I hope there is good news on the available SGs(no, not Gilbert or Javarris). In dire need of a true SG. Not Battier, not Ariza. Not sure Budinger is one but you can *I think* get by with him unlike Battriza.
As expected, the bi-polar poster strikes again and stabs people in the back :grin: . I'm good though because at least I know where Deckard,BimaThug, and Rv6 disagree, but the man with 1m replies is another story. So let me start over and maybe the old poster can follow if he doesn't have t-mac-itis. If the rockets think Iggy is good enough to help this team win a ring withing the next 3-5 yrs, then they are going to have to take on dalembert's contract or brand to get that guy. They will also face the realization with the tax threshold that it will cost the team scola and probably lowry this summer. Lets use the number Bima thug put out about the salary cap being around 54m and the lt being about 64m. Lets use those number for arguments sake and see what we can come up with in this deal. Lets say they decided to make the iggy and sam for mcgrady,taylor,and dorsey deal. I don't want to upset Deckard too much,so i will leave scola out of the deal till summer.The rockets payroll will look something like this: Iggy-12.35 Dalembert-14m Yao-17.6m Ariza-6.3m Battier-7.35m Landry-3m Andersen-2.5m Hayes(to)2.3m Brooks-2.0m Chase-787k Lowry cap hold-6m Scola cap hold-6m total salaries for 2010=79m which is 15m over the lux tax. Lets say a team offers scola 6.5m which is likely given his production and durability. Another team offers lowry 3.5 which is likely. If the rockets let those 2 walk because brooks and landry are due raises to about 7m a piece in the following summer, now the rockets are at 67m which is still about 3m overthe estimated lux tax of 64m. Trading Shane's 7.3m contract for a te would drop the rox to a little more than 69m. From there, they could add a couple of young players to develop or some mid range vets. A starting 5 of Brooks,Iggy,Ariza,Landry,and Yao with chase,dalmebert,anderson,and hayes looks pretty good. Throw in a guy like CJ watson for 1.5m or conroy for minimum, getting a guy like Joel Anthony or Mbenga for 1.5m and sign them to 3 yr deals in case you get a chance to deal dalambert and his expiring. In other words, after the top 9 players listed, the rockets could use 4m to fill the roster out. Those last players will be minimum players or slightly above the vet min of 1.2 in which the league pays half akmost half of it anyways. In 2011 if yao shows recovery and is at least a good player and brooks and landry are progressing like they are right now, then those 2 will get bumps to about 6-7m each and the rockets could work to drop Yao's salary to 12m and dalemberts contract is gone all together. So the 12m of dalemberts contract has been basically split to brooks(2m to 7m) and landry (3m to 7m) along with yao dropping from 17m to 12 would save the team 9m. I know that sounds like a lot of surgery, but thats how it would work. I'm not saying it will or the rockets will do it, but if they think iggy is the type of guy to add to this team with his age,production,and growth, then thats what it will cost the rockets. On the other hand as bimathung has pointed out, they could let the contract expire and have about 7m for a free agent. 7m per got the pistons Charlie V. Maybe the managment will look at thow the team is playing now and expect better results when yao comes back next, who knows. I just think people expecting the rockets to get iggy for mcgrady's contract is foolish.
Brand isnt done, he's just older, slower and decent instead of elite. But getting Brand would be like trading for Jermaine O'Neal and signing him to a 3 year $55 million dollar contract extension in the offseason.
All ASSUMING they don't turn around and trade Dalambert right away for another expiring contract etc.... Or that this would be the last trade Morey makes......come on....he is about 5 moves ahead of you and me. And I was not stabbing you in the back, you love the athletic types, so much so that you ignore production from the unathletic types like Scola and Battier. DD
Hey backstabber, the rockets can hold on to sam for next year or even this year try to involve a team like portland as a 3 rd team since they really want someone in the middle. A team like sacramento with the expiring contract of kt and sar might be attractive enough, but it will eat into their cap space this offseason so i doubt they would do it. The easiest trade would probably be butler because his contract is easier to digest for the rockets. He's not as good as iggy, but for 2 yrs and retaining scola and lowry might be worth it.
It has nothing to do with liking or not liking athletic types of players as it is looking beyond this season. Battier and production shouldn't be used in the same sentence btw. Scola, i can give you that one. So Dd, let me ask you a question or even a couple of questions. When the nuggetts dumped camby, who was the better player between he and battier? Once you answer that honstly if thats possible for you in this case, if it came down to keeping landry or keeping scola, which do you choose?
