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Gore's speech

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by Faos, May 27, 2004.

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  1. rimrocker

    rimrocker Member

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    Wow! This afternoon, I rejoined the world after a few days in the woods and just read Gore's speech. That was a great speech (or at least it reads like one). I need to digest it a bit more, but in response to Jeff excellant post, Gore answers and points out something that ticks me off just as much as our wasted post-9/11 opportunities... this administration has destroyed the hard work of generations of real Republicans and Democrats over the last century... What happens on November 2 will decide if this is an interregnum or the new norm. I pray for the former.
    _________

    Gore:

    To begin with, from its earliest days in power, this administration sought to radically destroy the foreign policy consensus that had guided America since the end of World War II. The long successful strategy of containment was abandoned in favor of the new strategy of "preemption." And what they meant by preemption was not the inherent right of any nation to act preemptively against an imminent threat to its national security, but rather an exotic new approach that asserted a unique and unilateral U.S. right to ignore international law wherever it wished to do so and take military action against any nation, even in circumstances where there was no imminent threat. All that is required, in the view of Bush's team is the mere assertion of a possible, future threat - and the assertion need be made by only one person, the President.

    More disturbing still was their frequent use of the word "dominance" to describe their strategic goal, because an American policy of dominance is as repugnant to the rest of the world as the ugly dominance of the helpless, naked Iraqi prisoners has been to the American people. Dominance is as dominance does.

    Dominance is not really a strategic policy or political philosophy at all. It is a seductive illusion that tempts the powerful to satiate their hunger for more power still by striking a Faustian bargain. And as always happens - sooner or later - to those who shake hands with the devil, they find out too late that what they have given up in the bargain is their soul.
     
  2. rimrocker

    rimrocker Member

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    Gore:

    What happened at the prison, it is now clear, was not the result of random acts by "a few bad apples," it was the natural consequence of the Bush Administration policy that has dismantled those wise constraints and has made war on America's checks and balances.

    The abuse of the prisoners at Abu Ghraib flowed directly from the abuse of the truth that characterized the Administration's march to war and the abuse of the trust that had been placed in President Bush by the American people in the aftermath of September 11th.

    There was then, there is now and there would have been regardless of what Bush did, a threat of terrorism that we would have to deal with. But instead of making it better, he has made it infinitely worse. We are less safe because of his policies. He has created more anger and righteous indignation against us as Americans than any leader of our country in the 228 years of our existence as a nation -- because of his attitude of contempt for any person, institution or nation who disagrees with him.

    He has exposed Americans abroad and Americans in every U.S. town and city to a greater danger of attack by terrorists because of his arrogance, willfulness, and bungling at stirring up hornet's nests that pose no threat whatsoever to us. And by then insulting the religion and culture and tradition of people in other countries. And by pursuing policies that have resulted in the deaths of thousands of innocent men, women and children, all of it done in our name.

    President Bush said in his speech Monday night that the war in Iraq is "the central front in the war on terror." It's not the central front in the war on terror, but it has unfortunately become the central recruiting office for terrorists. [Dick Cheney said, "This war may last the rest of our lives.] The unpleasant truth is that President Bush's utter incompetence has made the world a far more dangerous place and dramatically increased the threat of terrorism against the United States. Just yesterday, the International Institute of Strategic Studies reported that the Iraq conflict " has arguable focused the energies and resources of Al Qaeda and its followers while diluting those of the global counterterrorism coalition." The ISS said that in the wake of the war in Iraq Al Qaeda now has more than 18,000 potential terrorists scattered around the world and the war in Iraq is swelling its ranks.

    ___________

    We'll pay for Iraq for generations.

    In the beginning of the speech, Gore compares Bush to Nixon, but Nixon's looking pretty damn good right now... The decision to invade Iraq was so stupendously bad I don't believe there is any decision in our history that has caused us more geopolitical damage.
     
  3. rimrocker

    rimrocker Member

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    Gore:

    These policies were designed and insisted upon by the Bush White House. Indeed, the President's own legal counsel advised him specifically on the subject. His secretary of defense and his assistants pushed these cruel departures from historic American standards over the objections of the uniformed military, just as the Judge Advocates General within the Defense Department were so upset and opposed that they took the unprecedented step of seeking help from a private lawyer in this city who specializes in human rights and said to him, "There is a calculated effort to create an atmosphere of legal ambiguity" where the mistreatment of prisoners is concerned."

    Indeed, the secrecy of the program indicates an understanding that the regular military culture and mores would not support these activities and neither would the American public or the world community. Another implicit acknowledgement of violations of accepted standards of behavior is the process of farming out prisoners to countries less averse to torture and giving assignments to private contractors.

    ______________

    This administration has destroyed a century of foreign policy, betrayed our founders, and corrupted our military. Trifecta!
     
  4. rimrocker

    rimrocker Member

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    Gore:

    These horrors were the predictable consequence of policy choices that flowed directly from this administration's contempt for the rule of law. And the dominance they have been seeking is truly not simply unworthy of America - it is also an illusory goal in its own right.

    Our world is unconquerable because the human spirit is unconquerable, and any national strategy based on pursuing the goal of domination is doomed to fail because it generates its own opposition, and in the process, creates enemies for the would-be dominator.

    A policy based on domination of the rest of the world not only creates enemies for the United States and creates recruits for Al Qaeda, it also undermines the international cooperation that is essential to defeating the efforts of terrorists who wish harm and intimidate Americans.

