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Gwynn and Ripken in the hall, McGwire not

Discussion in 'Other Sports' started by BigM, Jan 9, 2007.

  1. BigM

    BigM Contributing Member

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    http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/hof07/news/story?id=2725461

    NEW YORK -- Mark McGwire fell far short in his first try for the Hall of Fame, picked by 23.5 percent of voters, while Tony Gwynn and Cal Ripken Jr. easily gained baseball's highest honor.

    Tarnished by accusations of steroid use, McGwire appeared on 128 of a record 545 ballots in voting released Tuesday by the Baseball Writers' Association of America.

    Ripken was picked by 537 voters and appeared on 98.53 percent of ballots to finish with the third-highest percentage behind Tom Seaver (98.84) and Nolan Ryan (98.79).

    The former Baltimore Orioles shortstop said he was both relieved and euphoric. If he had been picked by two of the eight voters who didn't select him, he would have set the percentage record -- but he didn't mind.

    "All I wanted to hear was, 'You're in,'" Ripken said during a conference call. "I really didn't get caught up with wanting to be unanimous or wanting to be the most."

    Gwynn received 532 votes for 97.61 percent, the seventh-highest ever, also trailing Ty Cobb, George Brett and Hank Aaron.

    "It's an unbelievable feeling to know that people think that what you did was worthy," Gwynn said. "For me, it's kind of validation. The type of player that I was doesn't get a whole lot of credit in today's game."

    Goose Gossage finished third with 388 votes, falling 21 shy of the necessary 409. His percentage increased from 64.6 to 71.2, putting him in good position to reach the necessary 75 percent next year. The highest percentage for a player who wasn't elected in a later year was 63.4 by Gil Hodges in 1983, his final time on the ballot.

    Jim Rice was fourth with 346, his percentage dropping to 63.5 from 64.8 last year. He was followed by Andre Dawson (309), Bert Blyleven (260), Lee Smith (217) and Jack Morris (202). McGwire was ninth, followed by Tommy John (125) and Steve Garvey (115), who was in his final year of eligibility.

    Ladewski on Mike & Mike
    Paul Ladewski, a columnist for The Daily Southtown, wrote a piece Monday explaining why he submitted a blank ballot for this year's Baseball Hall of Fame voting. Ladewski says he has doubts about anyone who played during the Steroids Era. Cal Ripken Jr. and Tony Gwynn, who were elected for induction Tuesday on their first ballot, fell short of unanimous selection. PodcastInsider

    McGwire's dismal showing raises doubts about whether he will ever get elected -- players can appear on the BBWAA ballot for 15 years -- and whether the shadow of steroids will cost Barry Bonds, Sammy Sosa and Rafael Palmeiro places in Cooperstown.

    McGwire finished with 583 home runs, seventh on the career list, and hit 70 homers in 1998 to set the season record, a mark Bonds broke three years later. Gwynn was surprised McGwire received such a low percentage.

    "I hope that as time goes on, that number will increase," Gwynn said. "I hope that one day he will get into the Hall of Fame, because I really believe he deserves it."

    While Ripken said Gossage and Rice belong in the Hall, he wouldn't give his opinion on McGwire.


    "I don't think it's my place to actually cast judgment," he said.

    Jose Canseco, on the ballot for the first time, received six votes, well below the 5 percent threshold needed to stay on future ballots. In his book two years ago, Canseco accused McGwire and others of using steroids. The book's publication was quickly followed by a congressional hearing on steroids during which McGwire evaded questions, saying: "I'm not here to talk about the past."

    Gwynn, who compiled 3,141 hits and a .338 batting average during his 20-year career with the San Diego Padres, said he was fidgety and nervous before he received the call from Jack O'Connell, the BBWAA secretary-treasurer.

    "I broke down right away," he said. "My wife came over and put an arm around me."

    Ripken played in a major league-record 2,632 consecutive games to break Lou Gehrig's ironman mark of 2,130 and set a new standard for shortstops with 345 home runs (431 for his career) and 3,184 hits.

