m_cable, I speculate that a deal with Charlotte could be a straight-up trade outside of the expansion draft. Since Charlotte is not over the cap, they can take on Steve's contract and another's without having to send anything back (other than the #4 pick). I imagine, however, that we would leave the large contract in question unprotected and then make the Steve-for-pick trade later. Doc Rocket, do you have any sense of what-size contract the Bobcats might take on? Taylor? Weatherspoon? Cato?
Last time Rose played PG extensively, he averaged 6 assists and 2.9 TO's, which is better than Steve has ever averaged. Not saying he should play the Point, just saying he's as capable as Steve.
MacBeth, how's Rose as a set shooter? Steve's problem is that he can't catch and shoot; if Rose is the same way, we still have the same problems. Aside: Steve and Jalen have identical AST:TO ratios. Hmmmm...
Marshall always reminded me of a much harder working Carlos Rogers. He's always productive, I don't see how you can call him garbage. So why does the guy move around so much?
I don't know if Charlotte would take Steve and another contract. Steve makes around 11M, and the other contract wo9uld probably be MoT or Cato, so that's another 9M. So you're saying Charlotte will allow Steve Francis and Mo Taylor or Kelvin Cato to occupy 2/3rds of their cap? Unless they have a seperate deal for Cato or MoT in place, in which they recieve a few good players, or maybe Antoine Walker for Cato, then I don't see it happening.
Looks like we are moving into a "rebuilding" stage, if this is the kind of deals they are looking at. Obviously Rose won't push us over the top. But the plus is he has only 2 years left on his contract. So we pick up a nice draft pick this year, then we either trade Rose next year or play the free agent market after his contract is done.
Maybe we're gearing up for improving steadily over 2 years, while having all our big contracts expire in 2 years? Cato, Mobley and Rose expiring would give us a TON of capsapce in 2 years. Similar to the Spurs plan basically.
Rose's contract is one year longer than Cat's and Cato's. Getting out of Steve's contract does give us more flexibility.
Okay, that makes sense. We trade Steve for the #4 on draft day, and then the Bobcats agree to take either Mo, Cato in the expansion draft. So with this deal, unless we can parlay the #4 to get a proven player, the Rox would practically be rebuilding. Sigh. Some tough decisions are coming this summer for management.
Rose is a good but not great set shooter. What increases his ability in this regard is that he usually is very adept at making the correct decision about when to shoot, and when to pull it down and drive/pass. People are foregtting that, not long ago, this guy was probably the best all around player on a serious championship contender. I will give as accurate an assesement of him as possible: Strengths: Instincts for the game. Simply has that feel that is hard to define but immeditately evident when you see him play. Excellent scorer, in a variety of ways. When he last played with a legit 5, he excelled and had years of numbers like 21-24 ppg, 4-6 assts/rebs, very like Steve at his best numerically. Is incredibly versatile; can be a point, an all around 2, a scoring 2, a point 3 or a scoring 3. Has better pure point instincts than Steve, and great ballhandling for his size. Finds a way to get the ball in the basket, driving, shooting, passing, whatever. In the right situation, is a real vocal leader who will make the tough statements. Shows up big at clutch time, and lives and dies with each win or loss. Hates to lose. Bought into the defensive system, and was rarely a problem on that end, and came up with key steals etc. at big times. In Toronto demonstrated a real willingness to defer to a legit star, and to emphasize team play. Excellent in the community. Weaknesses Can get too aggressive, trying to force things that aren't there on occassion. Can get caught up with the refs. In Chicago, it was said that he baulked at defering to Chandler and Curry, as he was their best player, and felt that he shouldn't defer to a lesser one. Over his career he has earned a rep as an offense first player. While he has superior pure pg instincts than Francis, isn't ideally suited to running an offense that depends on the point to set everything up. Has a pretty hefty contract.
They better make sure they get some good value for him. At least Ray Allen. Don't let JVG destroy this team without getting proper value back.
I can't believe its only been a week into the offseason and insanity has taken over already. Ya'll are talking about trading a top 5 PG in SF, a very servicable C (probably the best backup for YM), and a #15 pick who seems to be coming around. For Rose (a guy who hasn't won since Indy, has had attitude issues, Marshall, a PF that would get completely dominated in the west. MoPete and Gordan would be nice additions, but not for SF and Cato. UNLESS WE GET A SUPERSTAR IN RETURN, WE SHOULDN'T TOUCH SF, PERIOD. There are ways of improving the Rox a lot better w/o having to move major pieces. For intance: 1. Trade Cat for Harrington straight up, I think Indy would bite. 2. Trade MoT/2nd round pick for Rashard Lewis. 3. Sign Brent Barry, playing w/ Lewis again, Yao and Steve, would be tempting. Or try to get a veteran PG like: Tony Delk, Darrell Armstrong, or guy like Speedy Claxton. Franics-Delk or other PG Barry-Jackson Lewis-Nachbar Harrington-Padgett Yao-Cato or 1. We sign Rasheed Wallace. Figure out a way to use the TE for him. Its all pending the playoffs so its a long call. But a Sheed/Yao tandem would be ridiculous. Have Cat sweet talk Sheed into coming. Sheed would be back in the West where he belongs and it would make us serious contenders. Repeat 2 & 3 from above: Yao-Cato Rasheed-Padgett Lewis-Nachbar Cat-Jackson SF-some backup PG.
I agree, however, that the Charlotte trade doesn't seem to make a lot of sense for the Bobcats. Francis and even Spoon as opposed to Taylor seems like a lot of capspace to use up. If we had a one-year contract they could waive, that would make more sense. Unless the Bobcats want to build a team around Francis, Taylor, and several first-round draft picks, taking on a bad contract too expensive to renounce doesn't make a whole lot of sense.
If any of those trades go through, then it will be time to start the "Lottery 2005" countdown. It's pathetic that such trading atrocities could even be thought of. I can't believe that the Rockets could even consider this trash, unless it's in combination with another roster move to bring a superstar to the team. Unbloodybelievable!
Yes, but something like this might be the only way Charlotte could obtain an all-star. But, even then, I don't think I'd do it. I think we could get more for Francis. We really don't need the salary relief, we need better players that fit.