    _________________

    Didn't anyone in this administration read Jefferson? Or C. Vann Woodward? Or... nevermind. sigh.
     
  5. SamFisher

    SamFisher Member

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    If you get a chance RR you should watch the video highlights on moveon.org.

    This speech and the fantastic one on the environment from a few months back are his two best ever by far, and two of the best ones I've ever seen, period.

    Where the hell was this guy in 2000?:confused:
     
  6. MacBeth

    MacBeth Member

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    That's what I want to know. Maybe he's a guy who operates better when not under pressure.
     
  7. SamFisher

    SamFisher Member

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    Possibly, but I think it seems more like something inside him just sort of snapped under the weight of the pent up anger and frustration from the debacle of the 2k election combined with his semi-retirement from being a public servant.

    Rather than repressing and corralling his emotions in public as he has done for 20 years to before he is very openly airing them, and looks a lot better for it.
     
    #127 SamFisher, May 27, 2004
    Last edited: May 27, 2004
  8. rimrocker

    rimrocker Member

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    Gore:

    In December of 2000, even though I strongly disagreed with the decision by the U.S. Supreme Court to order a halt to the counting of legally cast ballots, I saw it as my duty to reaffirm my own strong belief that we are a nation of laws and not only accept the decision, but do what I could to prevent efforts to delegitimize George Bush as he took the oath of office as president.

    I did not at that moment imagine that Bush would, in the presidency that ensued, demonstrate utter contempt for the rule of law and work at every turn to frustrate accountability...

    So today, I want to speak on behalf of those Americans who feel that President Bush has betrayed our nation's trust, those who are horrified at what has been done in our name, and all those who want the rest of the world to know that we Americans see the abuses that occurred in the prisons of Iraq, Afghanistan, Guantanamo and secret locations as yet undisclosed as completely out of keeping with the character and basic nature of the American people and at odds with the principles on which America stands.

    I believe we have a duty to hold President Bush accountable - and I believe we will. As Lincoln said at our time of greatest trial, "We - even we here - hold the power, and bear the responsibility."
    _______________

    I have a foreboding image of suspended elections in the name of safety. I'm greatly bothered by the lack of outrage in the Republican Party... certainly in contrast to the Nixon era... but then again, the current Republican Party is not really run by Republicans anymore. I'm deeply troubled by the seemingly large percentage that countenance the Bush approach.

    Then I read the words of Gore and Lincoln and thank God they are Americans. I'm not a chicken little, but I am convinced the days between now and November 2 will determine if my kids grow up with the idea of America or just in a country named America.
     
  9. rimrocker

    rimrocker Member

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    I think he was there all along, we just didn't look hard enough through the smoke machine.

    And regarding pressure, I think everyone who cherishes this country is currently under immense pressure and Gore probably feels that more than most because of what happened in 2000.

    Even if Kerry wins, the pressure does not recede because we've got to try and fix what has happened under this administration and that's going to take years, if not generations.
     
  10. MacBeth

    MacBeth Member

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    Knowing what we now do, I'd much rather have Gore than Kerry.
     
  11. Faos

    Faos Member

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    I wonder if Tennessean's would vote for Gore over Kerry?
     
  12. Faos

    Faos Member

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    Why? Because he screamed like Jesse Jackson? You preferred Howard Dean over Kerry I'm guessing?

    You are speaking of Gore, the same guy who thinks the movie The Day After Tomorrow is a documentary.
     
  13. Faos

    Faos Member

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    The shame is coming from those, like Gore, who are trying to tear down Bush at this crucial moment in time for political reasons. I, too, felt sick from 9/11. The difference is I STILL feel sick about it and want the war on terrorism to continue. The left is more concerned about the war on Bush and that makes me sick.

    There are those who again will say we went to Iraq for the wrong reasons. You know what? We are already there, so it's what we continue to do from here that matters now. And tearing down the moral of the country with the constant attacks like Gore isn't the answer. Moveon.org? Gore needs to move on.
     
  14. SamFisher

    SamFisher Member

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    Faos, if I tell you one more time that you seem to contribute neither intellectual value nor local color even by the low standards of D&D, will you stop flamebaiting for a bit?
     
  15. Zac D

    Zac D Member

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    Why does Bush get a free pass after (arguably) going into Iraq for the "wrong reasons"? Leaders who make poor decisions pay for those decisions; it's illogical to say that because George W. Bush led us into a bad situation, we must throw our support behind him so that he can lead us out of it. Herbert Hoover led the country into the Great Depression and was tossed out of office at the first opportunity, even though we were "already there." That's far from a perfect analogy, but it's not entirely wrong, either.
     
  16. Deckard

    Deckard Blade Runner
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    Don't go usin' logic, Zac D... what's wrong with you??
     
  17. giddyup

    giddyup Member

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    You call this "well-reasoned?" This is just mud-slinging.
     
  18. giddyup

    giddyup Member

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    No one needs your judgementalism. Cool it.
     
  19. Batman Jones

    Batman Jones Member

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    Weird. Last week giddyup was pitching Major and mrpaige as moderators and this week he's one himself. Bright side, at least he doesn't lock threads whenever he gets bored with them and then tickle himself locking threads that ask why the thread was locked. Then again, I don't think giddy's capable of getting bored with a thread. He tends to outlast us all that way.
     
  20. giddyup

    giddyup Member

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    Wrong. If I was the moderator, I might have taken stronger action.... but I wouldn't ban quickly! Hey, someone's gotta do it.
     
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