    "I'm very proud of what the streak represents. Not that you were able to play in all those games, but that you showed up to play every single day," Ripken said last week.

    Harold Baines, who received 29 votes, reached the 5 percent threshold. Bret Saberhagen got seven votes in his first appearance on the ballot and Ken Caminiti, who admitted using steroids during his career and died in 2004, received two.

    Gwynn and Ripken raised to 43 the total of players elected in their first year of eligibility. That doesn't include Lou Gehrig (1939) and Roberto Clemente (1973), who were chosen in special elections.

    Gwynn and Ripken each spent their entire major-league career with one team, a rarity these days. They will be inducted during ceremonies held July 29 at the Hall in Cooperstown, N.Y., along with anyone elected from the Veterans Committee vote, which will be announced Feb. 27.

    Ripken spent 21 seasons with Baltimore, hitting .276. A 19-time All-Star, he won the AL Rookie of the Year award in 1982, the AL MVP award in 1983 and 1991 and was a two-time Gold Glove shortstop.

    Gwynn broke into the majors in 1982 and won eight batting titles to tie Honus Wagner's NL record. He made 15 All-Star teams and won five Gold Gloves as an outfielder.

    Ripken and Gwynn are the fifth pair of players with 3,000 hits to be Hall of Fame classmates. The others are George Brett and Robin Yount (1999), Eddie Collins and Cap Anson (1939), Tris Speaker and Nap Lajoie (1937) and Ty Cobb and Honus Wagner (1936).










    can't believe there still hasn't been a person whose been a unanimous selection. why wouldn't you vote for gwynn or ripken. people who get cute like that should be revealed and their vote taken away in the future.
     
  2. Nick

    Nick Contributing Member

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    I guess Mark doesn't have to "talk about the past."
     
  3. Lil Pun

    Lil Pun Contributing Member

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    Not surprising at all.
     
  4. rrj_gamz

    rrj_gamz Contributing Member

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    No surprise...But what about The Goose...
     
  5. A-Train

    A-Train Contributing Member

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    Forget the steroids, McGwire simply isn't a HOF caliber player, period.

    If Bagwell doesn't get in on the first ballot because of this assclown, I will personally go to his house and shove a can of Andro up his ass...
     
  6. mc mark

    mc mark Contributing Member

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    Reading is fundamental.

    ;)

    Goose Gossage finished third with 388 votes, falling 21 shy of the necessary 409.
     
  7. ima_drummer2k

    ima_drummer2k Contributing Member

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    Gwynn is supposed to be such a likeable guy, blah blah blah, but **** that.

    He once called Biggio a "hot dog" and I, for one, will never forgive him.
     
  8. weslinder

    weslinder Contributing Member

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    Ripken himself talked about this on his XM show. He asked who would vote against Nolan Ryan. He said that somewhere along the way, a player refused to give a baseball writer an interview, and that writer held a grudge. The writer would vote for him if it were close, but just to keep the guy who "wronged him" from being elected unanimously, he'll won't vote for him.
     
  9. Mr. Brightside

    Mr. Brightside Contributing Member

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    I'm glad the Big Cheat didn't make the Hall. He disgraced baseball for all time.
     
  10. The Real Shady

    The Real Shady Contributing Member

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    If it wasn't for steriods McGwire is a HOF caliber player. Any player who hits 583 career HR's off the juice would no doubt make it in.
     
  11. weslinder

    weslinder Contributing Member

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    Look at his other numbers and remember how atrocious he was in the field, how you could count on him to get hurt during a pennant chase, and how his strikeout rate would make Soriano look good. McGwire wasn't a baseball player, he was a sideshow. If you really think he saved baseball, give him a Hollywood Star. Don't put him in the Hall of Fame.
     
  12. The Real Shady

    The Real Shady Contributing Member

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    Every single non-steriod user that's around McGwire in the all-time HR leader board is in the HOF. If you hit over 500 HR's off the juice you automatically go in.