LOL at the backstabber....bit....hehehehe. I am not sure they are going to keep Scola or Lowry, DM might renounce them, heck he might do anything if he thinks it will make the team better. I think Scola and Lowry have a better chance of being here if they trade Tmac, because if they let him expire, they might renounce and join the max player chase for Bosh etc. Can't compare Battier to Camby they play different positions.....they both have value...Camby as a shot blocking C/pF....and Battier as an elite defensive wing, who is a 3ball shooter..... Man, if it came to Landry and Scola, I just don't know....I mean Landry is younger, and a better scorer, but he is not great on defense at all, and doesn't rebound all that well for a PF. Scola is a smarter player, better defender and better rebounder..... The only thing that would sway it more toward Landry would be his age, but I think Scola is equally or more productive when you factor in rebounding and defense. DD
Unfortunately, the Wizards are putting a hold on all trade talks while the whole Arenas situation is dealt with. If they are able to void is behemoth-sized contract and part with him forever, they really don't need to trade Caron or Jamison. Bad news for us basically. Anyway, as far as Iggy goes, I'm a bit skeptical. While I was perusing the various Sixers boards, they are quite enthused about parting with Andre, and that is very troubling. A lot of people on this board think Iggy is terrific player, but I'm not sure how many of us have actually seen him play extensively. Call it questionable, but I usually get a grasp of what a player's value is based on what other team's fans value the player as. For instance, we, on this board, absolutely love Lowry. We see him as a perfect back-up pointguard. However, fans of other teams see him as a throw in, a temporary fill to a void at the point guard position. But we see him as much more. Anyway, back to the Sixers boards. They don't really seem to care much about packaging him with Sam to net McGrady + fillers. To me, that's a bad sign. Sure they say things like, "he's a pretty good player", but they also say, "he's way overpaid, almost to the extent that Brand is overpaid for his contributions" or "he had his chance here in Philly, he can't help us anymore". But I guess we might as well get some sort of value for McGrady. So red rover, red rover, let Iggy come over.
Funny how everyone keeps counting Yao into all of these line ups and I think Morey is looking at building a team without Yao. I can actually see Morey putting a lot of pieces together without Yao in the future... 1. No one knows what condition Yao will be in when he comes back. 2. So was Adelman just talking about Tracy when he said I need to find a way to fit in the line up. 3. This team is made for speed and passing the ball around... Yao's game is very similar to Tracy in the fact that the ball stops with him... 4. There are a lot more variables to consider that I have yet to mention. I see Morey looking at this move with Tracy with more than a revenge or simple trade... I see this as a position trade to ensure that he can sign the players that he has such as Landry, Brooks and etc for the future.... I can also see him letting Yao go.... Morey is a numbers man and he knows he can't tie his entire stock into one player and especially one that is not giving you a lot on return. I also see a lot of other GM's looking at what Morey has accomplished which in turn could make things real interesting for NBA players.
leebigez, although your numbers are a little rough (and I would have liked it if you could have broken down your analysis into more than one congested paragraph), you make some very salient points. I fully understand where you are coming from and your reasoning. That said, I seriously doubt that Daryl Morey shares your views. Based on my calculations, if the Rockets traded T-Mac for Iguodala and Dalembert, the Rockets would have 10 players (including Landry, whose $3M team option is a no-brainer to be picked up) under guaranteed contracts for a total team salary of about $67.06M. This amount WILL be above next year's luxury tax threshold. At this point, Les Alexander will be paying about $3-4M or so in luxury tax. And this is all BEFORE counting the team option for Chuck Hayes or the cap holds for Luis Scola or Kyle Lowry. And I just don't see Les Alexander paying the $15-20M in luxury taxes it would take to keep the rest of the core together. So, in essence, for the long term, the REAL trade would amount to the following: McGrady, Scola, Lowry and Hayes for Iguodala and Dalembert No, thanks. Also, lebigeez, you casually toss out the notion of trading Shane Battier's $7.4M salary for a trade exception. Yeah, because that would be so easy to accomplish and should be naturally assumed could be accomplished by the Rockets. It's not so easy, my friend. Teams don't often get to dump salary this way. Look at what it took the Jazz to get OKC to take Matt Harpring's (mostly covered by insurance) expiring contract. It cost them a promising first rounder (Maynor). Well, Shane's salary is larger and isn't covered by insurance. I know you would say that plenty of contenders would want to add a Battier to their roster. Unfortunately, most contenders don't have the cap room or trade exceptions large enough to absorb Shane's salary. And any team possessing either cap room or trade exceptions probably isn't in the market for a 32-year-old wing player. Basically, that's not so easy a task to just ASSUME can be achieved. And Morey probably understands this fact better than either of us. Now, let's say that Morey refuses to take on Dalembert's contract (or Brand's), and Philly balks at any Iguodala trade. Instead, the Rockets just let McGrady's contract expire after the season. Now, the Rockets' total team salary (excluding Dorsey but including Hayes and the team's first rounder) is about $44.27M, meaning the Rockets could have about $8-11M in cap room (depending on where the cap is set next year) to pursue free agents IN LIEU OF KEEPING SCOLA AND LOWRY. If you include the cap holds for Scola and Lowry, that number goes up to about $57.14M, in which case the Rockets could opt to use their salary cap exceptions (MLE, LLE) instead of their cap room. Going back to the $44.27M figure, and assuming a luxury tax of about $64M or so, that would give the Rockets about $20M to re-sign Scola and Lowry and to use the MLE and/or LLE. Let's say that Morey is able to leverage restricted free agency into starting salaries of $6M for Scola and $3.5M for Lowry. That leaves about $10.5M under the luxury tax for the team to utilize its salary cap exceptions. Since the Rockets don't expect to have any second rounders this season (the pick belongs to the T-Wolves; the Rockets actually have their first rounder this season; they have enough young guys with Budinger, Taylor and the 2010 first rounder), Morey won't feel compelled to reserve a portion of the MLE to sign a second round pick to a longer term deal. This means that, if Les is willing to pull the trigger, the Rockets can offer the full MLE to a second- or third-tier free agent who falls through the cracks and misses out on bigger money elsewhere. With league revenues (which are the basis for determining the MLE) are expected to drop 5-7% this year, expect the MLE to be somewhere in the range of $5.5M. This leaves a full $5M of flexibility below the luxury tax threshold with which to work. Morey could use the LLE (which will be $2.08M) on a "best available player" come September 2010. The Rockets would then STILL be about $3M or so below the tax threshold, meaning that they could take on $3M in extra salary via trade (assuming salaries could otherwise match within 125% +$100k) around the deadline from teams desperate to dump salary. Who knows? Maybe Morey uses that $3M in flexibility to pick up another "asset". So, to sum up, as I see it, the Rockets have two options if an Iguodala/Dalembert package is Philly's final offer (and no other T-Mac trades are on the table): Option #1: Make the deal, get Iguodala and Dalembert, and say goodbye to Hayes, Scola and Lowry. Option #2: Say no, let T-Mac's deal expire, and end up with the following: Chuck Hayes (team option picked up) Luis Scola (re-signed) Kyle Lowry (re-signed) MLE free agent(s) LLE free agent ~$3M of flexibility below the luxury tax threshold to use in trades I don't know about the rest of you, but my money is on Morey preferring Option #2.
would anyone trade T-Mac with Landry for (Wizards) Caron Bulter and Jamison?? or the Iggy one is better?
In most cases, I'd agree with you on the 'what fan's are saying' point of view. But we're talking about Philly Fans...arguably THE most critical fans in sports. I think Iggy would reach his full potential playing in Adelman's system.
All of the talks to trade Landry is just crazy to me.... A player like Landry doesn't come around too often and i'm not just atalking about the atheliticism that he has.. I'm speaking more of the fire, energy and do what ever it takes attitude that he has... That's what made Barkley, Malone, Worthy and other Great Power Forwards so spectacular.. That unteachable characteristic to do what ever it takes to win a game. That is something you just can't teach. T_Man
Curse you Bima. Curse your logic too! Now my dreams of trading McGrady are crushed seeing that we really can't take on any big contracts if we hope to retain Lowry and Scola.
I love how people seem to think that there can be only one trade. :grin: Like there won't be additional moves to get under the cap....nope, once there is a trade tha is it. DD
Well doesn't Dalembert expire next year? It's not THAT hopeless. We can still get scola, maybe lowry too.
you cant be sure there will be more either, especially with the deadline approaching, morey may not finalize the first trade until much later, maybe not even until the deadline, maybe he wont pull the trigger on a first at all because it comes so late that he doesnt have time for a second one...
I can see it now: Iggy/Dalembert for Mac Then Dalembert/Cook power combo to Portland's newly created Not Enough Players Exception
