson-1980s-houston-rockets/



    Not charging you ... this time.
     
    Reeko, treyk3 and Nook like this.
  13. D-rock

    D-rock Member

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2006
    Messages:
    40,743
    Likes Received:
    64,232
    Butler and Harden also essentially play same position, wing/off guard.
     
  14. wekko368

    wekko368 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2008
    Messages:
    8,915
    Likes Received:
    1,028
    To say that Olajuwon "forced" the Rockets to trade Thorpe is a stretch.

    There's a big difference between "convinced" and "forced".

    Thanks for providing a source though.
     
  15. D-rock

    D-rock Member

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2006
    Messages:
    40,743
    Likes Received:
    64,232
    If Harden has as much power as you believe then MDA would still be the coach. Definitely not hard balled his final season.

    And Morey would still be GM.

    Some fans are being a tad naive regarding the power and hubris of ownership.
     
    Rocket_Man_2.0 and HP3 like this.
  16. D-rock

    D-rock Member

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2006
    Messages:
    40,743
    Likes Received:
    64,232
    One word is nicer.

    Olajuwon made that trade happen. Fact.
     
  17. anchel

    anchel Member

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2010
    Messages:
    3,913
    Likes Received:
    1,383
    Hmm, just wanted to say that Daryl Morey has previously tried to get other stars of questionable fit... From that perspective and knowing he didn't trusted Paul in coming back better the next season, the move is more understandable. He's very good, a brilliant man, but not infallible.
     
    D-rock likes this.
  18. wekko368

    wekko368 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2008
    Messages:
    8,915
    Likes Received:
    1,028
    They have entirely different definitions. "Force" implies a threat. You haven't proven that Olajuwon forced that trade.
     
  19. blahblehblah

    blahblehblah Member

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2006
    Messages:
    4,689
    Likes Received:
    3,832
    Perhaps I'm naive but I'm going to trust the words, opinions of clutch, macmahon, iko and many others before I trust the words of Tilman fertita.

    The only source that contradict those views are from Tilman Fertita. If he tells me the sky is blue, I'm going to believe it's grey.
     
  20. jdiggidy

    jdiggidy Member

    Joined:
    Jul 9, 2018
    Messages:
    431
    Likes Received:
    374
    It still wouldn't prevent a player from not showing up if he did not like his situation.
     

Share This Page