    1. Hank Aaron+ 755 R
    2. Barry Bonds* (41) 734 L
    3. Babe Ruth+* 714 L
    4. Willie Mays+ 660 R
    5. Sammy Sosa (37) 588 R
    6. Frank Robinson+ 586 R
    7. Mark McGwire 583 R
    8. Harmon Killebrew+ 573 R
    9. Rafael Palmeiro* (41) 569 L
    10. Ken Griffey* (36) 563 L
    Reggie Jackson+* 563 L
    12. Mike Schmidt+ 548 R
    13. Mickey Mantle+# 536 B
    14. Jimmie Foxx+ 534 R
    15. Willie McCovey+* 521 L
    Ted Williams+* 521 L
    17. Ernie Banks+ 512


    Also, Eddie Murrey is in the HOF and his career stats compared to McGwire.

    Eddie Murrey
    BA .287
    OBP .359
    SLG .476
    HR 504

    Mark McGwire
    BA .263
    OBP .394
    SLG .588
    HR 583
     
    #12 The Real Shady, Jan 9, 2007
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2007
  13. weslinder

    weslinder Contributing Member

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    Every single one of those players were much better all-around than Mark McGwire.
     
  14. ima_drummer2k

    ima_drummer2k Contributing Member

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    You KNOW that goes on more often than not.

    I can think of a local sportswriter here in Houston who shall remain nameless * JOHN MCCLAIN * who thinks just because he has a HOF vote, he's bigger than the game. This nameless sportswriter * JOHN MCCLAIN * holds grudges against players/coaches who he perceives as someone who 'dissed' him in the past. Perfect example is Brian Billick, who he refers to as a "jerk and a punk". Brian probably made the mistake of not kissing this nameless sportswriter's * JOHN MCCLAIN * ass when he tried to interveiw him.

    Most sportswriters are just frustrated jocks who are jealous of the athletes they cover. :rolleyes:
     
  15. Manny Ramirez

    Manny Ramirez The Music Man

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    Didn't Eddie Murray have over 3,000 career hits while McGwire does not?
     
  16. SamFisher

    SamFisher Contributing Member

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    No, it's pretty obvious that Billick is a jerk and I've thought that for years without knowing anything McClain said about him. Go back and watch the HBO series they did on the Ravens the year after they won the super bowl. Talk about arrogant.....and that's just the tip of the ice berg. The guy has been an ass-clown since day 1 so it's not surprising to me though that others would think that.

    I like John McClain and he is very well respected among NFL writers apparently.

    PS if you don't believe me about Billick, have a look at his myspace page.

    http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendID=60492784
    Jerk jerk jerk
     
    #16 SamFisher, Jan 9, 2007
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2007
  17. ima_drummer2k

    ima_drummer2k Contributing Member

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    And he will be the first one to tell you that. All the time.

    Truth is, I like his writing too. But some of these sportswriters really do think they're bigger than the game itself. Often times they try to insert themselves into the story. When McClain comes on the radio, he name drops, brags about who he used to cover, brags about having a HOF vote and who he voted for and didn't vote for etc. It just gets annoying after a while.

    And (getting back to the thread) I don't doubt for a minute that there are biased HOF voters who hold grudges against certain athletes because of something personal.

    I'll have to check that myspace page when I get home....
     
  18. VesceySux

    VesceySux Contributing Member

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    The talking heads on ESPN said today that there are sportswriters out there who will not vote for ANYONE who played during the "Steroid Era", no matter how impressive their resume is. How f***ing stupid is that?
     
  19. DaDakota

    DaDakota If you want to know, just ask!

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    Was Bonds on the ballot?
     
  20. BigM

    BigM Contributing Member

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    yeah i've heard this excuse before, still don't like it. obviously some guys simply don't need everyones vote but for something as "important" as this, don't put yourself above it. it's not about you, it's about the player and what he did on the field.
     

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