"Getting it", Grades and Splitting Batman & Robin Up

We had a rookie at the three (Horry), and a wild man at the two (Maxwell), and a defensive liability at the one (Kenny). And we only had one HOF player on that team; our team now should have two, maybe three.

 

Sane-

Actually the Lakers have the expiring contracts that atl wants for SAR. Horry,Madsen,and Walker all adds up to SAR 11 mil. I just think getting him and shipping of Mobley,Taylor and Griffin would really solidify this team. Francis would be forced to look at the team instead of looking for his buddy. To top it off we would be getting a level headed smart 25 yr old 20pt almost 10 reb pf. just because a guy has been on a crappy team forever doesn't mean he isn't a good player. Look how many times Brand has been in the playoffs and he's a very,very good young player.

 

The question for Doc Rocket and Oeilpierre is:

Is the Rockets management "getting it" that Steve is "not getting it"?

Or do they like the way Steve and Cat play.

 

HOUSTON'S GAME PLAN: Over the years, Rudy Tomjanovich's basketball intelligence has been disrespected by most of his peers. "His teams made few adjustments," says one veteran coach, "and the ones they did make were usually ineffectual. Rudy's offenses were wild and woolly, and his scorers played with almost no restraints. For the most part, this is still the case. The big difference in Rudy, though, is his attitude on the bench. Where he used to be very emotional -- too emotional -- to the point where he'd often embarrass his players, he's now much more detached and he never gets into their faces in public. Even his adjustments are getting better."

Perhaps, but coaches around the league still believe that Yao isn't being utilized properly. "What do they run for him?" asks a veteran assistant. "He sets a pick at the high post, then rolls into the pivot. Or else he'll just set up on the left box. That's about it. Yao simply isn't getting enough touches."

Another assistant blames this shortcoming on the selfishness of Yao's teammates: "Steve Francis, Cuttino Mobley and Moochie Norris are all about pumping up as many shots as possible. I call them the machine gunners. Stevie Franchise, especially, has got to realize that the Rockets aren't going anywhere unless the big guy is more involved in the offense. I think they're going to have to lose before they can win."

 

Winning in the NBA takes a lot of talent and a lot of time. I dont know what many of you were expecting this year considering the state of our team. We are VERY young, our oldest player that gets minutes is Cuttino. Our frontline is a rookie, college sophomore and a newly acquired younger player. Steve is playing his 4th season at the point but first with any weapon not named Cat or Steve. These guys need time to play together and figure out what it is we want to do and how we are going to do that. I think that Yao not being at training camp hurt our progression immensely. During the season there just really isn't a whole lot of time to practice together. We have too many players that are new to this system (actually the whole team is) and need the time to develop. I see our rise as being similar to that of the Kings. A few season's ago they were complete chodes, then they made their statement in the playoffs against the Jazz and have continued to improve since. We need to cut our teeth in the playoffs and then circle the wagons during the offseason and figure out what we are going to do.

 

Is this true? I never remember Rudy getting in a player's face, ever!

 

You just never saw it but it damn sure happened and often.

 

Jeff, from what you have seen, what players got the most heat and what was said? I too never saw this, just curious.

Chris

 

I don't think they are getting. Somebody please tell us whether the decision makers think SF or Cat get it.

 

What's wrong with the high stepping? Does that really affect his game, the teams game, or the outcome of the game?

 

Yes it does. Extremely puzzling to high step when you are down 15 points. Pretty ridiculous when he high steps after his man blows past him making him look like a fool.

 

oeilpere, imo, Cat is closer to "getting it" for his position than Francis is for his. Francis absolutely must get it. Cat merely needs to improve his role position. For instance, Cat is closer to being an Andrew Toney than Francis is to Maurice Cheeks....by a long shot. Cheeks did not need Toney to be Dumars, because Cheeks had Moses to work with. Isiah Thomas needed Dumars. It would be great, but Francis shouldn't need a Dumars.

Moving Cat for a PG is just a disaster, imo. Not in that we are trying to improve via discarding redundancy, but because Francis will suck even more as a 2 if he doesn't "get it. He's short, can't play defense, and all the great 2s will take away that only reliable thing he has beside driving for free throws, and that is his straight-up jumper.

Who here really believes Francis has a chance in hell of getting that simple jumper off against Sprewell, Rose, Kobe, McGrady, Bowen, and countless others tall 2s out there. imo, Francis must stay at the PG position to remain a big offensive threat. I'd trade him before moving him.

As I said to verse in Doc Rockets thread, oeilpere, what makes you think Francis doesn't get worse (fighting with his PG/coaches...becoming disgruntled and pouty) if you force him to the 2 ... unless he already "gets it." And if he already "gets it," then don't move him?

Francis has enormous value. But, if you trade him, what you really need to do is grab some balls and trade him with Griffin for a real (and young) PF and some vet PG. Good luck.

