Great Simmons Article - "One man out...."

Major · Jul 25, 2007

The Ming Dynasty said:

Two words - INSTANT REPLAY.
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In the NFL, all ref judgment calls can't be reviewed - things like pass interference, holding, etc. The only things that can be reviewed are "yes/no" things - was a guy's foot inbounds, did a ball hit the ground, things like that.

In the NBA, the vast majority of calls (probably 95%+) are judgment calls. The number of things that would be reviewable would be minute - not even worth having a system for. How do you, on instant replay, conclusively determine whether there was enough body contact for a foul?

The only place where it might be really helpful is the silly charge/block circle - is that really worth having a challenge system and delaying games for?

The Ming Dynasty · Jul 25, 2007

Major said:

In the NFL, all ref judgment calls can't be reviewed - things like pass interference, holding, etc. The only things that can be reviewed are "yes/no" things - was a guy's foot inbounds, did a ball hit the ground, things like that.

In the NBA, the vast majority of calls (probably 95%+) are judgment calls. The number of things that would be reviewable would be minute - not even worth having a system for. How do you, on instant replay, conclusively determine whether there was enough body contact for a foul?

The only place where it might be really helpful is the silly charge/block circle - is that really worth having a challenge system and delaying games for?
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Finley was out of bounds! Should that not have been reviewed and reversed?

A_3PO · Jul 25, 2007

blathersby said:

I don't think anyone ACTUALLY believes (okay, well, scratch that) Stern had anything to do with this. It was a rogue individual or group of individuals working for an organized crime family. No one believes Stern was sitting behind a desk laughing maniacally as this was going down.
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That wasn't the point. During the Spurs/Suns series, someone (I think in this forum) said Stern and the refs wanted to Suns to win the series because they were the more glamorous team, or something to that effect. I kid you not. Nutty as it sounds they were dead serious about it.

Nobody has claimed Stern was involved with what actually transpired.

Major · Jul 26, 2007

The Ming Dynasty said:

Finley was out of bounds! Should that not have been reviewed and reversed?
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Certainly - but how often do things like that really occur? Once every 10, 20, 30 games? Is it worth setting up a system and having coaches challenges or what not for something that's so rare?

SuperS32 · Jul 26, 2007

pgabriel said:

I wouldn't say by much, officials have the ability to over rule other officials.

admitedly not reading the entire column, one other thing I have to disagree with is that an official in basketball more than any other sport has the ability to affect the outcome of a game. I would argue that a home plate umpire has the most power of any official in any of the three major sports with the strike zone, which at times can cause contreversy. but no one says baseball has an umpire issue in the public's eyes, which it doesn't.

I don't know what the nba can do about its perception in the public as a poorly officiated game, and this incident doesn't help. but it has to do something with its public image, i really don't think nba officiating can be improved. they're in a no win situation. for instance, they followed the letter of the law in the spurs/suns series, but they still get accused of fixing the series which is ridiculous, because if its any team in the entire league that the nba wants in the finals its phoenix.

but nba officiating isn't going to change, the athletes are too big and too fast to accurately call the game. foul calls are inherently subjective and will always will be. the nba is going to have to get it through to the public that's just the nature of the beast. just balls and strikes. there is a set definition but actual judgement is an entirely different issue.
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Baseball used to have a BIG problem just five or 10 years ago with strike zones (i.e. the mammoth Glavine strike zone, veteran pitchers getting more calls, the Livan Hernandez game in '97 etc. ). It seemed like young pitchers could never break through until they "earned" the respect of umps.

Then came the standardized strike zone, and now a lot of those issues are gone. You see young pitchers dominating without having to "ear" anything from umps. Of course there will still be bad games or bad umps, but it's not nearly as bad.

Unfortunately the NBA is a lot harder to standardize. In any case Stern better get their act together - quick. If I were an NBA player and nothing significant was done about this, what would stop me from simply packing my bags and playing in Europe or something?

OrangeRowdy95 · Jul 29, 2007

This deserves it's own thread:

http://www.nba.com/timberwolves/news/thanks_mad_dog.html
Thread title: Mark Madsen: Decent Athlete, Terrific Person

Thanks, Mad Dog

July 25, 2007

That Mark Madsen does a great deal of work in the community is no secret around Target Center. But during one of his basketball camps, Madsen displayed his character to such an extent that we thought you should read about it.

Following is a letter Wolves youth basketball coordinator Todd Landrum -- who coaches with Madsen at his camps -- received from Nancy and Duane Martinz, whose two sons attended Mad Dog's camp in Eden Prairie two weeks ago.

Dear Coach Todd,

On July 9th through the 13th, 2007 our two sons Cody (13) and Blake (8) attended the Mark (Mad Dog) Madsen, Timberwolves Basketball Camp in Eden Prairie Minnesota. This camp was wonderful! Mark incorporates education, nutrition, fair play along with building skills. Mark and his coaches were friendly and professional and just fun to watch how they worked with all the campers. During the second day of camp Cody and Blake asked me if they could attend Marks camp again next summer.

I had an opportunity to talk with Mark a few times. He was very impressed with both our boys and stated to me that he thought they were very good basketball players, they were polite, had positive attitudes and they hustled.

Mark went on to talk about Cody and told me that Cody was an incredible ball player. He also told me Cody was quick, had a fantastic shot, and he really liked how Cody would push the ball up the floor on every possession. He told me Cody reminded him of Ricky Davis.

When Cody was 4 years old he was diagnosed with a hearing loss. Since that day he has worn wrap around hearing aids. Mark approached me on the 4th day of camp and started asking me some questions about Cody's hearing. We talked for a few minuets about Cody and then Mark went on about coaching the camp. Just before noon Mark came up to me and said that he would like to do something for Cody. He asked if we would be interested in going to Starkey. He explained that this was a company that made state of the art hearing aids. These hearing aids were fitted to go inside the ear. I explained to Mark that we could not afford those kinds of hearing aids. Mark said it would be no expense to us. He said he wanted to see if they would work for Cody and if we did not like them there would be no obligation for us to do this. I talked it over with Cody and he said he would like to try these new hearing aids. I told Mark that we would meet him after camp was finished for the day. I asked him why would you want to do this? He told me that he was so impressed with Cody's athletic ability and that he was such a good kid that he wanted to do something for him.

After camp was over for the day we followed Mark to Starkey and he introduced us to Heather. Heather took us inside and they took Cody right away into a sound booth. They did a hearing test and them Mark introduced us to Mr. Bill Austin. Mr. Austin personally made the molds for Cody's new hearing aids. Mr. Austin checked on Cody's progress several times while we were there. His entire staff was wonderful. With in two hours Cody had state of the art hearing aids. I could not believe what Mark had done for Cody. When we left the building I had tears in my eyes. What a wonderful person Mark Madsen is to want to do something for a kid that he had just met three days earlier.

We often hear about how professional athletes get into trouble. But when they do great deeds for others you very rarely hear about them. I wanted to let you know what a wonderful person you have on your team. I wanted Mark to get the recognition that he deserves. The Timberwolves organization and the NBA should be very proud of someone like Mark, what an asset to the team not only as a great player but as a great person. Someone who is so passionate about what he does and what he believes. He walks the walk and talks the talk.

Thank you for your time.

Sincerely,

Nancy and Duane Martinz
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Great Simmons Article - "One man out...."

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