Trading Mobley just delays the real problem that Francis must change before anything works. I've always been an advocate that Mobley trades get only marginal starters in return, and when the problem is as big as your franchise player not running the team well, expecting a marginal player to fix that is an illusory lie to oneself.

btw: I like the Lucas idea, but he is under a big contract. With other coaches, their contracts usually guarantee their money when fired for bad records; however, they must look for a new job and lose out on further money when they find one. If Lucas has such a clause, I doubt he will take an assistant job. Anyhow, Lucas teaches Francis all summer at Westside (right?), and apparently Lucas can't make any head-way, either.

verse:

Why do people keep telling me that announcers are remarking about our PG's ineptness. You think I'm blind. Just because I disagree that an drop it in to Hakeem offense with Yao in an era of zones is for the simple minds and an utter waste of Francis doesn't mean that I haven't seen problems. btw: surely you have seen Nash dribble the clock away when teams take away their early first strikes. Nash can have serious problems getting the ball to Nitwitz. The Dallas half court system (discounting their transition game) is not that much different like the Kings and Nets are.

 

I have posted this on another thread, but I'll re-post here. What we need is an on the court leader. We don't have one. Somebody else asked how would SF and CM be if they would have gotten to play with CB in his last year - answer - a whole lot better. They would have seen first hand how a real player handles clutch situations.

To fix the Rockets we need a leader. There are 2 trades that could answer this need.

Trade 1

EG and Cato for Brand and Piakowski.

why- Brand is a tough low post player that answers are need for a go to guy in the clutch. When our new motion offense isn't clicking (which hasn't been too often) we would have a legit low post scorer to dump it into. From what I have seen of Brand he gets it. Piakowski could feed the low post and give us a good spot up shooter. LAC gets a legit center for when the 7' cry baby Kandi bolts, plus a "potential" star in EG.

Trade 2 (the dream that may not be that far fetched upon analysis)

KG
for
EG, Cato, Mobley, Moochie, Rice, and 2 1st round picks

why - For us the reasons are obvious. We would get what we need, a guy that isn't affraid to step up with the game on the line. He also a team player looking to involve his teammates.
For Minn., they get a true center to go with to Nesterovic to solidify the middle. They get a "potential" star in EG. They get someone to help with the point guard duties in Moochie. Rice comes off the books after next year for cap relief. CM give them an atheletic 2 that is a capable scorer, and it allows them to move Wally to the 3 which is true postion in the NBA. Minnesota screwed themsleves with the Joe Smith deal. My propsal gives them back 2 of the picks they have lost, plus some athletes the build around. They will never be more the first round playoff fodder in their current state. There is no question that EG has a boat load of potential, but how will he develop on our team when he is a best the fourth option relagated to jacking 3s.

Also, I dont feel like Rudy T is the problem. I am sorry but when you are payed an ass load of money it is up to you to come to paly every night. It shouldn't be the coach's job to pump you up. If you need to be pumped up find another line of work. Dr J had a great quote, " I play every game 100% because I know that know matter where I go there is a guy in the stands that saved money to bring his kids to see me play, and I don't want to let him down." Man, if the guys on our team had that attitude you could add 10-15 wins on our win column. I feel like KG and Brand have it, and we need to find a way to get them to help the others understand.

 

We have the talent to be #5 in the West. What we need is someone with a really big mouth. Oakley, Barkley, Jordan... Someone in that mold of determination.


The best solution for Francis is to get us a Pippen to play Point Forward, and shift a portion of the offense to Ming as well next year. That way, he keeps on playing against PG's, and he still does some PG stuff, but gets to focus mroe on scoring without hurting the team.

 

heypee:

the answer is neither (a) nor (b). a dump it in offense would be a waste of both yao's and steve's talents. an offense designed around getting the ball to yao in the low post with consistent weakside and strongside motion is the answer....

that offense also allows francis to get his...no one (least of all me) is suggesting that francis should not touch the ball...only that yao shoud touch it every time down court.

 

Out of the question. We can't trade our #1 pick two years in a row.

 

We should be at least as good as Minny,Phoe,or Utah. Minny has played most of the yr without its 2nd leading scorer and all star. Utah is old as hell and phoe is as young as we are starting a high schooler. That should be at least the low water point. I agree with the idea that mobley is closer to getting or being Toney than Francis is cheeks. If Francis or the team as a whole would cut the to's down to 13, that would give them 3 extra shots on the basket which makes a big difference.

 

If Francis isn't going to get it, as you say HP - fine. Trade him right now, alone, for Brand and Miller. It's not the best deal, and we'd need some more deals to click, but that's a better team for sure, still with only 3 max contracts.

On the other hand, we could also have Ming Brand Francis for redundant parts Griffin and Mobely. This has more starpower and firepower and that extra oompf. But only if Francis gets it.

So ...

Ming Brand Miller

or

Ming Brand Francis

or my repeated third option :

Ming Odom Francis

But you have to choose now. Brand, Miller, Odom all gone soon.
I'd rather try to use that leverage now to barter EG and Cat for a star, because I think I can still trade Francis for value later, if he won't ever get it. He's an Allstar and the other guys aren't. So, for this opportunity - I'd move the other guys now.

 

Ugh. I was just starting to forget that Spurs game. .. and Rudy had even benched Steve in that game! Still, not enough to get the point across, I guess.

I couldn't agree with you more. In fact, I said the exact same thing yesterday- maybe I was a day early.